Turbo Replacement/upgrade - Your Thoughts?

[pixel8r]

Hi Stagea/skyline owners!

I recently posted a thread about a whining noise on boost that could possibly be the turbo itself.

I did have a close look at the turbo and the shaft does move slightly side-to-side (about 0.5mm up and down and about 2-3mm in and out).

There is also a film of what looks like oil all over the inside edges of all the piping from the turbo right through to the intake on top of the engine. There was also black all down the outside of the induction end of the turbo where the induction hose connects - so much so that I didn't need to loosen that clip to take the hose off the turbo - it just slid off due to oil all over the connection (the induction part, not the pipes to the intercooler).

Anyway, thats not really my topic. Basically I may be looking at replacing the turbo and have not been able to source any R34 GTT second hand turbos anywhere here in Adelaide.

I've been speaking to Bill from Adelaide Turbo Services and he recommended either reconditioning the stock turbo, or getting it hiflowed using Garrett GT30 internals etc for only $500 extra.

I'd like to go the hiflow option if we need to but I just want to know if there would be any problem with this option on a completely stock series 2 stagea. My understanding is that as long as I keep boost levels near stock (say ~5psi) there should be no problem, as it would just be a bit more airflow than stock, and probably a bit more lag, although power delivery will be stronger and continue through higher revs. The stock turbo seems to reach full boost around 3000rpm and then its a slow climb through the rpm after that.

If there is anything else I should be considering in order for this turbo upgrade to be safe please let me know.

Also, because it bolts straight on in place of the stock one - using stock water and oil lines, would I be able to install it myself without any trouble? (i'm not a mechanic but had no difficulty removing piping and heat shields etc to inspect my turbo) or should I pay the quoted $550 to get it installed?

[AlexCim]

As everyone will say, a GCG highflow is a very good route to take.

Well proven and GREAT upgrade turbo.

I am selling my old one here. It has about 7500km on it and is only removed as the car is getting sold. I was going to keep it to go on an R32 GTS4 but have since changed my mine in car choice.

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...howtopic=127238

[pixel8r]

Yeah it sounds like its a worthwhile upgrade in any case.

I was just concerned it may not be wise on an otherwise stock stagea.

I will be getting it checked out at ATS to make sure 100% that I do need to replace the turbo and if so I'll probably get them to do the lot. Wasn't thinking when I typed the original post - even if I could fit it myself it would mean somehow getting home without a turbo...duh. So yeah a lot of money, but something that should also add value (and fun) to the car.

My concerns are mainly what effect it will have and what other mods should really accompany it - if any.

I've been toying with the idea of an Apexi SAFC2 for a while - purely for improving fuel economy (currently 14L/100km in town).

And I realise that to get the most out of a bigger turbo a fmic is needed but that is probably out of my price range right now - hence my reason for just running low boost on it for now. Would still improve performance either way, just not achieving its true potential. But with everything still stock on the fuel/injectors side of things its probably better to keep it pretty mild for now anyway.

[Tangles]

what did Bill quote you for the GT30 internal highflow?

Ive talked to him about mine a far while ago; his opinions were do a GCG hiflow thru him for the SAU group buy price of $1750, or a GT30 internal 500hp highflow for over 2k. Can you maybe post or PM me his quote to you?

Graham West Workshops reckon his turbos are tops, and they can tune a safc2 to suit on their 4wd dyno.

[Tangles]

I know I'll get shot for this; but Im seriously considering one of Slides bush bearing turbos for under $900

with a huge VG30 highflowed rear housing, and made to suit your setup..... seems a good deal for sure.

"cost of ownership" is a big issue for me.

[EGA41T]

thats 900 minus whatever you can sell your turbo for, so about 900 including installation, and id imagine you would probably be looking at around 180-200 4wkw

[wolverine]

pixel,

i don't understand why you were looking for a 2nd hand R34 turbo. why not use your turbo?

unless the time off the road is an issue.

[pixel8r]

Yeah time off the road is an issue - its our only car and I need it to get to work - only other option is 2 busses which dont line up timewise so it takes like 1.5-2 hours to get to and from work.

I was originally looking for a 2nd hand turbo thinking it would be a cheap fix on its own.

But now I've decided to go the better option and will probably go ahead with the GCG hiflow through ATS. $1750 plus installation.

It depends if Bill at ATS has a spare turbo housing he can send off to GCG, otherwise it would mean having the car off the road for 2-3 days and I'd rather avoid that if I can.

The other option is to use Garrett GT30 internals instead of the GCG kit which gives more airflow etc. but its about $2250 plus installation. It still bolts up to the stock exhaust manifold etc. and oil and water lines.

I dont really need performance tho as the car is stock and any increase in boost will require either more airflow (exhaust) or more cooling (fmic) or both, and then if I go above 10psi it gets more complicated with fuel pressure, ecu etc. etc. and brakes would have to be upgraded at some point too.

