Wheel Alingment Settings

[Sydneykid]

SK

With the -2mm of Toe on the back, does that mean the wheels are pointing outwards?

What effect does this have on the tyre were?

What effect does it have on the handling?

Thanks.

Alignment being done now, I just want to get the idea straight in my head.

Let’s tart off with, 2 mm is not enough to affect tyre wear significantly. So don’t stress over that aspect.

Handling wise, toe out is considered an “unstable” setting and toe in is considered a “stabilising” setting. That’s why rear wheel steering cars go to toe in, it settles the rear down, makes it less sensitive to inputs (steering, bumps, accelerator application etc). This shift to toe in is deliberately designed to make the car more benign, less likely to spear off backwards, more inclined to understeer. Better for the “Wallys” if you like.

Toe out, on the other hand, makes the rear more lively, reactive to inputs. So when the turn the steering wheel you get response from the rear (as well as the front). This means the car turns into the corner better than it would with tow zero or toe in.

Since there are no “Wallys” on SAU, the 2 mm toe out is the recommended setting I suggest.

cheers

[Bass Junky]

Excellante Sir SK.

thanks mate.

[Bass Junky]

Okay.

I've had the alignment done.

Rear end, no problems.

Front end, coul only get 0.7 degree of Camber on one side and 1.3 degrees on the other.

Whiteline bushes installed.

Pulled off the stock castor rods and found that lo and behold, I already bloody well had the whiteline offset bushes.

Fitted the Castor Rods anyway, and could only get 5.5 degrees of positive Castor.

The Alignment dude said that they were adjusted as far as they would go........

they are from Just Jap. Has anybody else used these particular rods, and how much caster id you get?

I'm considering taking them off, machining a few mm off the main nut part and trying for more Castor.

SK?

Ideas?

[Sydneykid]

Okay.

I've had the alignment done.

Rear end, no problems.

Front end, coul only get 0.7 degree of Camber on one side and 1.3 degrees on the other.

Whiteline bushes installed.

Pulled off the stock castor rods and found that lo and behold, I already bloody well had the whiteline offset bushes.

Fitted the Castor Rods anyway, and could only get 5.5 degrees of positive Castor.

The Alignment dude said that they were adjusted as far as they would go........

they are from Just Jap. Has anybody else used these particular rods, and how much caster id you get?

I'm considering taking them off, machining a few mm off the main nut part and trying for more Castor.

SK?

Ideas?

Mmmmmmmm.......tricky.

I have heard this problem with adjustable radius rods not giving enough caster before. When I checked they had supplied GTST radius rods (longer) instead of GTR (shorter). Obviously not the problem in your case.

I have no idea why they can't get more than 5.5 degrees, the Whiteline bushes give 6.0 to 6.5 degrees on R34's usually. Maybe try comparing the lengths to the standard radius rods with the bushes fully ofset for max positive caster.

The 1.3 degrees of negative camber is close to the least I have seen (1.5 degrees), but the 0.7 is way less than what I have encountered. Sounds like there is something bent on that side. Try swapping the upper control arms from side to side and see if that changes the readings.

cheers

[Beer Baron]

hmm well i haven't used the GTST JJ rods but i have used the GTR rods and they could provide more castor than i would ever need. are there any differences between 32, 33, 34 GTSTs? either in the rods, or the actual car's geometry. like i said i could get heaps of castor with the GTR ones.

[butthead]

You have lowered the car, so the standard caster and camber settings are meaningless. If you haven't fitted adjustable bushes, you can't adjust them anyway. Actually you can adjust the rear camber 0.25 degree with the standard adjusters, but considering how much you have lowered it, that won't help much. From the R33GTST Whiteline and Bilstein Group Buy thread following are my recommended settings

Front

Caster +7.0 degrees or more

Camber -1.0 degrees

Toe Zero each side

Rear

Camber -0.5 degrees

Toe -2mm each side

Hope that is of some help

cheers

Would these settings apply for a GTR R33.

