tommis85

...also, there's the EBC....wondering if I should just putter around some more and get that as well before tuning

ASAP mate. Right now I've been ganny-ing around with front prop shaft removed because tuning mob killed the front diff (somehow). Hope to have it in soon and then it's off for a tune once more

Haha I see...yes, I think we're going to go down that path I'm not gonna wind on any more pre-load for now....I need to see where this thing boosts to now without bleeding anything off (bleed valve is closed, may as well take it out). I reckon the 10mm on mine will make it boost to exactly 18 pounds or so - if it goes over, I'll have to wind some preload off ....ultimately I'll have to maybe wind some off again anyway so EBC can do some controlling up there as per XKLABA's recommendations.

There appears to be different understandings of response here.... 1. The initial time it takes the turbos to spool up from idle speed during take off, and, 2. The time / delay for max boost to be achieved when you're in the turbo's working rpm band, above say 4000 etc. Eg, when you're on the track, holding 4500 around a corner and then power back up for the exit.....example 2.....you're at 4.5k, you put flat down, how long does it take to make full boost = level of responsiveness. What we "should" be talking about in this thread is No.1....how long it takes for the turbo to get everything going hard from idle rpm. I guess it shouldn't reeeeealy be called "response" just by itself...maybe initial spool up time would be a better way of putting it :P And yes, big singles can be very "responsive" up top when there're plenty of fumes going round....but I don't think you can beat the responsiveness of small twins or the stockers. When you're up it they on max in a split second - awesome on the windy roads

Yep I've been checking them out...there're also some newies on ebay for $220-370. They look easy enough to install too which is great!

Hypergear, thanks for your comments....however, I have been assured numerous times that I'll be able to make the 2860-9's come on hard down low. There's a thread on here that displays what they're capable off so I'm not going to adjust the geometry of the turbos just yet. If all goes pear shaped and I don't end up happy with the end results (for some reason) I'll probably just step down a (small) notch to -7's which were my original choice till I saw how good the -9's go. However, I don't want to go there right now as I want to give these -9's a decent chance to impress! 1 bar by 4k is good...I'd be happy with that

Yeh mate I bought these two turbos brand new from a trader on here by the name of Boostn Imports. He matched the price of the local shops in town and also threw in some gasket and stud kits. As for the actuators....I carefully checked both of them with a pump and gauge. Footpump to be precise because then you can hold the pressure wherever you want to etc. I made sure both of them open identically etc. They "appear" to be working alright with the extra preload but cannot put too much on because they'll just overboost then. Yep, the whole situation is screaming.....EBC!!! However, I need to check them out first (hopefully it won't take me 3 months like with the -7 vs -9's ) and now MAC valves have been thrown into the mix too.

Hey, that sounds alright. I had a quick look and there are a fair few on ebay. Will just have to check out how many people have used them and what sort of results they have been getting. But yes, the idea would be to let the E11 control it if possible rather than having a second little computer module for just boost control.

Yeh the more I think about how it all works the more I'm realising that I will need a EBC. Guess I should start looking around for one eh? It would be nice to make at least a nice solid bar by 4000...that should equate to some good streetability for everything below 4000.....and fun times above 4000 I wonder if the Haltech solenoid is any good? (I've got a E11)

That is the idea mate...was thinking Godzilla Motorsport. He only does tuning now...nothing else. One would assume he knows what he's doing and I've had him recommended to me a couple times now Anyone want to make some donations to the cause?

Don, Levinboy, Hey nah mine aren't quite as chunky as those. Mine are the ones that "apparantly" come with the -9's...they're definitely firmer than the 1 bar ones I bought for my N1 turbos. I dare say that somewhere along the line the springs do hold 16psi but I know for a fact that even the strongest actuators (under 20psi) will crack down low....ie, they will budge a little. Yeh I do have cam gears installed by the tuner wasn't able to make them make positive numbers. He told me he was very quickly making negative figures so I believe they're dialed in very close to zero on intake and exhaust. But then it also didn't occur to my tuner to add more tension to the rods. It would appear to me, that they only knew how to work the efpos machine! ....can you tell I'm still very bitter about it all?? Yup, I'm hoping that a re-tune and dialed in camgears will move the whole show forward by about another 500rpm. I've already gained about 1000rpm by tightening the act's....now it's the tuner's turn! Unfortunately I don't have an EBC yet. Don, I think I have about 10mm now...the outer end of the actuator just touched the boss that the flapper shaft/spindle passes thru. You'll see what I mean when you check yours