The cost all adds up as soon as you start talking of increasing power levels and I'll be finding it hard to afford the $2k or so for just the turbo upgrade.

Bill confirmed for me that my turbo is in fact the problem - the turbine appears to be moving side to side and wobbling, making the strange whining noise on boost. So the whole reason for the upgrade is simply better reliability. The extra airflow and strength of the turbo is just a bonus at this stage.

An SAFC2 is probably the next step - to hopefully lower my fuel costs a little. I've been trying to find a place with a 4wd dyno here so GWW sounds like a good plan.

[paulr33]

a hiflow with gt30 internals is a bad idea

[Tangles]

a hiflow with gt30 internals is a bad idea

why? care to explain your thoughts?

I guess tho you can buy a GT3071 for $1650........................ so yeah, could be.

[paulr33]

surge and lag city

either get a normal hiflow or pick up an off the shelf garret unit

i would recommend gt2871 56t which is basically the hks gtrs

[pixel8r]

Yeah I'm not real clear on what his GT30 option was. I think from memory it was a GT30 machined to fit the standard housing or something along those lines. Either way it would bolt up to the standard manifold and exhaust and oil and water etc...

I'd prefer the GCG option just because I dont need the extra airflow and dont have the mods or the money required to get the real benefit from the GT30.

The GCG seems like a great unit but my dilemma is the possibility of having no car for 3 days which comes down to extra cost either in time getting to and from work or hiring a car or whatever we choose to do to compensate.

Can anyone confirm if the R33 GTST and R34 GTT turbos are the same? (or at least the same externally).

If they're different then I'd rather the hiflow kit goes in my R34 turbo housing and not an R33 one...

[Tangles]

34 housing is larger then 33 housing. (edit: REAR housing) front wheel is nylon on both R33 series 2 and R34

Id LOVE a 34 housing lol............

Edited July 26, 2006 by Tangles

[pixel8r]

34 housing is larger then 33 housing. (edit: REAR housing) front wheel is nylon on both R33 series 2 and R34

Id LOVE a 34 housing lol............

Ok so I really need to send my turbo off for the hiflow job.

2-3 days without my stag....ouch.

[paulr33]

its only fractionally larger, like 10rwkw max

[paulr33]

you can also pay an extra price to GCG to have them send you a hiflow and then send yours back in once they are swapped, so the downtime can be a few hours instead i think you need a $1000 deposit, and refund once turbo's are swapped over

[munchstagea]

I'm going to reply to what was "not really my topic"

There is also a film of what looks like oil all over the inside edges of all the piping from the turbo right through to the intake on top of the engine. There was also black all down the outside of the induction end of the turbo where the induction hose connects - so much so that I didn't need to loosen that clip to take the hose off the turbo - it just slid off due to oil all over the connection (the induction part, not the pipes to the intercooler).

There is a breather from the rocker cover on top of the engine that runs back to the intake between the AFM and turbo, that air will have some oil vapour in it and that is where the oil in the pipes is coming from you will find. Being a film and not a stream it shouldn't be a huge drama and is quite normal I think.

You shaft play sounds like natural wear and tear, standard turbos do wear out.

Cheers

Luke

[pixel8r]

I'm going to reply to what was "not really my topic"

There is a breather from the rocker cover on top of the engine that runs back to the intake between the AFM and turbo, that air will have some oil vapour in it and that is where the oil in the pipes is coming from you will find. Being a film and not a stream it shouldn't be a huge drama and is quite normal I think.

You shaft play sounds like natural wear and tear, standard turbos do wear out.

Cheers

Luke

Thanks for that. Apologies for the two posts in one but this answers that part very well.

Also, I realise the standard turbo does wear out - but as with all imports I'm still trying to figure out how many km's this stagea has actually done. It says 35,000 kms but so far we've replaced the rear suspension (leaking shock absorber) and the fronts make a rubbing sound occasionally, and now the turbo problem. But the interior and exterior of the car are both pretty good, no signs of wear on the seats or anything. A turbo shouldn't wear out within 30,000 kms should it?

Everything else about the car seems fine - so after we fix the turbo it should be a very nice car finally :-)

[munchstagea]

Yeah that's not right, I would expect 100K - 150K minimum out of the stock turbo (really guessing here) if it has not been "boosted" had crappy, old, burnt oil run through it for a year or 2 without a change... I guess that is the real challenge, the real history of use and abuse is just a guess. Is the turbo actually doing anything wrong other than having the shaft play? I know you mentioned the noise but have you ruled out any exhaust leaks???

Luke

[GunMetalR33]

I have a Garrett GT30 turbo on my rb25 which has a gt30 comp housing, GT30 cartridge and a VG30 zaust housing. Mine is the 6 blade version and pulls very hard with good mid range, top end and minimal lag (comes on hard at around 3500rpm).

I beleive that the 7 blade versions of the GT30 had problems with lag and surging with the VG30 zaust housings.

Got the turbo from HPInABox for about $2000.