[salad]

scroll down a bit

[DJRIFT]

hi all i thought id just throw my question in here as its all relevent.

i sofar have lowered speings giving me some camber all around.

a hicas lock bar making it possible to give toe aligment.

ive just brought JJ adjustable upper arms for the rear so i can get the rear aligned.

what would people sagest the best settings for, here it goes DRIFT. runs and hides from flying objects.

im totaly confused wich way i should have the toe.

im thinking i should run 0 deg camber on the rear. helps for tyre ware.

ive also been looking into a set of adj castor rods from jj but havent had the funds yet. ive also been looking into makeing a set myself. i have a second hand set of castor rods and i have a good price on some nylon rose joints. nice and thick. nylon is better wareing than steel on steel. what do you guys think?

im also looking at getting some whiteline adj swaybars. from what ive read if i just get a front one i would be better off as they promote over steer which is what i want.

thanks for taking the time to answer my questions

damo

[Eug]

Gary,

You once recommended me to aim for zero toe for the rear, and around 1.0 - 1.3mm toe out for the front?

but from this post it seems zero toe for the front, and 2mm toe out for the rear.

could you confirm please.

thanks

eug

[salad]

hi all i thought id just throw my question in here as its all relevent.

i sofar have lowered speings giving me some camber all around.

a hicas lock bar making it possible to give toe aligment.

ive just brought JJ adjustable upper arms for the rear so i can get the rear aligned.

what would people sagest the best settings for, here it goes DRIFT. runs and hides from flying objects.

im totaly confused wich way i should have the toe.

im thinking i should run 0 deg camber on the rear. helps for tyre ware.

ive also been looking into a set of adj castor rods from jj but havent had the funds yet. ive also been looking into makeing a set myself. i have a second hand set of castor rods and i have a good price on some nylon rose joints. nice and thick. nylon is better wareing than steel on steel. what do you guys think?

im also looking at getting some whiteline adj swaybars. from what ive read if i just get a front one i would be better off as they promote over steer which is what i want.

thanks for taking the time to answer my questions

damo

with a lock bar you should still have toe adjustments. your rear tie rods should be screwed into the lock bar.

you should run some negative camber, about 1 deg, depending on how fast you go. its still gonna roll over and you will wear the outsides a lot with 0 camber

an upgraded front bar with stock rear will promote understeer not oversteer. get the rear bar first

[Sydneykid]

Gary,

You once recommended me to aim for zero toe for the rear, and around 1.0 - 1.3mm toe out for the front?

but from this post it seems zero toe for the front, and 2mm toe out for the rear.

could you confirm please.

thanks

eug

Hi Eug, I obviously told you those settings based on what told me that you have done to the car and what you use it for. Do you want to go though it again?

cheers

Edited October 16, 2006 by Sydneykid

[Eug]

ahh thanks gary... my setup has not changed.

thanks for the clarification!

eug

[DJRIFT]

with a lock bar you should still have toe adjustments. your rear tie rods should be screwed into the lock bar.

you should run some negative camber, about 1 deg, depending on how fast you go. its still gonna roll over and you will wear the outsides a lot with 0 camber

an upgraded front bar with stock rear will promote understeer not oversteer. get the rear bar first

ok so your saying to still run a bit of rear camber. so they may have been a waste of money for the moment as it would have been better spent on an adjustable sway bar.

i was chatting with my felow modifier today and he said that we are going ahead with making my own castor rods so ill have them in soon enough.

oh what toe are you running salad front and back?

thanks

[salad]

i would definitely run camber on the rear. currently i have -1.5deg and find that pretty good.

adjustable swaybar would be preferable to camber arms. but the camber arms should make a difference in rigidity. most 16 year old bushes arent in the best condition

should make for a bit more predictability

make sure that the castor rods are welded really well. i wouldnt recommend it because if one fails you're in a lot of trouble.

i havent played around with toe too much yet. last time i was out on the track i ran 1mm out both sides front and back. i liked it, but i had changed heaps of stuff since i last went out so i cant really make any good judgement.

Edited October 17, 2006 by salad

[DJRIFT]

yea i know the castor rods are a touchy thing but all i will be doing is cutting the big end off the rod slightly and i say slightly machining the shaft down then taping a thread onto that then the rose joint screws on. the rose joints are nylon so they dont need lubricating and they are rated at like 2 to 2.5 tun. should be strong enouth.

thanks for your input.