Premium Vs Unleaded

[Guest Mashrock]

the price of petrol skyrockets in last month or so. up atleast 25c/L since i started buying diesel

yet diesel still stays the same.. which has always been around 1.35 + -5 // L for the year i have been onto it.

all this stress that the media is putting on people through their propaganda about petrol.

holland for example its about 1.3 - 1.5 euro a L, and the regular person over there dosnt earn any more than us in comparison

[dezz]

use ULP, then when ur nice R34 f**ks up, come on here and post a thread asking why.

[Primordial]

If you can articulate what these guys ^^^^ have said, you should either make your dad understand, or blow his mind so much that he doesnt care about the argument any further!

Japanese fuel is 102RON VS crappy aussie 91RON.... Skylines were never designed for australia!!! They werent sold locally... So therefore.. you need to give the car an environment it was designed for = Decent fuel!

Do it his way, use regular ULP and get him to pay for the new RB26

[seriesII]

I'll only add something quick in this, for about 6 months i tryed using standard 91 ron fuel in my s2 96 r33, and now im paing the price, my car is now choppying when i try to boost higher, lack of fuel when its needed, been using 98ron now and it ran ok for a while but not perfect, no the issue is happening again, maby dirty injectors from the 91ron fuel?, finding out soon. but it is a fuel issue , ran very very bad on 91ron, very chopping when giving it power

[TheMikeC]

oh oh, but, the dad owns a BMW! BMWs are really good cars and he uses ULP! Listen to your dad son, he knows best, NOT

He sounds like a complete moron and you made this thread to hear what you're too afraid to admit, he's a complete idiot yet you defend him WTF

[SECURITY]

use ULP on a turbo and we'll be hearing about you HERE

get over the guy trying to defend his old man. ITS HIS DAD. wether or not he's right, you do not let some random nob call him an idiot.

keep this shit on topic.

[scathing]

Most Euro cars made since the mid 90's have recommended PULP, which he's admitted. I think the 4 cylinder BMWs have survived on ULP, since the target market are all social climbers, but the 6's, 8's and 12's should have PULP as a minimum requirement.

If your dad chooses not to run it on the minimum fuel, its his money when he needs an engine rebuild because the engine's been pinging or gunked up. BMWs are temperamental bitches, and the servicing costs aren't cheap. And if the car was in warranty, it wouldn't be after they pulled the engine down and saw the state of the internals (that's if he's even smart enough to fill the car up with PULP before taking it in).

As an aside, what's the point of owning the "Ultimate Driving Machine" *chortle* if you're going to urinate into the fuel filler?

The other thing is that his car is Australian delivered, and NA, and so its setup should be for local conditions and fuel. Even if you have a stock GTT, the turbo and higher average ambient temperatures in Australia will make it more temperamental. Japan doesn't only sell 103RON fuel, so it should cope with slightly lower octane ratings, but its still not good for the car.

In the end, instead of raving about why you're pouring quality fuel into your cheap Japanese sports coupe, why not have him ask himself why he's pouring shit fuel into his expensive European luxury sports sedan?

[kralster]

It won't do shit, modern engines are smart enough with knock sensors and the like that the engine will run fine on ULP.

I bet some of you on here smoke and drink alcohol? so that makes you stupid cos fresh air and water a better for you aren't they. Grow up.

[scathing]

Yeah, but my body's service manual doesn't say to only run it on fresh air and water.

If your engine is expecting a certain RON value and you're putting a lower RON in it, a better analogy would be a person who was born up and grew up at sea level trying to live at great altitude (higher than anywhere in Australia, anyway).

Your body has developed expecting the air to have a certain oxygen content, and now you're breathing in has a lot less of it. Sure your metabolism might be able to adjust and cope, but see how healthy you are and what happens to you if you try to exert yourself.

[VB-]

It won't do shit, modern engines are smart enough with knock sensors and the like that the engine will run fine on ULP.

I bet some of you on here smoke and drink alcohol? so that makes you stupid cos fresh air and water a better for you aren't they. Grow up.

would it allow that much tho? its a big drop from jap fuel to aussie fuel, and i believe the ECU compensates with timing adjustment? would it adjust it that far...

PS. I'm with SECUR1TY, relax with the insults, u cant just go around hangin shit on peoples parents

Edited April 27, 2006 by VB-

[R34NRG]

oh oh, but, the dad owns a BMW! BMWs are really good cars and he uses ULP! Listen to your dad son, he knows best, NOT

He sounds like a complete moron and you made this thread to hear what you're too afraid to admit, he's a complete idiot yet you defend him WTF

a complete idiot? man i dunno wtf ur on about but can u explain why? all the guy said was i shouldnt be wasting my money on such exspensive fuel when ive got other stuff to worry about. no shit its better for my car to use premium, everyone would be happi to use preimium but its not that easi. i dunno about u but lets see u spend 30k for ur 1st car and afford to pay premium...yeh thats wat i thought.... mate u dont know my dad so i suggest u shut the f*k up. at least the old mans worked hard enough to buy himself one of those cars, gives u no right to insult him. my old mans just lookn out for me. didnt no that made him a idiot. next time u decide to insult someones dad i sugest u take alook at ur own dad and see if his perfect.

[Zappn]

Knock sensors are reactive.

Sure when the go off the ecu will retard the timing all that stuff but first you need to have the damage causing knock happen.

It's costs less than 8% to go from 91 to 98 and more importantly less than 3% more to go from 95 to 98.

