Electric Superchargers?

[R32TyPeM]

Anyone used one of the 12v electronic superchargers that have been circulating on ebay? Friend is interested in installing one on his n/a sr20 silvia?

waste of dollars or not?

they claim +20hp?

Regards Damo

[Medium Dave]

Complete waste of time, I read a third party test on a dyno that showed a drop in hp from the restriction!

[VB-]

then add to that, the fact that they disintegrate and u get bits of sh*t sucked into ur motor. i've heard some of these horror stories from ppl on other forums, so yeah i really wouldnt bother. how much is he lookin at paying for the electric supercahger? maybe you/us could guide him a bit better with his money

[CEF11E]

There is a really interesting read about them HERE

[PobodY]

I know - save your money, buy a 12v computer fan from DSE and whack that in!

It will do the same, and you don't even have to wait for them to mail it out to you.

I'll admit that the theory is sound enough, but in practice the fan just can't get the air-flow up enough.

EDIT: CEF11E - you are evidently the man (who know about these)!

Edited November 8, 2006 by PobodY

[Big Rizza]

My opinion is that electric superchargers are a complete waste of time. Most of them are too small to give any measurable boost pressure (we're talking 1psi at the most), and in fact just act to strangle the engine at anything above idle engine speeds.

In fact the whole concept is a complete waste of time. Why? Well, have a think about it for a second. You are taking electric energy, converting it to kinetic energy (rotating fans), then converting it into another form of kinetic energy (air pressure/velocity). This process is very inefficient, and the amount of energy reaching the engine as air pressure is probably only 15% of the electrical energy used in the first place. The energy lost as heat (both at the electric motor and in the intake air), so you get increased air temperatures leading into the engine. You then need to add more fuel to burn the extra air to prevent the engine from leaning out, meaning more fuel consumption. The blower itself would likely not be linear with engine speed, and probably result in a loss of throttle response.

My opinion is why not use your electric motor to DIRECTLY DRIVE THE CRANKSHAFT. Yes, it requires more modification, and won't sell for $20 on Ebay, but it is far more energy efficient (less energy losses), doesn't increase intake temp, potentially IMPROVES throttle response (as the electric motor can give almost instantaneous response to changes in throttle), and potentially IMPROVES fuel consumption. All you need is regenerative braking and you'd have a full blown high performance hybrid.

So yeah, in answer to your question, they are a waste of dollars, yes.

Edited November 8, 2006 by Big Rizza

[PHATR32]

of course they are a waste of time if you dont use magnets on your fuel line! (endorsed by Brock him self)

[Big Rizza]

  PHATR32 said:

of course they are a waste of time if you dont use magnets on your fuel line! (endorsed by Brock him self)

"How do we prove it works? They haven't invented the machine yet to prove it works,"

Peter Brock, regarding the "Energy Polarizer," said to magnetically align the cars molecules to improve engine performance and vehicle handling.

[2BNVS]

how some ppl can sell shit like this blows me out lol like i seen on ebay i dont have the link, twin charge your car for $92 and it will net u 70hp..btw the item u buy on ebay is not the kit, its the intructions on what to buy from the hardware store lol

ben...

[R32TyPeM]

Im not talking of a "$20 Manual"

this type of thing is what im on about,

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/TWIN-ELECTRIC-SUPER...1QQcmdZViewItem

they have a pretty elaborate website to bak it all up. after emailing them he is offering a full refund within 30

days if he is dis-satified with the result. Which is fair i guess and adds ease to the speculation. Will post the results eh. even talks of reducing lag in turbo apps, but i could think of better things to spend my own money on my already force fad car.

wish me luck...

[Big Rizza]

  R32TyPeM said:

Im not talking of a "$20 Manual"

this type of thing is what im on about,

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/TWIN-ELECTRIC-SUPER...1QQcmdZViewItem

they have a pretty elaborate website to bak it all up. after emailing them he is offering a full refund within 30

days if he is dis-satified with the result. Which is fair i guess and adds ease to the speculation. Will post the results eh. even talks of reducing lag in turbo apps, but i could think of better things to spend my own money on my already force fad car.

wish me luck...

They are suggesting only a 5% power increase. Not worth the $$$ though IMO.

  Quote

Force Flow Electric Supercharger systems can produce gains of between 2-10% in overall power output (Horse Power or Kilowatts), with average gains of around 5%. Force Flow must however recognise that there are many contributing factors to the gains seen on any given vehicles, including engine size, engine type, current intake system, air sensor types, installation methods etc. Therefore Force Flow can not offer a performance guarantee of 4-6% on all vehicles (generally 95% of all vehicles under 5.0 litre displacement).

[N I B]

They have a PC cooling fan in them!That'll get your motor racing.LOL

[R31Nismoid]

  R32TyPeM said:

Anyone used one of the 12v electronic superchargers that have been circulating on ebay? Friend is interested in installing one on his n/a sr20 silvia?

waste of dollars or not?

they claim +20hp?

Regards Damo

20hp... riight... So your going to go to ALL the effort for 15kw, approx 10-9rwkw...

Come on dude, school holidays have not started already have they?

[R31Nismoid]

  Big Rizza said:

They are suggesting only a 5% power increase. Not worth the $$$ though IMO.

1500cfm

LMFAO

  Quote

Therefore Force Flow can not offer a performance guarantee of 4-6% on all vehicles (generally 95% of all vehicles under 5.0 litre displacement).

Funny that we dont really have many motors in Aust ABOVE that size.

Pretty much counts out 99% of the market dont you think?

