discopotato03

Lancers are a very different beast being an inline 4 , they are a lot easier to package an external gate into than a twin parallel turbo inline 6 . Actually there are some really good twin scroll twin integral gate turbos available for 4G63's - but thats another story . IMO you would go backwards with one wastegate controlling two turbos because you lose the pulse seperation effect of two turbos on their own individual exhaust manifolds . Once you link them together you may as well have a 6 into 1 manifold and a single scroll single turbo . You call but I would have effective twins on an RB26 and call it a day . Sounds can be emotive but I'll take function over flamboyance every time . A .

I already own a TE and the people who I follow like the PFC so the path is drawn . If the Datalogit box can log inpit from the TE and talk to the laptop via their serial/USB cable then thats way to go I think . Should be able to go with a reasonably modern lap top that would do other things better than a P3 era thing . I've been looking into Toshiba lap tops - along the lines of a Core 2 Duo 2.1 (8100) with the 800 FSB and 2G of ram . Its needs Wi Fi and Gigabyte LAN 10/100/1000 would be nice . Vista can viss off as I already have SP3 XP to load . Not chained to Toshiba but have been told to avoid Compac and I think Acer . Gotta run again , cheers A .

Have PM'd t01-100 so the jaffas should be rolling soon . Next question is can Tech Edge wide band 02 boxes be plugged directly to the Datalogit box and the combied data streams be logged by the laptop or PC through one cable . Thanks for any/all input , cheers Adrian .

Sorry to be difficult but I want to buy a more modern lap top to do more than just run Datalogit and Tech Edge software . I thought someone may have used a serial port PCMCIA/Card bus adapter card to get the right interface . With the Datalogit box I gather it has USB and serial sockets on it . I'll have to research those serial adapter cards and fingers crossed they'll work . Cheers A .

Hi all , just about time to buy the Datalogit kit for my PFC equipt R33 GTS25T . I tried to enquire throug JEM but it doesn't sound like they sell it here . Does anyone here in NSW (Syd ?) sell it or do I have to order direct from NZ ? Also up for a lap top computer and am curious to know if both XP and Pista can run the software - not that I want Vista but would be handy to know . Back to the lap tops for a sec , most late ones don't have serial ports (9 pin D RS232) so I guess that means that if you need a serial port you have to buy a card bus serial adapter card . The reason I'm asking this is because I believe the Datalogit kit can be had in serial cable or USB cable form . People tell me that not just any old USB cable will do as the system wants to dummy spit and not communicate with the lap top . Datalogit obviously supplies the specialised USB cable if ordered in that form . My aim is to be able to log from the Datalogit and a Tech Edge WB3A2 (WB 02) so that the actual running conditions and AFR can be compared and tweaked . I know it's all doable but not sure which way to go for the simplist most reliable interface - serial or USB . Is the Datelogit kit the same but just supplied with one or the other cable ? Cheers A .

Not to steal SK's fire but I try to work compressor capacity around desired power output - which can be measured in pounds (or g/Kg) of air mass per minute . The general rule of thumb is that it takes 11 pounds mass of air to make 100 horsepower so if you look on a common compressor map like say a GT3037/GT3076R 56 trim the compressor wheel speed lines fall away at ~ 50-55 lbs/min airflow . A common fopar people sometimes make is trying to use compressors that are too big and turbines/housings that are a bit small . They also try to find a map that will supply the correct amount of air to make the desired power - but right in the middle of the map at the area of highest compressor efficiency . By that I mean efficiency as in the least heat increase or density drop area/island . I always though you'd want to have the area of highest compressor efficiency in the airflow range that the engine made its peak torque because this is where the engine is at maximum load and the lowest possible inlet charge temperarure would help with detonation suppression . Gotta run , cheers A .

Briefly you can get some of the same cartridges or center sections used by HKS in their "GT2835" turbos . These use a cropped or ground down in size Garrett GT30 turbine , but only HKS had proper turbine housings made for the cropped turbine . The versions Garrett market use the wrong family of turbine housing (GT28 rather than GT30) and not surprisingly the results are very ordinary . HKS use an older turbo number description system and parts of it are just plain wrong . 1) There is NOTHING GT28 about the turbine in a "GT2835" 2) The "35" bit means GT35 series 71mm compressor wheel . The current Garrett numbering system describes a "GT2835" as a GT3071R , GT30 meaning GT30 series turbine and 71 meaning 71mm compressor . The later system doesn't differentiate between cropped or std GT30 turbines , it assumes the buyer knows which one they want and order it by part number . A VERY important thing to note is that Garrett don't make a T3 flanged turbine housing for the cropped GT30 turbine , technically only HKS have them on their GT2835 Pro S RB20/25 bolt on turbos . If you could find one of their turbine housings you could fit it to a Garrett marketed version but it's not the same because HKS's compressor housing is different as well - designed to work together as a complete package . Bottom line , HKS designs engine specific turbo options where Garrett markets generic units . Cheers A .

