Gtr Performance Q's

[No Crust Racing]

I've done quite a bit of searching and have not found clear answers as yet.

On the provision that the professional inspection/comp test goes well tomorrow I'll be taking ownership of a Series II 33 GTR V-Spec (Yay for me). It currently has a Turbo Back system and an aftermarket FMIC core but that's all, stock boost, no management, not even air filters.

I'd like to do something intake wise and have come down to either Apexi Panel filters or the Apexi Power Intake Kit. If using the Intake Kit, have people been able to find a good cold air box that still uses the snorkel? If using the panel filters, is there much of a gain? I assume cleaning/servicing them is simply a matter of blowing them out with a compressor? How long do they last?

In addition, can some GTR owners relay their experiences with boosting the stock turbo's as I've read plenty of horror stories of turbo's letting go and the engine inhaling ceramic dust - not pretty.

Given I'm coming from a GTST with a turbo back exhaust and POD/CAI only, the GTR is certainly a step up power wise. Having said that, we all love to tinker and get more power and with this in mind I was contemplating going PowerFC and some Cam Gears and possibly some more boost at that stage, dependent on what people say about boosting the stock turbos. With this setup, and the above mentioned filters, what kind of power figure would I be looking at on stock boost and on say 12-14(I read 14 is the absolute max for stock turbo's?)

All info appreciated but I'm particularly interested in hearing from other GTR owners who have done the above.

Cheers

Edited December 21, 2006 by ActionDan

[djr81]

On the provision that the professional inspection/comp test goes well tomorrow I'll be taking ownership of a Series II 33 GTR V-Spec (Yay for me). It currently has a Turbo Back system and an aftermarket FMIC core but that's all, stock boost, no management, not even air filters.

I'd like to do something intake wise and have come down to either Apexi Panel filters or the Apexi Power Intake Kit. If using the Intake Kit, have people been able to find a good cold air box that still uses the snorkel? If using the panel filters, is there much of a gain? I assume cleaning/servicing them is simply a matter of blowing them out with a compressor? How long do they last?

Chuck a K & N filter at it. They are fine for this sort of hp. Service the thing every 5000kms or so, depends on how dusty it is around where you are.

In addition, can some GTR owners relay their experiences with boosting the stock turbo's as I've read plenty of horror stories of turbo's letting go and the engine inhaling ceramic dust - not pretty.

Stay below 1 bar boost & the things will live a long & happy life.

Given I'm coming from a GTST with a turbo back exhaust and POD/CAI only, the GTR is certainly a step up power wise. Having said that, we all love to tinker and get more power and with this in mind I was contemplating going PowerFC and some Cam Gears and possibly some more boost at that stage, dependent on what people say about boosting the stock turbos. With this setup, and the above mentioned filters, what kind of power figure would I be looking at on stock boost and on say 12-14(I read 14 is the absolute max for stock turbo's?)

Just over 300rwhp - maybe up to 330. Depends on the dyno/day/motor/tune etc etc etc.

[sewid]

I'd like to do something intake wise and have come down to either Apexi Panel filters or the Apexi Power Intake Kit. If using the Intake Kit, have people been able to find a good cold air box that still uses the snorkel? If using the panel filters, is there much of a gain? I assume cleaning/servicing them is simply a matter of blowing them out with a compressor? How long do they last?

Neither. Apexi panel filters are expensive and rubbish and are not cleanable as they are just paper type. Pod filters are a waste of time money and power on a street car. Z-tune - Airbox, Mines GTR - Airbox. I personally am making 300awkw with a K&N panel filter in the stock airbox..................

K&N panel filter are cleanable and have a long lifetime or if you want to give them a try get a Splitfire panel filter which looks remarkably similar to a K&N to me but about half the price.

[Beer Baron]

another vote for the K+N panel. top quality, high flow and last a very, very long time.

[No Crust Racing]

Cheers for the feedback. Looks like K & N Panel is the go, I'm currently using a K & N Pod and like the cleanable nature.

With regards to boost on the stock turbos. Could the car be safely tuned for 14 or will this drastically reduce the life of the turbos? I get that you're saying don't exceed a bar but if the car is tuned for an even 14psi, will this cause issues? I understand it's a much of a muchness question in that all turbo's will eventually fail and that they could go at any time at any PSI etc. Just looking for a happy medium.

The power figure mentioned, 300rwhp, which is around 225rwkw's, is that on stock boost or with boost added? I was under the impression that on around 14psi they make around 250rwkw's with a tune and cam gears.

Cheers

Edited December 21, 2006 by ActionDan

[PHATR32]

Pod filters are a waste of time money and power on a street car.

wtf?

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...p;#entry2766309

[djr81]

Cheers for the feedback. Looks like K & N Panel is the go, I'm currently using a K & N Pod and like the cleanable nature.

With regards to boost on the stock turbos. Could the car be safely tuned for 14 or will this drastically reduce the life of the turbos? I get that you're saying don't exceed a bar but if the car is tuned for an even 14psi, will this cause issues? I understand it's a much of a muchness question in that all turbo's will eventually fail and that they could go at any time at any PSI etc. Just looking for a happy medium.

The power figure mentioned, 300rwhp, which is around 225rwkw's, is that on stock boost or with boost added? I was under the impression that on around 14psi they make around 250rwkw's with a tune and cam gears.

Cheers

The ceramic turbos fail suddenly - basically the turbine (exhaust wheel) falls off them & spits blades back into the motor. 14# is safe.

300rwhp is at about 13# to 14#.

Figures can lie & liers can figure. People tend to talk up their hp numbers as if 5 or even 10 rwhp will make a spit of difference. 250rwkW is 333rwhp. Which is probably about right for a good RB26 with the stuff you mentioned.