That 3% difference will EASILY be made up in better fuel economy and lower service costs.

Running on 91 is plain stupid, you'd need to run the car for 10 years on 91 to make up the cost of getting a rebuild.

I see 98 ron the same as insurance, if you can't afford it then you can't afford the car.

edit: removed over exageration

Edited April 29, 2006 by Zappn

[scheris]

Tell your dad, simply put: 'I need to put 98ron fuel, because it's a turbo car and it prevents engine knock' and if he still don't get it 'go into explaining why etc etc.' and if that fails......give up i say!!

It's like wat me and the bf say to the parentals. We didn't buy a line for fuel economy or cost effectiveness... we bought it coz it was FUUNNN!!!!

:D

Edited April 29, 2006 by scheris

[Sydneykid]

Try the your car IS better than mine discussion.

BMW's have multiple stage ignition and injection maps.

When you run it on 98 ron it uses one set of maps and makes X power.

When you run it on 92 ron it uses another set of maps and makex Y power.

It knows what petrol you run it on by the readings from the knock sensors.

My Skyline's ECU is not as smart, that's why you paid $W for your car and I paid $X for my car.

It has knock sensors, but it doesn't have multiple ignition and injection maps.

So when the knock sensors detect 92 ron fuel is being used the ECU simply retards the igntion timing, a lot.

That retarded igntion timing means it runs less efficiently, and gets worse fuel economy.

So much less efficiently that it may cost more in lost fuel economy on 92 ron than the extra cost of 98 ron.

A few guys have tried it and it is very marginal.

All of the above is true, the BMW owners manual tells you how much power it looses using the low ron mapping. I always find it helpful to quote the actual numbers from the manual.

The discussion closer ..........Let's go an look at your BMW owners manual and find out how much power (efficiency) you loose using 92 ron.

cheers

[rob82]

Try the your car IS better than mine discussion.

BMW's have multiple stage ignition and injection maps.

When you run it on 98 ron it uses one set of maps and makes X power.

When you run it on 92 ron it uses another set of maps and makex Y power.

It knows what petrol you run it on by the readings from the knock sensors.

My Skyline's ECU is not as smart, that's why you paid $W for your car and I paid $X for my car.

It has knock sensors, but it doesn't have multiple ignition and injection maps.

So when the knock sensors detect 92 ron fuel is being used the ECU simply retards the igntion timing, a lot.

That retarded igntion timing means it runs less efficiently, and gets worse fuel economy.

So much less efficiently that it may cost more in lost fuel economy on 92 ron than the extra cost of 98 ron.

A few guys have tried it and it is very marginal.

All of the above is true, the BMW owners manual tells you how much power it looses using the low ron mapping. I always find it helpful to quote the actual numbers from the manual.

The discussion closer ..........Let's go an look at your BMW owners manual and find out how much power (efficiency) you loose using 92 ron.

cheers

Well actually both BMW and Nissan have multiple fuel and ignition maps its more of a case that the knock sensing, detection and implementation of what the ECU needs to do in order to stop detonation within the nissans is alot more dated to that of the BMW. I've seen lots of nissan detonate for long periods of time and not swap to use lower octane maps.

I believe that manufatures specify the octane rated so that maximum performance can be had from the car which makes it more sellable. All cars a different with their abilities to detect knock, I've found that mitsubishi and toyota to be very good while nissan and subaru to be quite the oppisite. I can definately tell you that I wouldn't run either nissan or subaru on ULP thats for sure.

Edited May 1, 2006 by rob82

[R34NRG]

i was always putting uptimax in da car regardless of wat my dad said. just needed some hard proof so i could shut the old man up ahhahaha (he proberly take my keys away though)

[Liiger]

My mum has got a 94 Blurbird Non Turbo. Shes been using regular unleaded fuel since she got it and now the engine has started knocking (About 9 years after she bought it.)

Only knocks at idle but you can hear it over the radio its that loud. Gonna cost a little over $1200 to fix, well so says the Croydon Nissan Service center.

Just tell him to use premium dammit!

[VB-]

its knocking at idle.... thats really strange, never heard of it before. how come this is happening now, age shouldnt effect timing, a/f ratio or anything like this, so what causes it?

[PTR33]

My mum has got a 94 Blurbird Non Turbo. Shes been using regular unleaded fuel since she got it and now the engine has started knocking (About 9 years after she bought it.)

Only knocks at idle but you can hear it over the radio its that loud. Gonna cost a little over $1200 to fix, well so says the Croydon Nissan Service center.

Just tell him to use premium dammit!

That's not knocking, that's flogged bearings. Above idle your mum's car's oil pump can deliver enough flow to build up some oil pressure.

Knock (and ping and detonation) in this case is referring to the non-smooth propagation of the flame front in the combustion chambers of your engine and the characteristic noise it makes.

Wikipedia article on knock read and learn. That's how most of us did it...

[Sean'O]

Hey,

I work at a Mobil Servo and drive a non-turbo R-32 however i still put synergy 8000 in it. Thats becasue its not only better octane you get with the expensive fuel, they also put in additives that keep your engine running clean. I'm pretty sure Shell have similar fuels that have additives.

If you go into a petrol station and ask for pamflets about their fuels you can take em' home and show ya dad in 'black and white' why premium fuel is beter for ya baby .

cheers,

Sean'O

ps: plz don't get angry at me about fuel prices, all us servo jockies just get told on the phone by a machine what price to put fuel at.........i swear every time the phone rings lol