Something I forgot to mention was that generally Ball Bearing type "GT28" style turbine housings have six holes and bolts to clamp the crab plates onto the turbos center section (bearing housing) . From what I can see yours has four and that sometimes means it's of a bush bearing type turbocharger , they possibly interchange so that could be one answer . I'll have to look into the old TA/TB34 series turbos to see if they used that housing . A .

Interesting that it has a "Garrett" housing on it - and you mentioned 0.67 A/R . Can you double check it to be absolutely certain it doesn't say 64 or 0.64 because Garretts usual T25/28 flanged GT28 housings are normally 0.64 A/R ratio . Me wonders if the later HKS branded turbine housings were also 0.67 A/R because that would explain partly why some HKS spec turbos ie GT2530/GT2535/GTRS(GT2871R 52T) make slightly more power than even a very close spec Garrett market turbocharger . I remember seeing a bush bearing turbo at Turbologic some years ago that used I think the same turbine and it had a "T3" flanged Garrett housing on it . Have to look closer into this as it may have the same turbine housing as that early HKS one in your pics . If this is the case we may have stumbled upon the critical thing that allows us to mount GT28BB Garrett marketed turbos on RB engines and save a few bucks over expensive HKS units . If there are any part numbers cast into that turbine housing of yours can you let me know and I'll chase it up . Cheers A .

I thought I'd crunch some numbers about RB25DET injectors and larger direct fit replacements to put y'all in the picture . Std - 370cc , S15 T manual - 450cc , Nizmo 555 and 740cc . If you divide the std 370 by 450 555 and 740 you get 0.82 , 0.66 , 0.50 . So I guess this means the S15 Terracotta coloured ones are ~ 18% larger , 555's are 33% larger , 740's are 50% larger . I ended up buying new Nismo 555's from a member here which I reckon would be fine for my power requirements using PULP , trouble is if you ever decide to use high ethanol fuel blends such as E85 (if it becomes readily available) you need injectors approx 33% larger than you would with PULP to maintain chemically correct AFR's for E85 . Where that leaves me is line ball (555's vs 370's and PULP vs E85) so in hindsight if I knew then what I know now I would have bought Nismo 740cc injectors . Nismoid uses/used 740cc Nismo's I believe in an RB25 and had no issues at idle or light loads - on PULP ? Cheers A .

Jury out but I'm highly suspicious of stainless direct replacement exhaust manifolds for RB20/25 , I think the factory did a good job on the std iron lump and it's not nearly as bad as many would like to think . It's not a competition std manifold but is was designed by people who have the smarts . I reckon I'd smooth up the std one and refit it for trial purposes . Again (IMO only) I think I would have opted for the 0.87 A/R ProS turbine housing mainly because HKS go to the trouble of trying to make their spec turbos responsive , things like the nicely designed turbine housing and the port shrouded comp cover . A .

Interesting , it looks to me like they ARE Garrett turbos - or cartridges anyway . How they look to me . 1) 60mm 55T compressor , probably same cartridge as GT2530 but with 55 rather than 63 trim compressor wheel . 2) 60mm 60T compressor , as above but 60T - possibly same cartridges as used in SR20 spec HKS "GT-SS" . 3) 76.2mm 46T - Hmm sounds like the T04E wheel from the HKS GT2540 . Turbine spec looks like the cropped (56.5mm) GT30 turbine found in some HKS spec GT2835 cartridges . Not based on experience but I think the best most responsive cost effective turbo upgrade for RB26's is the -9 version of the Garrett GT25/28BB range . This IS a HKS GTSS without the HKS actuator . For a bit more without too much turbine lag 2530's or equiv . You get into a grey area after that because you either opt for more compressor ie GT2871's (IE GTRS) or larger turbines (IE GT2835's) . Cheers A .

Yes I have the impression that its mainly aimed at 4 cylinder engines with its four injector and four coil drivers in the box . The air temperature and therefore density issue is a biggie and without some means of knowing what the temperature of the air is I'd say it's impossible to tune for a wide variation in atmospheric conditions . The Autronic I used to have (SMC) had I think options for an air temp correction map or what they called a charge temp estimation table which works much better . The thing I never forgot was that some switched on tuners used to put a MAF sensor in front of map sensed engines while they tuned them , message in there somewhere . A .