Don, further to that - yeh my invoice said 15.something pound acts but hey u never know, may have to check the serial number. I wonder how people make 16 pounds by 3800-4000 with these 9's

Ah ok so you'd probably have the same kinda basic mods as me? They seem to ramp up very sharply after 4000rpm. What are you gonna do at your end to make them spool up a bit more than 13psi by 4k? Personally it's a bit too laggy...this feels like a big single lol, not twins I suppose I could try adding some more preload...it's just that if I add too much it may spike over the max boost of 18-19 pounds that I want to run

^^ I'm going to try to do something similar. I'll see if I can get the preload just right to hold something like say, 16 pounds and then maybe bleed off the final couple pounds. Not sure how it will turn out...it will no doubt be a compromise between actuator resistance, rod length and bleed valve

Haha yeh

Yeh you're right about that - otherwise it's a bit of a balancing etc and I'm thinking that ultimately you will lose out on a bit of response again. I'll see how it goes....but I do see myself getting an EBC and stronger actuators....more $$$

*with 16psi already bearing on the piston (as proven by pumping actuators with foot pump) epic typo

Makes you wonder how the rate an actuator at whatever it is. Like, where in the actuator rod's travel to they rate the 16 pounds? Obviously a 16 pound actuator doesn't have 16 pounds when it's in it's "home" position....it builds it up somewhere along the line as the spring gets compressed further and further. Ie. the spring doesn't get installed into the actuator canister with already bearing on the piston (as proven by pumping actuators with foot pump) Maybe they mean that when you make the actuator rod as short as possible and then put it onto the wastegate flapper lever it will then have an immediate 16psi pull on that lever

Ah crap I forgot to update you guys with how I went! Ended up getting a better cat put in along with straightening one portion of the exhaust out a bit to get rid of an unnecessary bend. That kinda improved things a little bit. But, the biggest improvement came when I played around with the actuators. The first thing I did was run the car without vacuum lines attached to the act's which yielded a small improvment....however it was when I ran a thin wire to each waste gate flapper lever to stop them from moving altogether that I noticed the biggest difference! So, confident that it's the actuators, I added a load of pre-load to the actuators (about 10mm) to ensure that they're firmly shut and I seem to start to make some solid boost by 3500 onwards - but not 16psi by 4000 like some claim on here. I seem to reach about 12-13psi by 4000. I also did some testing with a normal footpump+gauge hooked up to the actuator lines. The 16psi actuators will crack by as little as 5psi and are already open by about a quarter by 10psi! With the 10mm of pre-load they now stay firmly shut till about 12psi where they then start to budge. By around 16-17psi they're open. I am yet to tweak it all and get it back on the dyno. With any luck I'll be able to get some more pounds by 4000 with a re-tune. I'm also suspecting that I maaaaay have to wind some of the pre-load off as I'm thinking they may overboost

Haha they'd probably try to defect you for having too many turbos Lucky you pulled up in time lol....not that you have anything to worry about eh? Yeh well as far as driving goes we have nothing to worry about. We drive around like grannies lol...and I have people that will vouch for me and my slowness haha! Maybe I should change my name on here to Captain Slow As always it's a select few that ruin it for us all. In my area there're a couple fellas that never drive anywhere normally - always flat-footing it. I guess the attitude the fuzz adopt is guilt by association, ie, own a Skyline / JDM import and you're a hoon/terrorist which makes it quite hard for the rest of us who're trying to repair the poor image that ACA has given us lol

The truth is that I actually don't have much to hide at all. The 5-oh would get bored with my car and there're much bigger fish to fry here in woomba. I simply don't LIKE cops. I don't want to see them. I don't want them harassing me and touching my car. Simply put, I am disgusted by the cops in this country and I try to avoid confrontations with them. The cops around here have done a very great job at ruining one of the very few things that young guys can do in this f*khole of a town.

Just sell it Chris

Why so paranoid?

You gotta also remember that the actuators will crack at a certain value and then gradually open no matter how much preload you set. All you do with preload is move the whole thing up into higher boost area. If you had too much preload on a certain actuator it will make the crack-to-open transition a very rough one. I've talked to peeps in the know about this and have also seen dyno plots showing the roughness up top.

I think that in the end you want to have actuators that are close to your target level, that have a big can and piston on them for finer tuning....and, that are fed with an EBC ;-)