My On-going Dispute With Recent Fines I Received

[The Dan]

ATMO bovs are legal as long as the crankcase breathers are plumbed into a cath can or re-routed through the pcv valve.

There is NO LAW OR LEGISLATION whatsoever regarding pod style airfilters other than the fact that they must be attached to the inlet piping. Unsecured pod filter only applies if you don't have the filter attached to the pipework (if it has come off or missing).

Exhaust has passed DB testing also so there is no problem there.

QT make the rules regarding the traffic act. Transport department enfoce them. Police are only there to enforce major breaches of these laws and only then can they direct you to a defect station.

The only people who are authorised to issue a defect notice are Transport Department Inspectors or other authorised inspectors. Traffic cops may only direct you to a defect station...not actually defect you unless they are an authorised QT inspector as well.

Tango....so you think just because he drives a Skyline and he is a young male, that means he deserves to be defected? I think you are the one who needs to do some growing up...or maybe grow some balls and challenge the defects you may have received.

Cops have taken it to a new level and so must we. John is doing the right thing by chasing it. Given that he probably should have kept his mouth shut and googled the questions instead....the whole situation may have been avoided but we all do silly things on occasion.

We all have a right to be on the roads and if it means we have to fight for that right, then hand me a rifle coz I'll go in!

[bretto]

tango, the biggest problem is ppl dont fight the defects because for the sheer fact of the matter, $75 and 1 point is alot easier than all the hassle of taking it to court.

[dangerous_daveo]

That and Mr tango Sir, cops do make mistakes, and they do get lazy they sure as heck do get cocky and some really dont know what they are talking about as they just skimmed over the breif. Add all that together...

And yeah same deal I've had pleanlty a mate get off a defect notice due to it being falsely issued, although most times its never gone this far. A simple letter from DOT then another simple letter to the officers supervisor and its all been dropped.

Most people are blah 1 point $75 bloody cops rah rah and pay it. Which is the same as speeding fines etc. I mean if a cop pulled you over near a speed change from say 70kmh - 60kmh and they said sorry son your 14kmh over. You would go, oh sorry must have been, try talk you way out of it. But when in all honesty you have NO idea that, that reading is from your car just as soon as you say yeah you were speeding if you were or werent you are done. They just hope and assume you will cop it, I guess thats why they are called cops! (ha.. ha...)

[predator]

In the end, with these types of issues, I think it's just a matter of personal liberties.

I'm not a young person, nor probably a hoon by the strict sense, but at the end of the day -- if somebody wants to tell me how I should live my life, or the way in which I spend my time enjoying myself (to the fair extent that it does not frustrate or annoy or reduce the quality of life for somebody else in quantifiable and directly attributable basis)... they can go and get f**ked.

I pay my taxes, I pay for the police man's uniform, and expensive and un-necessary fancy highway patrol cars that I never really asked for, and at the end of the day I obey all other laws and requirements -- when it comes to the roads, why should I be treated like a criminal?

In Australia, the way in which the road rules are enforced, and created, and worst of all, the way in which driver training is viewed (and those that dare to even utter "if we train people they'll get over-confidence and hurt themselves"), is an absolute joke compared to any other *democracy*, even those that are less so.

[boot_it]

From my understanding they can defect for anything they SUSPECT is non compliant. Regardless of what QT says all gases must vent through the catalitic (spelling) converter. Atmo BOV's do vent crankcase gases to the air. If the cop was performing his duty legally ie. traffic cop conducting a vehicle inspection then I cant see that you have any leg to stand on. Its up to the owner to ensure that the car is legal, there is no onus on the copper to prove anything. I cant see you winning in COurt. If your dads experenced he should be telling you this. Read back through the posts on this site and the others. Its happened many times before.

tango955 u are a utter tosser queensland police cannot over rule a adr rule and that is fact

give up while u can ill stop u falling on your ass

why

your stupid commet about bov venting crankcase gasses

bov DONT vent crank case gasses WHY coz they are not hook (nore have any thing to do with oil fumes from the engine)

a bov job is to vent FRESH air when the throttle plate has been CLOSED this venting air has only gone through the turbo and cooler and then gets vented to atmo

and if u still think atmo bov are still illegal and vent harmfull pollants to atmo i would like to qld police actual testing they have done to prove other wise

and u know what they have no proof so how can it be illegal

[The Dan]

tango955 u are a utter tosser queensland police cannot over rule a adr rule and that is fact

give up while u can ill stop u falling on your ass

why

your stupid commet about bov venting crankcase gasses

bov DONT vent crank case gasses WHY coz they are not hook (nore have any thing to do with oil fumes from the engine)

a bov job is to vent FRESH air when the throttle plate has been CLOSED this venting air has only gone through the turbo and cooler and then gets vented to atmo

and if u still think atmo bov are still illegal and vent harmfull pollants to atmo i would like to qld police actual testing they have done to prove other wise

and u know what they have no proof so how can it be illegal

Actually I have to disagree with you there. ATMO bovs do vent crankcase fumes into the air. The rocker cover breathers are plumbed back into the intake before the turbo so therefore fumes which pass through here will be re-cycled through the system to be burnt through the engine.

