Rolls

Just got pulled over for doing a huge 2nd gear slide onto south road, basically said they were going to defect the car and that he was 'very creative at finding defects', after going over the entire car and finding it was basically in perfect condition he said 'you are lucky you have a certificate of exemption' regarding my letter from regency for my rb25 swap, fined me $150 for excessive noise with no points and left. so lucky.

sweet will go grab me some of that

good explanation, makes better sense than what I was trying to say.

Yeah technically you really need horsepower x time to work out how fast a vehicle will accelerate, but you assume that the power will be roughly constant so just the horsepower figure is all that is needed, knowing torque alone will not tell you though. There is a reason things like those ET calculators ask for horsepower and not torque.

Yeah there is a LCD module you can buy off ebay that will show knock as well just figured if some software can surely there's others out there that are free.

No need to get aggressive, also how on earth can you expect me to take you seriously when you've essentially gone 'you are wrong, read this one link that is also wrong, but I'm not going to explain why or counter any of your points and explanations'. You are confused, if you increase the torque you also increase the power, that is why it goes faster, you cant increase the torque and keep the power and rpm the same, it cant be done. My point was torque alone does not explain how fast something accelerates, power can assuming gearing is the same. See example above why torque doesnt = acceleration and power does. if what you said was true then the 600hp car would accelerate the same as the 150hp one, everyone here knows that isn't the case.

and that is where you are completely wrong, the car making the greater power will go faster, simple reason being is it is doing more work. The fact that you did not address any of my examples makes me wonder why I am bothering. I can exagerate the example further if you want and make the skyline rev to 20,000rpm and continue to make 320nm at that 20,000rpm, it is now making 670hp and you honestly think they will accelerate the same?

If you can't explain why I am wrong and counter my many many examples then I'm just going to take it as you don't understand it like 99% of people in the world. edit: I just skim read that article and it is blatantly wrong. here is where he gets it totally wrong It is the change in acceleration (acceleration of the acceleration) that you feel as a punch, not torque. Example if an electric motor, it makes the same power at all revs and hence has zero punch, it doesn't feel 'torquey' though. You can see where he gets confused by providing an completely opposite example of what he said above here

This just shows a complete misunderstanding of how torque and power work. I will explain it in very simple terms. Power essentially = how much work you can do in 1 second. Torque = is the force you are applying at that instant * distance, being as distance is constant just think of it as the instantaneous force. This is a bit of an inexact analogy, but it works for our purposes. Think of it this way, I can throw a 1kg object instantaneously, this is torque. But I can throw 20 of these 1kg objects every second, this is power. I can move 20kg every second, this is my acceleration. Now I increase my torque 10x and I can throw a 10kg object now but I can now only throw 1 of them every second, my power has dropped by 20x now I can only move 10kg every second, whilst my torque has increased 10x my acceleration has dropped by a factor of 2. Notice how power and acceleration are directly related however torque and acceleration are not? Another way to look at it is the instantaneous force is the power of the cylinder explosion (this isn't true but it works for the analogy), the amount of power is this force x how many explosions we get every second. So you can see that even if we drastically drop the power of the explosion if we increase the number of them enough (rpm) then we make far more overall force and hence accelerate faster. Hence torque is not how fast we accelerate, torque x rpm = power is how fast we accelerate. yes and it is quite obviously wrong. edit: If my great example somehow hasn't convinced you read one of the many explanations on google http://www.w8ji.com/rotating_mass_acceleration.htm

It is either that or the boost controller is not bleeding enough pressure to let the flap shut as much as required, being as you have tweaked the boost controller settings I would say it is the former.

400nm @ 2000rpm = 83kw 400nm @ 6000rpm = 250kw, the second engine will absolutely BLITZ the first one in every single way, it simply will not be faster, sure maybe at the low revs but that was not my point and but you had to do the calculation to know this, if they had simply stated the power down low it would be much simpler to work out what is going on. Power tells you how fast you accelerate, torque does not, as far as 99% of people are concerned you never need to know the torque figure, you just need to know the power spread (which is indicative of the torque spread). Even if you only make 200nm @ 6000rpm (125kw) it will be faster than the vehicle making 400nm @ 2000rpm, this is why torque figures are confusing and very hard to really get any meaningful value out of them. The reason you seem to think torque is important is you are used to seeing big torque numbers associated with engines that make lots of power down low, then they fall over up top and vice versa however this is not always the case, and in the examples where it is not the case the assumption that big torque numbers down low will mean a faster car is wrong (see above example). This is why all you need to know is power spread as this tells the entire story. Either way more torque means more power, so if torque is more important then it infers power is just as important, hence why I don't agree with your statement. Note everything I said above was assuming gearing was the same, yes you can make up for lack of power by changing the gearing, however this results in top speed falling over very quickly, examples are trucks that make bugger all power but seem to accelerate fine, however with their low gearing they will almost never see above 100kph, if you were to apply the low gearing to a similar car making more power it would absolutely blitz the equivalently geared vehicle making less power and more torque. Just look what happens when you put a 4.4 or greater diff ratio in a skyline, not only is it stupidly fast it will also tow anything you want with ease. there is a multiplication to calculate power and that is what you need to know to work out acceleration as 100kw will always accelerate the same as 100kw no matter the rpm, 100nm however can result in WILDY different accelerations depending on the revs.

