Turboterrorist

I'm looking at buying a car that was imported in 1997. It's never been registered in Australia before, but is not a race/rally import and can be registered. I'm trying to find out what I will need to get it registered? My understanding is that the rules are different having landed pre-2001. I'm pretty sure it doesn't need to go through RAWS -> does it need a VASS certificate (I'll be registering it in Victoria)? The car is unmodified and in decent condition; has had a roadworthy inspection and only needs new tyres for that.

If you're talking about understeer in a RWD, that's a bit different. RWDs, especially those with heavy engines up front, often understeer, particularly on higher speed bends. Very scary! Need quick reactions to grab it as the rear wheels are still pushing. You don't have this problem in a FWD. Of course there are RWDs that are very tame, like a 318 BMW, and FWDs that are quite tricky, like some French hot hatches, but the RWD equivalent (i.e. an S15) is even less idiot proof, and the 318 equivalent maybe a Corrola, more so. I am not an active NS member for the record! But I have had my share of experience with those things, and I wouldn't recommend them to anyone as a first car. Turbo or non-turbo makes little difference, the danger of those cars to the inexperienced is inherent - this I think highlights the lack of thought going into restrictions for P-platers. And on what you said about it not being a problem years ago? The number of single vehicle accidents vs the population is decreasing. On top of that, old RWD barges (i.e. XB Falcon sedans) without 800HP small blocks tend to understeer at higher speed - I leant to drive in these sort of cars. As I said, RWD x understeer is worse than FWD. No one disagrees with this. But the reality is, there will always be gease behind the wheel of cars, more so in their first few years of driving. The question 60 Minutes is asking is how can we minimise the resulting problems? The point of targeting specific cars is to try to idiot proof it as much as possible. You're still never going to completely get rid of people falling asleep at the wheel etc., but having 18yos hooning in Ford Focuses rather than Falcons will at least save SOME lives. Obviously exceptions will need to be made (i.e. vans, SUVs, and perhaps more idiot proof 4WDs and RWDs like a Mercedes C200 etc.).

How do you come to that conclusion? RWD is more fun because you have to do more to keep it under control (i.e. it's more dangerous). It's pretty undisputable that FWD is the safest for the panicy, clueless beginner. Understeer is much safer for the novice driver - most modern cars have an understeer tendancy because of this, even newer RWDs. When a car oversteers, you have to be very precise to get it back under control without eating up too much space. When the novice loses control, the last thing they do is stay calm. In a RWD they hit the brakes or overcorrect which ends up with someone's door hitting a tree. With a front wheel drive, not only is it harder to upset the car's balance in a corner, but when you do, the result is rarely as dramatic and there's less you can do wrong. Rear ends tend to let go fairly suddenly, especially when not driven correctly, whereas front ends tend to surrender to physics more slowly. For those with more experience, RWD can be quite safe as it's quite predictable, but we're not talking about Lewis Hamilton here Edit: I'm by no means saying you can't wreck say a Civic Type R for example, but it's not as easy to do as an S15 or something.

FWDs for all P-platers: Obviously FWD being more hairdresser than an MX5, people won't like it, but FWDs are so much easier to drive fast and more or less eliminate the problem of too much power being to blame. So then, governments will be forced to move on and attack something else because it won't be the car's fault. I say 'easier to drive fast,' because young folks will always want to enjoy their machine no matter what. Government needs to embrace this and work with it rather than attack it. The next step is off-street facilities. I also think a Modified Car Scheme similar to the Club Permit scheme would seperate the enthusiasts from the joyriders. So you could get a modified car registered to be driven 90 days a year between 7am and 7pm like club plates. Those of us who just like cruising once in a while in our projects can do so, and cops can get tougher on mods for full-reg cars/dailys. It also takes away the issue of noisey cars at night which I think is the main reason people hate 'hoons.' Ideally under the scheme as long as the car had operating lights/indicators, seatbelts/harnesses, was of a ride-height that won't destroy the roads, and were not as loud as an F1, they should be ok.

I get that it doesn't certify the mod interstate, but doesn't it certify that the mod complies with the national design rules? So the VASS folks should be able to pass it as ADR compliant also? What I want to know is, does that mod plate mean the engine is ADR compliant? The slip says it complies with the applicable ADRs, which is just LO1 on the slip. So, does that mean it meets Australian Design Rules, and thus still meets them when moved to Victoria (thus meaning I don't need to modify the engine for VASS)? I'll ring a VASS guy tomorrow, but I assume they'll say they need to see the car and $750 before they'll even tell me. It'd just be good to know before I buy the car which I'll probably do anyway.