Just out of curiosity has anyone used one of these ? On their site they mention a version that has an adapter loom to plug into an R33 GTS25T - but uses map sensing . From what I hear one of their selling points is that it runs constantly in learning mode so is supposed to be able to adapt to changing circumstances . Anyone ?

A bit more reading ror those interested in running E85 ethanol ULP blend . http://e85forum.com/index.php http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_librar...erearth/me1.htm Enjoy .

Every genuine Garrett GT25 BB based turbo (GT2554R - GT3582R) I've seen has water cooling holes in the center section (bearing housing) . Need some pics or ID tag numbers to confirm it really is a HKS GT2530 . From my list a real one should have these part numbers - should . Complete unit number 472560 - 4 or 472560 - 11 Cartridge (CHRA) no 446179-21 I imagine the difference in complete unit numbers would be for single or twin RB applications though the SR/CA one would have variations again with housings . The cartridge numbers I think are all the same . Cheers A .

Are you people sure that the std R32 oil and water lines are straight fit for a Garrett ball bearing turbo ? All Garrett GT25 based ball bearing turbos (GT2554R - GT3582R) use GT25 sized unions from memory , I thought the Hitachi's used on RB20 and RB25's were different - larger water fittings like T3 water cooled eg VLT T3 . The thing is that these GT25 based BB cartridges are more compact in the bearing housing than Hitachi's so as you would expect they tend to use smaller unions . You may want to search for pics of plumbing bits HKS supplied if you bought their GT2530 turbo as a bolt on "kit" . A bit of homework here saves frustration later , cheers A .

What sized turbine housing do you have on that GT3076R ? It's not possible to "max" these turbos out without the largest or 1.06 A/R GT30 turbine housing on it . I'm not sure if any of you have ever had propper Garrett GT30 and GT35 turbine housings side by side . Look like very similar castings to me ... Sk told me ages ago that a well setup RB30 twin cam comes on boost at around 32-3300 revs with a GT3582R 1.06 A/R turbine housing . If we assume that GT30 and GT35 turbine housings use the same or similar castings machined to suit the two different turbines its logical to assume that the big housing with the 3076R's smaller turbine and compressor wheels should spin up sooner all else being equal . For starters the GT30 turbine being smaller OD than the GT35 one will have less innertia to overcome and the fact that the nozzle and exducer diameters are smaller means the gas speed will be higher through the blades than it would be with the larger turbine . The GT37 compressor in a GT3076R (aka GT3037R) has lower drive requirements than the GT40 compressor in a GT3582R (aka GT3540R) so the perceived "lag" will be less than a GT3582R will have in the largest 1.06 A/R turbine housing . Your call but if I was building a street RB25/30 I think about a 9-9.3 CR (+ poncams) and a GT3076R with the big turbine housing , the lower exhaust side pressure should allow you to push healthy timimg numbers into it so it can make good pre boost torque and have good throttle response . The larger housing should make for economical highway cruising because it wont be jumping onto boost when it's not needed . I'm not prepared to state what revs it will make positive pressure at but my guess is 23-2500 revs if tuned properly . I'd like to think a 9.3:1 CR RB30 Twin Cam would be quite snappy in an R32/R33 without being restrictive , clean AFR's and best mean torque timing should make it feel strong and a 300 + Kw capable turbo make more torque than 2wd traction from the mid range up . Torque is everything IMO , cheers A .

I would not say it's impossible but I can't see how a temperature and a pressure signal can be intergrated to tell an ECU how to regulate fueling and timing control . I AM biased because I KNOW manifold pressure is not a good indication of engine load . Airflow by mass (weight of air as in lbs or kg /min if you like) is hard to beat for an accurate indication of whats going down the spout . If you can KNOW the mass of the air going in you can accurately regulate the mass of the fuel going in and therefore expect get the desired AFR . Using an externally venting throttle bypass valve was a huge mistake with an upstream MAF sensed system , obviously when the "BOV" vented the MAF was indicating airflow that the engine was not getting - this is not something the ECU or MAF sensor can be faulted on . It would be a bit like plumbing a MAP sensor into something other than the engine side of the throttle/s and claiming the MAP/ECU was not suitable . I know it's off topic but are you running a GT4088R on an RB25DET with that engines head/inlet system/valve train ? A .

Yes agree wholeheartedly , manifold pressure can be constant while the volume continues to climb . In that situ with a MAP sensor load based system once the throttle is fully open all you have to tune with is the RPM and temp sensor signals - so 2D at best . A .