You do realise if you welded the gate shut you could quite easily run 50psi all the way to redline if you really wanted? Knowing that it is just a matter of proper gate control to run any boost you want to redline, simply bleeding off the pressure line and increasing spring pressure is not enough though, need fancy tricks to get there. However if you do need fancy tricks it says that the backpressure is very very high and you should probably be going to a bigger housing.

that just comes down to them not knowing diff ratio/gear ratio/exact tyre size and deformation etc, if they plugged all the correct numbers into the vehicle they would be able to figure it out better, most the time they dont bother which is why you get readings of 1200nm with 100kw. Also why a lot of places tune in kph not rpm as it means they don't have to plug all those numbers in.

Of course it is important, if you only make 5kw at 1300rpm then you won't go anywhere. Power implies that torque is being made, if it wasn't then it wouldn't make the power! My point is torque is far more confusing for the average joe (look at this thread lol) so power gives a more meaningful number to the person You are talking as if torque and power are two completely different things, they aren't they are directly related, however talking NM is confusing as you need to multiply it by rpm to figure out what the actual power will be at the wheels. Look at this for example, lets say you are making 100kw down low at 2000rpm, everyone in the world knows that means it will be great for towing and moving heavy cars, if you say it makes 400nm down low well how much power is that, does anyone even know without using a calculator? And just to show how misleading it is, what if you make 800nm at 100rpm, sounds impressive but it translates to bugger all power and it wont actually be good for towing or accelerating. Just to prove my point further tell me does 400nm at 2000rpm mean a car will accelerate (or tow) better than a car that makes 100kw at 2000rpm? No calculators I want to know if you can actually tell the difference, because if you can't then it is just a useless figure. and that just goes to show how dumb the average person is that they are selling cars to, the 400nm doesn't mean anything to the average person, it is just a big number, at least you can translate 100kw to how fast it actually will be.

The engine makes 100kw at 1500rpm and increases linearly to 225kw by 7000rpm... no more a mouthful than quoting torque and power, not to mention that everyone knows what power feels like. I actually think that almost no one knows that 400Nm feels like or is, the figures are always quoted at different rpm (different engines and cars) so the figure soon becomes without meaning, it could mean 100kw or it could mean 500kw depending on where it is. Honestly I think quoting torque is nothing more than a very confusing marketing ploy.

sent an email off, hopefully they are willing to do it or know someone who will do a tune with the level of care and detail I want. cheers for the info =)

Who and where is Pete?

Yeah nistune shows it but the demo only runs for 2 minutes which makes it pretty useless, dont feel like buying a license just for that single use. Oscilloscope isn't really an option being as all of mine are AC powered and cant easily log when Im driving. Elite Racing I am in SA and I don't really have enough trust in any of the Tuners here to not look at knock and make sure they've done it properly. Can you recommend anyone that you would let tune your car and then drive it without checking they have done it properly? I need to find a tuner that I can trust to do it properly.

It'll shit it self until you get a tune, changing that much stuff from standard and the ecu always has a spaz and goes into the super rich super retarded part of the map

Unless you did all that work yourself that must have cost a fair bit! almost as much as a new turbo!

Sounds like the gate is blowing open, is it internally gated or externally?

I have ECUTalk which will show me every single damn variable but knock, does anyone else know of any free software that will show knock and let me log it vs load/rpm/airflow like ecutalk does? Much appreciated thanks.

yeah it isnt exactly going to happen lol, maybe in the US cause they can sue for coffee being too hot but not here lol

Print out the ADRs and then draw a scaled down drawing of your wing, it'll take you 5 minutes and will go a long way to convincing any traffic sergeants at the police station, good work looking it up though, I would do the same, ring every bloody cop station in Adelaide until someone removes it for you.

It would be a hell of a lot simpler to just say it has x kw by 1300rpm, saying it has 400nm between 1300 and 5200rpm doesn't mean anything, no one is going to get their calculator out and figure out how much power that is. They should just quote power spread, anything else is pretty much useless information to the customer.