I know this is not the best forum to ask this, but it beats joining calaisturbo... I'm looking at buying an old 'vette (1980) from QLD. It's never been registered in Australia before, so I need to get a VASS cert when it gets to Vic. It has had a 350 V8 crate motor put in, the original engine is a 350, but the crate motor is much stronger/less emissions control crap. It has a QLD mod-plate/certificate for the swap (done in December so it's a recent cert). So, the way I understand it, that means it's ADR compliant right? So it shouldn't prevent it from passing VASS in Victoria?

What's the gearbox? It's not the same as the S13 is it? My 200SX has an S13 gearbox swapped in and is handling 210rwkw. I'd be hoping to get the GTiR up to that eventually. I'll either be looking for one with as many mods as possible, or stock with low Ks and prime condition. Depends what comes up over the next little while. Some none too bad examples in the stock/light mods + low Ks option now.

Yeah, I mean defect issues for a hole cut in the battery tray for intercooler piping. It's basically the worst defect you can get for an S15 - have to get an engineer's certificate to clear it in Victoria which is bull****. What I want to know is does the GTiR have the same issue? Is there any other pain in the ass defect like that specific to GTiRs I should take note of before buying one? Does cutting holes in the car even matter on something that old? I've tried to find out before if S13s have the same issue as S14/S15s (hole in the battery tray = VASS cert required) and couldn't get an answer. Anyone here know? I'm still considering an S13, but it'll probably be a GTiR. I know the old gotta pay to play mantra. But if I can get pulled over without having to worry, it'd be good I'm coming from a 200SX now by the way. It's great, I'm just after something with a bit less road manners, and something that can live outside as I have bought an old Camaro which is taking the garage space now.

I'm thinking of buy a cheap GTiR for a project car. I'm going for a road going go-kart type deal, so no carpet, coilovers and light engine mods to begin with. Nothing too expensive except maybe a crash cage later on. I'm not concerned with it being the fastest vehicle around, just want it to be fun, novice-level difficulty to work on and cheap to run/relatively reliable. I'm also considering 180SXs and MR2 GTs, but I'm thinking the GTiR might be better from a cop-bait point of view. Obviously, they can't accuse me of doing a donut, burnout or drift in the 4WD and they generally don't stick out like a modded 180 does. Cheap R32 GTRs are getting down to $10k if I'm gonna splash out, but again with the cops issue, and they might not have the go-kart feel quite like a stripped out GTiR. What are the usual defect issues with them in Victoria? Do they suffer from the hole in the battery tray issues like a Silvia? Any such achiles heal in terms of defects?

I always thought that it came from them being powered by rice warmer engines. Anyway, I think rice is a style. I don't think that being fast excludes Skylines etc. from being ricers. Even stock. I think these days rice extends to everything 'tuner' except muscle cars because they have their own category. But even some of them are becoming ricey with massive sound systems and 22" chrome wheels etc. (hardly the grey coated torque thrusts they should have). I've heard European ricers called tators (Potato). I think a stock car can be a ricer though. Especially if it's sport version of a regular car like the Cobalt SS and Neon SRT4 above. They're definately designed for the ricer market too.

http://www.justauto.com.au/justcars/know/news/e8c10b0e-4529-4d30-aeb5-b6e916d4a122 This article suggests that if a car club in Victoria accepts a LHD vehicle as a 'classic,' then it can be given club rego and that the 25 year 'rule' is merely a guide. Any thoughts on this? I know that most of the LHD current model Camaros are engineering mules but this guy claims some actualy have Victorian Club Permits. Also, I saw an Alfa Romeo 8C convertible, LHD, in Brighton a few weeks ago (yes, 100% sure that's what it was...). Didn't appear to have any plates but it got me thinking (obviously it's not here for engineering purposes because they're not planning to make that many). Anywho, another question, why I got onto this is because I was looking at the mid 80s, $7,000 C4 Corvettes in America. I know you can get club plates for over 25 year old LHDs and full rego for over 30s. I also know that you cannot bring a new car into Australia and let it age until 30 and then get full rego. But, I want to know if you get club rego on a 25 year old car whether you can then graduate to full rego in 5 years time.

Lol, definately. The Cobalt turbo makes 260HP though. Can any non-Japanese car be a ricer from the factory? I think these are.

Do you think actually being fast means something is not a ricer? That would mean a 400hp Silvia is not a ricer. I disagree. The main reason I think Cobalts and Neons are ricers...

Yup

Trying to settle a debate. Need public opinion.

I did. Have read that document a hundred times and it doesn't have the answers I'm looking for. I have two pre-76 cars I'm planning on modifying. That document only goes back to '76. It'd be good to know what is legal before I go doing engine swaps and other, obvious to spot mods.