I'll pass a few opinions on this topic which I'm sure will differ with what a lot of others think/do but hey thats life - IMO . My findings are that waste gate actuators (and solenoids) don't like getting their pressure signal from down stream of the inlet manifolds throttle/s . I had my old FJ20 like that for a while with an integral wastegate turbo (GT2860RS) and you get all sorts of silly noises and waste gate flutter from a sudden sharp pressure drop when the throttle is shut quickly . I would rather see the pressure signal line connect to the system upstream of the throttles and I'm pretty sure Nissan do this anyway in std form . When you do it this way all the waste gate diaphragm see's (via the solenoid valve) is roughly atmospheric pressure (assumes little or no pressure drop through your air filter) and up to the maximum pressure the compressor developes at wherever you tap into the system . You need to be wary of restrictions downstream of the compressor side of your turbo because if they are significant the pressure can be a fair bit higher at the turbo than it is in the inlet manifold . Corky reckons and I agree that finding a location close to the compressor housings outlet (if not in the side of it) is probably best overall . If you really wanted them you can create boost spikes by tapping in further away downstream of the compressor housing , it does this because of the time lag involved in pressurising the point further away . The down side is that the temperature rises faster at the compressor and the pressure rises faster in the turbine housing - its because the gate stays shut possibly longer because the waste gate is trying to regulate turbine/compressor speed based on pressure down stream - not at the turbocharger . IMO close to the comp housing , A . BTW you could get unusual things going on with the recirc valve if you must tap in where you have , seperate lines always ensure manifold pressure at what ever gadget thats connected to the manifold . Again I wouldn't do it this way but possibly tap into some appropriate part of the IAC housing ? I always run the most OEM style hose I can find with factory type clamps - stealth is good - defects are bad .

Sounds nice but they are not right , there is nothing T3 about them aside from the turbine housings mounting flange pattern - and that's actualy closer to T4 Euro size . The compressor wheels are larger dia than T3 ones and the turbine shaft is a typically Japanese metric size , T3 off the top of my head is 0.25 inch . Also the ball bearing races are nothing like the "cartridge" type assembly Garrett uses . I'll dig mine out in daylight and explain its unique bits . A .

Debatable I know but I reckon Garrett would be foolish to make petrol spec turbine housings with larger volute passages than the mount flanges inlet port could feed . I know people fear the dreaded "turbine lag" but it's really the only way to reduce turbine inlet (exhaust manifild pressure) to a minimum . I still don't think it's sufficiently well understood that lowering the "TIP" nearly always allows you to run closer to best mean torque (BMT) timing numbers AND it helps pull up the bottom end torque previously gained from a lower boost threshold . About the best relivant example I can think of is using the larger VG30 OP6 type turbine housing on RB25 turbos or the GCG Hi Flowed RB25 turbo . If tuned properly generally the power goes up because the TIP goes down , also when it does the waste gate gets an easier time because it's not trying to "throttle" the exhaust gas as much . We all have to remember that a waste gate is a means of controlling compressor speed , it is not and cannot double as an exhaust side pressure relief valve - not if you want it to control compressor speed and therefore boost . They are referenced off positive inlet manifold (or comp housing) pressure and have complete disregard for TIP . Sorry getting OT , end rant , cheers A .

The Ball Bearing turbocharger WAS standard on the 4 cam single turbo VG30 engine - I think Z32 era . The give away will be that the center housing is bulky because it's essentially the same as an early RB25DET type cartridge . I know this because I've had them stripped side by side . Actually someone once begged me to sell them a BB VG30 cartridge because they lunched their RB25 BB turbo and needed a mates rates replacement . From memory the VG30 comp housing was a bees dick smaller in size but they didn't care . At the time all I wanted was the ellusive larger A/R VG30 BB type turbine housing so it became cost neutral . The thing to look for with these Hitachi BB turbos is the small bolt head on the side of their center or bearing housings . If the turbo has one its 99% certain to be a ball bearing unit . There is another turbo that some VG30's used and you can tell because it has a much less bulky center housing and a large turbine outlet . I have an original VG30 BB turbo in the cave so if I get time in the next couple of days I may be able to get pics of it . I also have a bastard hybrid bush bearing turbo from my early FJ days which I stupidly had bored out for some kind of TA or Mitsy turbine - waste of a rare housing I suppose . One of the possible give aways of the large turbine housing is the "OP6" cast into them , they don't all have it but mine does . Sure theres VG BB turbo pics in here somewhere . A .

Looks to me like some sort of Garrett based T series Turbo . Most of those T series compressor wheels have the largish spot facing that the jamb nut butts up against . The turbine housing "looks" like its clamped to the center housing with crab plates which usually means T series stuff . I couldn't tell if it's water cooled or not and if not and that's another sign of older series turbos on petrol apps anyway . Polished compressor housings is something Turbonetics likes to do - bang for bling I suppose . If you wan't to ID it properly take it to a turbo shop and get them to remove it's housings and measure its wheels . A .