Need Advice On Emanage Vs. Afc Neo

[MZTRBO]

Hi.

1.I need a piggyback for my Auto R33 and want to no which piggyback is better the new AFC NEO or a greddy emanage....pros, cons.

I have researched these already but I want to hear from peoples experience or knowledge on these 2 products..as they are both cheap also..

Few questions re: car setup.

these are the following mods..

-Hybrid turbo, r33 hi-flow front and vg30 BB rear

-FMIC

-3in exhaust, wrapped dump+front pipe

Now the car is hitting boost cut or rich and retard mode atm. I have searched for a few things now and am confused with mismatched results....

2.I no i need a fuel pump, what power will a gtr 33 fp support.....or is there a better alternative for the price.

3.I dont want to fork out for injectors and my question is at what power level do the stock injectors run out or close to 100% duty cycle ....with or without fpr.

4.I dont no much on the turbo but it made/produced 210rwkw on an auto rb20 with oversize valves at 20psi, my question is how much power do you think i could make and what else do i need to support this power level..

I am going to get a transmission cooler for the auto but thats it for the auto...

Thank you in advance...

Edited December 17, 2006 by MZTRBO

[khunjeng]

I ran about 250 with an emanage in the r33

I ran one in my FTO also...

Basically did the same with the SAFCII...but with the SAFC u get some cool screen...

The emange can have optional harness' for injectors and boost...however if your not planning to do much the SAFC will be ok to clean up ur AFRs/

However if ur thinking to do stuff in the future...the emanage might be a better option.

Injectors wont be an issue with you planned power levels...they will max out in my exp. when you get to about 280-300...

anyway thats my exp. cos thats what I have done.

[dangerman4]

However if ur thinking to do stuff in the future...the emanage might be a better option.

Injectors wont be an issue with you planned power levels...they will max out in my exp. when you get to about 280-300...

anyway thats my exp. cos thats what I have done.

I assume your talking horse power.

if you meen kws at the wheels you would need 200 psi rail pressure to get 300 kws from the standard injectors.

if its a series 1 dont waste your time with a piggy back, stick a MV AUTO shift kit and a PFC in it and get it tuned.

you will never look back.

[mad082]

the emanage is a bit more, but you can get a straight plug and play harness (costs $200 though).

i'm yet to find out for sure but i think the plug and play harness allows you to do both fuel and timing. and it saves you stuffing round with splicing wires.

i'm looking at getting an emange ultimate when the bank balance lets me. i have a manual and want to be different, and aren't much of a fan of the pfc, (for no real reason). the emanage ultimate allows you to remove the air flow meter, and basically does the same job as the pfc, but retains the drivability of a stock ecu, and is good for auto's.

[MZTRBO]

Its got series 2 running gear, car is a s1.5.

Does the emanage (blue) do fuel and ignition with a generic harness, or is there a reason you need a model specific harness???

Im thinking i will at least pull 220-230rwkw...

I can actually get the emanage cheaper then the afc neo (2nd hand)...i think i might go with the emanage at the moment..

Thanx for the replys...keep em coming I have to make a decision soon..i

[MZTRBO]

im interested in the previous threads dangerman re: the mv auto shift kits + powerfc...though for now i might stick with a cheap piggy back and a cheap tune..

and with the mv auto stuff, im in sydney and it seems like so much stuffing around.

Cheers

[MZTRBO]

mad082, ive looked alot into the ultimate and if buying the blue one or the ultimate brand new the ultimate is definately worth it.

[MZTRBO]

another thing that i couldnt find, will either of these piggybacks eliminate speed cut etc..????????

[dangerman4]

incase you have been living under a rock. lol

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...howtopic=146489

have a read.

and yes it will stop the speed limiter.

but why are you going over it?

[N I B]

Need Emanage if you want ignition control.Ultimate has solved coil problems.

[Chris_R33GTSt]

Hey Mad,

Im looking at an Emanage Ultimate in my Manual 33 for pretty much the same reasons. Still have to do some more research but i reckon it will interface quite nicely with my planned carpc.

I read somewhere that it can take live readings from a wideband 02 sensor and self tune. Does anyone know about this?

[N I B]

It cant.They work well in cars that need the factory ECU for some strong reason,If not buy a Wolf or PFC.

[rev210]

The emanage ultimate can be used with a wideband O2 sensor and has an AFR target map function for it.

It also has 8 data logging channels using it's own on board memory and 30 when hooked up to a PC. and maps for individual cylinder adjustment of ignition and fuel.

Looks like they added a fair bit of fruit to it.

http://www.trust-power.com/overseas/produc...n_ultimate.html

[satanic]

MZTRBO since you're in Sydney; have a look at the HKS F-CON V Pro... kicks the living daylights out of all the above mentioned ECUs (yes, including the PFC)

If you pick one up from interstate, you'll get one for next to nothing (compared to the new price of almost $2k)

Tuning is done only in Sydney at the moment but trust me it'll be more than worth your time. I've got one in my auto R34 and it runs like a charm... since the R33 doesn't have the tiptronic shift logic to deal with, it'll be even better/easier.

Don't let those who hate the F-CON deter you either, do your own research, have a chat with Tom @ BD4s and make your own decision.

PS: I don't have any affiliation with BD4s, they only tune my car

[satanic]

Forgot to mention that the F-CON is the most favoured ECU in Japan (setting myself for WWIII with SAU with this statement) and it's becoming even more popular in other countries.

[rev210]

satanic,

I tried to look up the specs on the F-con Pro and it doesn't seem to have anything that stands out over the ultimate version of the emanage?

It seems to be quite decent as an ecu.