Just make a claim to Lumley's Insurance, whoever you're with. God came to me when I was hiking on a mountain and said that Lumley's had to pay out your insurance claims. They know he exists so they will believe you. He also demanded agreed value, choice of repairer and lifetime no-claim bonuses for you all.

Does anyone know when all the rule changes occured (years)? i.e. the rules changed in 1989, and there are different rules for pre-1949 cars. I've read already on this thread that 1983 is another year. What are the rest? Also, what are the restrictions? What can you do to a 240Z that you can't do to a 300ZX (just an example)?

S14 is more or less the same to drive and has more head room and boot space. Way more head room in the back. I'm 6' and I can sit up strait in the back. You're sacrificing looks for comfort really; make a decision. The 180SX is kinda in between the two in terms of room; never tried an S13 Silvia. The S14 feels like it has a lower seating position than the S15 so I reckon you may be able to lower the S15 seat a little, even if you take the rails out and bolt it to the floor?

^^ I'd be pretty confident you wouldn't need an engineer's certificate to put a GTT RB25DET into a GT. Surely it would be exactly the same as putting a 2JZGTE into an N/A Supra which I'm very confident does not require engineering. Now that you remind me, the GTT and GTR are rated with the same factory power aren't they? What a joke. I'm starting to think that this just may be possible. Even just sticking a standard RB26DETT into a GTT would make it quite a bit quicker. You know, why don't I just ask Vicroads? I think I'll do that... derrrr.

I stand corrected on facts but my sentiment that the RB20 is a dud compared to the alternatives remains!

Engineer's certs don't really do all that much (at least in Victoria). Only last 30 days and a stubborn cop will just tell you you've added stuff after the cert was issued and then you have to go get another one (probably a good few grand on a full build too). Just thought if it was legal, you wouldn't need a cert to say it was 'factory' and thus save a lot of hassle. If I'm going to go through the hassle of engineering I think I'll do a piston RX7 like they do in the States; maybe RB. Still can't find mention of a 400R in Aus.

Not on Ps, why would a P-plater even think of trying to get away with that? Be pretty short sighted... I'm looking to do a project over the next couple of years. Just considering my options. I'm planning on buying and building an engine, then sticking it in something. If it isn't street legal then I'll just get away with it until I get defected and then retire the car to club rego methinks. Be nice if it were fully street legal though... According to Vicroads, you can swap an engine without a compliance plate/engineer's tick if it was also offered by the manufactuer for that car as well as any other parts that were also offered. I know the Supra guys fit turbo engines to their N/As all the time and no offical paperwork required. Maybe I worded my question poorly; if the GTT and GTR Z-tune are considered as varients of the same car, then it WOULD be legal. I'm sure it'd be legal on a GTR 'cause they'd have to be considered a varient of the same model. Does anyone know if the GTT and GTR are considered varients of the same model by public servants? Also, anyone know if there are any genuine Nismo 400Rs complied in Aus? Would be another possibility if there are.

Biggest plusses with the oldies is 1; you pretty much get a money back guarantee when you sell. 2, they look cooler. 3, they are cooler. 4, you can mod them without hassle from the cops who often let murderers go when they escape in 1st Gens and to them your exhaust should be even louder. Also, the older motors are still tougher than the alloy LS3 crap and you can get massive horsepower for ten cents not to mention torque coming out your arse and low down; LSs are chipped for economy so no low end power by comparison. Coupled with a car that's a good 300kg lighter (those oldies weigh not much more than an old GTR); I've only driven the new 'stang but I'd be very confident with some mods to the steering rack and power steering the original would be ten times the fun (that's what it's all about). And for $140K, why would you go for a Camaro over a Vette? You could even find a Plymouth Superbird in the States for that if you're a real poser!

A buddy of mine used to import and convert Corvettes. You'd be looking at $30-40k on the RHD conversion alone. The cost of conversion/compliance is also added to the vehicle cost when you register so you have to pay luxury car tax on it. Not the same as a 1960s, bicycle chain under the dashboard job. They're being made here I'm pretty sure, might be cheaper if you could convince Holden to take one off the production line for you half finished and start from there. Also you mightn't have to pay luxury car tax when you buy it as it's technically not a car yet... Willl have to pay if building it costs more than whatever the limit is when you do come to register it though. Cheaper idea, join a car club and get a race/rally only import on club plates, drive it once a month or on tarmac rallies. PS; ^ it's quite a lot of work to convert these modern things. You gotta take the entire front end off, engine out, so you can squat down in front of the firewall to cut and weald the new steering column holes. Then, obviously, you gotta reasemble the entire business end of the car. Actually takes quite a long time.