Stupid ebay gimmicks. Thats all ebay is good for, a joke.

I've sent them off an email, i cant wait for the reply.

  Quote

Hi.

I was wondering what the "4.0 electric supercharger" actually consits of.

Meaning, what is the "supercharger" actually made out of and what are the details surrounding it.

Being that supercharging is the compression of an engine's intake charge above atmospheric pressure, i was wondering what the actual specs surrounding the supercharger in question are.

For it to flow 1500cfm of air (as per your ebay add) it must be quite a piece of gear.

Looking forward to your reply as im looking for some cheap HP gains.

Thanks - Ash

[Big Rizza]

I reckon this 5% power gain is probably due to replacing the standard airbox with twin pod filters, rather than any appreciable effect of the superchargers...

[R31Nismoid]

God this is funny

  Quote

>From: "Force Flow" <ramon@force-flow.com>

>Subject: RE: Force-flow website enquiry

>Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 19:26:55 +1000

>

>

>Hi mate, Not quite sure what it is your asking, but the blower itself is

>built into a 4 inch aluminium housing, has a powerful electric motor that

>spins at around 27000 rpm for short bursts at full throttle, driving the

>impellor to ram air into the intake. Everything is there at the website, but

>happy to answer any specific questions you have. Fitted to an N/A 2.0 engine

>you should get around 5-6% overall HP gain + stronger torque and

>acceleration response. Cheers.....

[R31Nismoid]

and my reply

  Quote

Im asking for more details as i said...

*Meaning, what is the \"supercharger\" actually made out of and what are the details surrounding it.*

So rather than just telling me its a fan... because something that spins and pushes air is just that, a fan and not a supercharger.

What is the specs of the impellor etc, and any design diagrams to help me understand how its compressing the air.

And when you say "ram" the air, is its just acting like a fan, or is it compressing the air?

Im trying to justify the cost, and to be honest your product sounds like a larger version of the CPU fan of the PC im using to type this.

Please advise

[Cubes]

lmao.

[DAN00H]

the only thing that would be any good is getting hold of one of the newly developed dyson electric motors that spins at 100,000rpm and build an electric/ turbo hybrid. Imagine an RB with something the size of a T51 with instant response + the ability to set the boost via motor speed... only problem is the 240volt energy source from your car hopefully it is something that can be developed in the future...

[Big Rizza]

  DAN00H said:

the only thing that would be any good is getting hold of one of the newly developed dyson electric motors that spins at 100,000rpm and build an electric/ turbo hybrid. Imagine an RB with something the size of a T51 with instant response + the ability to set the boost via motor speed... only problem is the 240volt energy source from your car hopefully it is something that can be developed in the future...

The 240 volts isn't the problem (see attached Autospeed.com excerpt). I'd be much more worried about how much current you are drawing! You'll burn out your alternator and drain your battery everytime your foot hits the loud pedal!

  Quote

Inverters

An inverter is a device that turns the car battery’s nominal 12V DC into AC mains power – here in Australia, 240V at 50Hz. Inverters have been around for years – they’re used in solar powered homes and many boats and motorhomes. Trouble is, they used to cost an arm and a leg. But the cost of inverters has now plummeted, with them available from as little as AUD$50.

There are two key specifications to watch when picking an inverter. The first is output power. A small inverter typically has a maximum output of 100 watts. As you’d expect, they’re then limited to driving a continuous load of 100W - for example, two 50 watt lightbulbs or more usefully, a laptop power supply. The cost for an inverter of this capacity is currently about AUD$50.

From there the power capacity of inverters goes up and up – a big one is capable of supplying a mains power load of 1500W (1.5kW!). With this sort of power you can drive TVs, microwave ovens, sound systems, big power tools and so on. An inverter of this power will cost you about AUD$500.

So that’s it then? Just buy the biggest that you can afford?

Nope.

A key point to remember is that all the power is coming from your car battery. That 1500W inverter can draw over 125 amps – about the same as simultaneously having 30 car headlights on! So to avoid a flat battery, you’ll need at minimum to have the engine running all of the time. When running big inverters, realistically the alternator will also need to be upgraded. So while big inverters are very useful in some situations (like those solar powered houses), for general car use they’re way too big.

The other important specification is the type of output that the inverter has. Mains power is AC (alternating current) which has a curving up/down movement in voltage called a sine wave. Most inverters don’t produce a sine wave output but instead something called a ‘modified square wave’. Modified square wave inverters will run most equipment without problems but electric motors can run hotter (and be noisier) and some laser printers and variable speed power tools won’t work properly. As you’d expect from the name, sine wave converters produce an output that better replicates what comes out of the wall socket. All mains-powered items will work fine with sine wave inverters.

A good compromise for a car is a 400 watt modified square wave inverter. The one shown here – Jaycar Electronics cat no MI5064 – has a maximum input current of 40 amps but at 400 watts still has enough power to be extremely useful. It’s also relatively compact and has automatic shutdowns if overloaded, overheated, or if the supply battery drops below 10 volts. (The latter saves a dead flat battery.) This inverter costs AUD$160. Another advantage of this particular design is that the input and outputs are electrically isolated, allowing both the AC and DC circuits to be earthed if required.

When selecting an inverter look at these specs:

Continuous power rating

Output type - modified square wave or sinewave

Protection against overheating, output overload, low battery voltage

Fan cooling

Fuse protection

Input/output electrical isolation

http://autospeed.drive.com.au/cms/A_2332/article.html

Edited November 13, 2006 by Big Rizza