But, it also seems to cost more and since you don't get to own the tuning software you can't data log at home and your stuck with a tuner who has.

I'm interested in the claim that it is the most favoured ecu in japan. What data do you have to support that claim? It's just I don't seem many imports coming in with F-con aftermarket ecus vs other types, granted a couple but not the majority.

[satanic]

satanic,

I tried to look up the specs on the F-con Pro and it doesn't seem to have anything that stands out over the ultimate version of the emanage?

It seems to be quite decent as an ecu.

But, it also seems to cost more and since you don't get to own the tuning software you can't data log at home and your stuck with a tuner who has.

I'm interested in the claim that it is the most favoured ecu in japan. What data do you have to support that claim? It's just I don't seem many imports coming in with F-con aftermarket ecus vs other types, granted a couple but not the majority.

Well for starters...

E-Manage Map Resolutions = 16x16

E-Manage Ultimate Map Resolutions = 16x16

F-CON V Pro Map Resolutions = 32 x 32

The F-CON V Pro can control up to eight injectors and D Jetro or L Jetro setups. --- Injectors can be set to fire as batch, sequentially or staged.

Even though the E-Manage units can control injectors in batch/sequential there is no mention of the number of injectors supported nor is there mention of the setups supported.

E-Manage can datalog up to 8 channels...

F-CON V Pro can datalog as many channels as you can throw at it provided you have all the hardware...

E-Manage = no option to change from AFM to MAP

F-CON V Pro = option available

E-Manage on board monitoring done through Profec E-01 / Laptop

F-CON V Pro on board monitoring done through F-CON Navigator / Laptop

E-Manage = 2 maps available

F-CON V Pro = 16 - 40 maps available

As I stated in my previous post; the F-CON is not on the same level as the E-Manage hence the price difference... many car enthusiasts dub the F-CON V Pro as the "Motec of Japan" - and as we all know, you really do get what you pay for. My advice for MZTRBO was to get a second hand unit which will cost the same price as a new E-Manage (blue). Adding all the other bells and whistles will bring the cost up to the same price as a new E-Manage Ultimate (without the extra harnesses).

Tuning is comparable and is all down to the individual... if you knew what I paid for my tuning sessions you'd be kicking and screaming too.

Now as for my claim on the F-CON being the most favoured... I am making specific reference to those who are actually serious about the level of modification. It was HPI who had a list of the 10 fastest GTRs in the world, if I remember correctly, 7 of them used the F-CON V Pro...

Tonnes of guys in the UK and the USA use the F-CONs; world's fastest R33 GTST uses one, most of the JGTC guys use it... what more proof do you want? Do some research; it's only used rarely in Australia because nobody tunes it here.

S

[Howie]

Very informative post stan.. i was looking at the emanage also, but i'll have a look into the f-con now.

btw stan, you get my pm mate?

Edited December 22, 2006 by Howie

[paulr33]

Hi.

1.I need a piggyback for my Auto R33 and want to no which piggyback is better the new AFC NEO or a greddy emanage....pros, cons.

I have researched these already but I want to hear from peoples experience or knowledge on these 2 products..as they are both cheap also..

Few questions re: car setup.

these are the following mods..

-Hybrid turbo, r33 hi-flow front and vg30 BB rear

-FMIC

-3in exhaust, wrapped dump+front pipe

Now the car is hitting boost cut or rich and retard mode atm. I have searched for a few things now and am confused with mismatched results....

2.I no i need a fuel pump, what power will a gtr 33 fp support.....or is there a better alternative for the price.

3.I dont want to fork out for injectors and my question is at what power level do the stock injectors run out or close to 100% duty cycle ....with or without fpr.

4.I dont no much on the turbo but it made/produced 210rwkw on an auto rb20 with oversize valves at 20psi, my question is how much power do you think i could make and what else do i need to support this power level..

I am going to get a transmission cooler for the auto but thats it for the auto...

Thank you in advance...

if it was my workshop and you came to me as a customer here's what i would be suggesting

1. fuel pump

GTR33 fuel pump (good for 300rwkw) and direct fit, if you are worried about using an on old pump then bosch 040

2. injector duty & max

the stock injectors will max around approx 250rwkw give or take. it depends on the tune, and fuel reg. we would upgrade the reg to the nismo item (direct fit) and tune based on that

3. power and boost pressure

you should be able to make 240rwk to 250rwkw ish on your car depending on tune, engine condition etc.

i would expect to run around 1.3bar on the this at the most, perhaps 1.2bar but boost shouldn't decide your power goal or how the car will be setup.

dyno it and tune it at 1 bar and see what comes out, usually after 1 bar every psi extra on a highflow usually only gives very small gains, but worth a try anyway. 1 bar is probably a good indication of power made

-summary -

add gtr 33 fuel pump (or 040 if u want new). add nismo fuel reg.

full tune at 1 bar and see what comes out, montoring knocking (on the safc), fuel pres (dyno sensor), inj duty (consult cable) and try and tune as best you can

i would go for a 2nd hand safc II the reason being cost and simplicity. a piggyback solution should be simple and cheap. if it doesnt fit under those then dont bother, i wouldnt bother with emanage or fcon as your budget probably doesnt allow for it and the safc II will give you 90% of what you need for a less cost.

i dont play the whole "the top 7 gtrs use this ecu" blah blah crap, her car its not going to be a top 10 gtr nor is she in japan so its irrelevant.

any ecu can make a car go fast, its how well its tuned and of course additional features it has, but that being said i dont think it applies in this case

[mad082]

E-Manage = no option to change from AFM to MAP

F-CON V Pro = option available

the emanage ultimate does have the option to remove the air flow meter. it uses the map sensor off the profec b.