[`nigno]

In the end, with these types of issues, I think it's just a matter of personal liberties.

I'm not a young person, nor probably a hoon by the strict sense, but at the end of the day -- if somebody wants to tell me how I should live my life, or the way in which I spend my time enjoying myself (to the fair extent that it does not frustrate or annoy or reduce the quality of life for somebody else in quantifiable and directly attributable basis)... they can go and get f**ked.

I pay my taxes, I pay for the police man's uniform, and expensive and un-necessary fancy highway patrol cars that I never really asked for, and at the end of the day I obey all other laws and requirements -- when it comes to the roads, why should I be treated like a criminal?

In Australia, the way in which the road rules are enforced, and created, and worst of all, the way in which driver training is viewed (and those that dare to even utter "if we train people they'll get over-confidence and hurt themselves"), is an absolute joke compared to any other *democracy*, even those that are less so.

PREACH MY BROTHER!!! - Couldn't have said it any better myself

[arbess]

gee that went a bit wild there in the space of an evening.

Mr Toy33, I hope you get what your after in your case because ultimately your doing it for all of us, even if your a "young male" and you have my support =)

Tango955, our good friend's old man has probably been practicing his profession longer than you have been in school. So far you have just used personal experience to bring your point across, in which wasn't very effective. And to say "grow up" to him? embarrassing from an SAU member. Effectively Toy33 is doing what you didn't do in '89, fight for his god given right. This is not to individualize you, but a heads up to what your saying. Good luck have fun.

Toy33 again good luck in your case, must be really handy to have a pop who's a lawyer. If and when you win we could all celebrate somehow and tell us the story all over again LOL

=P bye

Sorry to hijack

Edited November 7, 2006 by arbess

[Mr-Toy33]

It's come down to the fact that QLD Police seems to have their own views and laws on what can and cant be modified on a car. QLD Transport have the book of rules, laws, regulations, etc etc which they actually do abide by.

It's now going to come time for cops to actually wake up and notice that some of us actually do know what we can and cant do to our cars.

One thing I always do before actually wasting my money on a new modification is ring QLD Transport modification department and ask wheather or not I'm allowed to have this modification done to my car.

If the answer is simply no, then fair enough, i wont do it for the pure sake of gaining unwanted attention from police and qld transport nor fork out $75 fines everytime.

There has only ever been one mechanical person from this forum who has worked on my car. An even though he states what I can and cant do, he also suggest that I ring QLD transport to check for my own safetly to make sure hes right.

And also the vechicle sold to me came with the BOV that it still has on it today.

It's a simple fact here... the cop has simply sent me the inspection station to either have the defect notice told to me if its true or not and qld transport have told me the defect notice is a load of shit and that the car is not of a defect and that if I wish to fight it that I should cause simply the notice given to me is false.

I will take this to the full extent of having these fines removed and also once proven by the courts this cop is a utter wanker and doesnt know what he is doing, an offical complaint is then to be made about this cop in the terms of harassement towards "hoons" and handing our false defective notices.

Unfortantly as much as I'd like every notice handed out by this cop to be brought back up and gone over to see if its true or not, this cant be done as once you've paid a fine, you've automatically pleaded guilty and admitted to the law that the car is defective.

[Mr-Toy33]

Toy33 again good luck in your case, must be really handy to have a pop who's a lawyer. If and when you win we could all celebrate somehow and tell us the story all over again LOL

We'll hit the pubs or clubs for a few drinks as this is the start to our winning streak of cops VS hoons

[Tango955]

ATMO bovs are legal as long as the crankcase breathers are plumbed into a cath can or re-routed through the pcv valve.

There is NO LAW OR LEGISLATION whatsoever regarding pod style airfilters other than the fact that they must be attached to the inlet piping. Unsecured pod filter only applies if you don't have the filter attached to the pipework (if it has come off or missing).

see below but do your homework first, they do emit crank case gases and any air that enters the induction cycle has to be burnt via the cat converter before exiting

Exhaust has passed DB testing also so there is no problem there.

QT make the rules regarding the traffic act. Transport department enfoce them. Police are only there to enforce major breaches of these laws and only then can they direct you to a defect station.

thats strange obviously you need to become conversant with the Transport Operations (road use management) Act which gives any police officer the power to defect any vehicle. QT are just another goverment department

The only people who are authorised to issue a defect notice are Transport Department Inspectors or other authorised inspectors. Traffic cops may only direct you to a defect station...not actually defect you unless they are an authorised QT inspector as well.

see above comment, go read the legislation. A simple google search will bring it up

Tango....so you think just because he drives a Skyline and he is a young male, that means he deserves to be defected? I think you are the one who needs to do some growing up...or maybe grow some balls and challenge the defects you may have received.

actually tard i never said that. what i said is thats the way he will be treated in court. You seem to have a problem with reading things.

Cops have taken it to a new level and so must we. John is doing the right thing by chasing it. Given that he probably should have kept his mouth shut and googled the questions instead....the whole situation may have been avoided but we all do silly things on occasion.

what new level. its been this way for at least 15 years. This is the point im trying to make. Many people have tried and failed. i was trying to save him some embarrasment. The odd person has contested and won apperently on matters of luck. If you contest the technicality of the defect you wont have a chance.

We all have a right to be on the roads and if it means we have to fight for that right, then hand me a rifle coz I'll go in!

actually we dont have a right to be on the roads, its a priveledge that has to be earnt and if you stuff up it gets taken away. Thats called democracy

[The Dan]

You might want to read my other posts. As for the 'tard' I have no time to speak with people like you as you seem to on edge with society.

[GtrVspec]

3lit3 32 ur right in sense that yes things mite have been this way for many years....and will continue to get harder and get to the point that we cant do anything to the cars or even worse stop importing them into australia....but if we and i mean WE ALL dont fite we wont ever get anywhere as there seems to be a lack of unity with the car ppl or just lack of effort with these matters....true the cops win 99.9% of the time but most of the things u get defected for are wank wank...like there worried about a BOV venting lil bit of shit into the Atmospshere what about the millions of trucks and old bombs that blow smoke everyday into the air>the problem has allways been that the cops think coz they got a blue uniform that they can do anything...meanwhile we sit by and watch them do it and whinge we got another fine yeah mite be 1 point and 75 bux multiply that by couple thousand a day or week u get the picture....so if hes gona fite go all the way u ot my 110% support because its getting beyond a joke....and if we loose we can at least say we had a go....or im just blabing shit again hehehe....

[kjb_r33]

Actually I have to disagree with you there. ATMO bovs do vent crankcase fumes into the air. The rocker cover breathers are plumbed back into the intake before the turbo so therefore fumes which pass through here will be re-cycled through the system to be burnt through the engine.

Its not just the crankcase fumes. With an air flow meter, any air that passes through it is going to have the correct amount of fuel added by the ecu. Now if some of that air is dumped, the fuel that was added for the dumped air is still in there, which cause rich spikes ( massive incease in HC's and CO's).

Edited November 12, 2006 by kjb_r33

[Tango955]

To true, there are right and wrong ways to mod a car. If you spend the dollars and do it properly you can have a quality ride that goes hard and looks classy. Or you can be like most of the crowd here and spend a hundred bucks at autobarn and then whinge when you get defected.

[«Cyph3r»]

Found something that is interesting if true but i have no real legal knowledge but maybe someone here can comment on this:

"Another example, one written into your Constitution, is the right to drive. When you apply for a drivers license, you give up your right and are thereby granted a privilege. But because you exist under the Constitution, you have a right to drive. I want to clarify that it is basically a right to travel on the roads. The Supreme Court has ruled that this includes one's personal automobile. Because that is your right, you don't have to do anything to exercise it other than to exist. However, when you enter into a contract (a drivers license), you relinquish that right and subject yourselves to laws that are made regarding the privilege you are now given. As teenagers you are taught that you take drivers education, apply for a license and then you can legally drive. Of course, when you get your license you are then subject to the laws about automobile insurance, vehicle registration, the laws of the road, etc. Your traveling then becomes a privilege instead of a natural right, correct? You're not taught that you have a choice."

[Nismo_Boy]

Or you can be like most of the crowd here and spend a hundred bucks at autobarn and then whinge when you get defected.

I bought items from Autobarn for my fathers $110k+ RUF Does this make me perhaps some "common" crowd person now?

[Tango955]

If you bought a blow off valve and pod filter it does. Perhaps autobarn could put together a wannabe pack with said BOV, pod filter and a cannon. Sort of like a showbag for the doof doof hat on sideways crowd.

whoops better include some zip ties and a self tapper for that cannon. gotta do the install right uleh

[Nismo_Boy]

Aren’t Autobarn GReddy/Trust suppliers these days, which would mean decent parts I guess using your Autobarn theory means they’re not though… I do agree they have some rubbish products how ever.

None of our cars run cannons, so I guess I’m safe in that department. I’ll let some of the young guys know down at QR and Willowbank know not to wear their flat brim hats anymore as Tango said not to as well.

Lucky you brought it up, I was almost going to buy a new hat too, don’t want to fall into the Tango stereotypical crowd, seeing your opinion is so import.

Let me guess… You’re in your mid 30’s? You must be close seeing you have been in the “sceen” since the 80’s..

[subzeroR33]

Tango 955, are you a traffic cop because tango 955 is a call sign for traffic cops, and your comments sort of give it away.

Or is it just your experience dealing with cops and defects.