[No Crust Racing]

So if I'm not in a position to be forking over 3k+ for N1's then I should probably leave the boost at stock levels, add some cam gears and get a safe tune for reliable power rather than more power but less safety. I've heard of people blowing turbo's on RB25's after 12ps which I thought were ceramic as well (mines a Series II) but never of the engine ingesting the blades, why is this such a problem on RB26's? If it's such a huge issue why do people even run 14 if the turbo's are so sensitive?

[djr81]

So if I'm not in a position to be forking over 3k+ for N1's then I should probably leave the boost at stock levels, add some cam gears and get a safe tune for reliable power rather than more power but less safety. I've heard of people blowing turbo's on RB25's after 12ps which I thought were ceramic as well (mines a Series II) but never of the engine ingesting the blades, why is this such a problem on RB26's? If it's such a huge issue why do people even run 14 if the turbo's are so sensitive?

Ok, if you haven't already picked up on what I am trying to say. 14# is safe. My R32 has been running that for three years.

RB25's are not the same motor, so to be honest who give a rats about them?

Ingesting blades isn't a problem particular to RB26's. It is what happens when your turbine goes from 100,000rpm to 0 in the blink of an eye. The stuff has to go somewhere & as often as not it goes into the motor. It happens on steel wheel turbos occassionally too, but less frequently because their failure mode is less sudden.

People will always push the limits of the car/motor. There are nuggets out there boasting how much rwhp they get on such things as stock fuel pumps, injectors, afm's, turbos, cams etc etc etc. For some stupid reason people think it is cool to say I got n hundred rwhp & I am still running a stock warbler. I have no idea why that is other than to suggest that some people are, infact, complete uckwits.

[No Crust Racing]

LoL, OK point taken, 14 is OK.

Is there much merit in an oil cooler? Cooler would have to be better but I'm thinking it might be overkill on a street car. I also like the ide aof an oil relocation kit as the filter location on an RB is a pain in the ass if you wanna do it without spilling oil everywhere >.<

[djr81]

LoL, OK point taken, 14 is OK.

Is there much merit in an oil cooler? Cooler would have to be better but I'm thinking it might be overkill on a street car. I also like the ide aof an oil relocation kit as the filter location on an RB is a pain in the ass if you wanna do it without spilling oil everywhere >.<

For a street car, probably not. If you go to a track, yes.

You will spill oil on the front diff when you change it. You can either get used to it or get a relocator.

[No Crust Racing]

I was contemplating going to the track a few times but not super hard sessions but still, cooler oil can't hurt.

I've spilt enough oil on the cross member in my 33 to know it shits me to tears when it happens so a relocater might be the go.

For the record, is anyone running Pod's with a cold air box using the stock snorkel?

Edited December 21, 2006 by ActionDan

[Ant97GTR]

Is there much merit in an oil cooler? Cooler would have to be better but I'm thinking it might be overkill on a street car.

That depends on how your drive. Any track work or extended runs on country roads in summer def fit an oil cooler.

[ferni]

1 bar boost, cam gears, and powerFC, you'll have a very nice power package.

Air filters aren't a big deal, you'll barely notice anything if at all, get what you want. I run stock airbox as well. A good exaust makes more of a difference.

Oil cooler only really needed if your going to give it real stick - ie track or hard time on twisty roads. Keep an eye on your oil temp, if you can get it above 100-110 on the street you're doing well and should probably get an oil cooler.

[No Crust Racing]

Is there an official figure on what boost they run with the restrictor removed? I've read various texts but 14-15psi seems to be the norm, is this accurate as it would save buying an EBC or is there more control/more benefit of an EBC? I'm thinking would be good to be able to wind the boost down a bit on a hot day/track day if I'm gonna give it some stick.

Edited December 21, 2006 by ActionDan

[djr81]

Is there an official figure on what boost they run with the restrictor removed? I've read various texts but 14-15psi seems to be the norm, is this accurate as it would save buying an EBC or is there more control/more benefit of an EBC? I'm thinking would be good to be able to wind the boost down a bit on a hot day/track day if I'm gonna give it some stick.

No there isn't a figure & no those quoted aren't accurate. It varies quite a bit from car to car & depends on the condition of the stock bleed valve.

An EBC is more accurate than a bleed valve. If you want an adjustable bleed valve Turbosmart make a good, cheap one.

If you are going to a track day don't wind down the boost, put some pro strength Nulon Octane Booster in the fuel tank. What is the point of having a motor tuned for useful hp only to turn it off when you would really like to be using it?

[No Crust Racing]

Valid point, just throwing some ideas around. It's weird but for some reason I see the GTR as being so much more delicate than my GTS25T in how I will probably treat it but in reality, it's probably a crap load stronger.

[R31Nismoid]

wtf?

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...p;#entry2766309

You obviously have no idea what your talking about.

Stock Airbox'ed GTR's down here are making 350rwkw without an issue, so i dont see what was wrong with sewids comments, they more accurate than some wasteland thread

[No Crust Racing]

I'm still keen to know if anyone is running Dual Pods, not necessarily Apexi ones, and using a Cold Air Box using the stock snorkle. I have this setup atm and it works well and sounds excellent. Given the cost difference though, I think Panels might be the go.

[sewid]

wtf?

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...p;#entry2766309

Smart guy aren't ya. So why don't you tell me how pod filters are better than an enclosed factory airbox on a street car? You'd know right because you've tested back to back right.... right.

I personally have tested back to back and i know a good amount of people who have high powered GTRs and agree with me.

I mean why would you even consider pods on a street GTR?

- Attracts defects

- Increase air intake temps

- Cost more to buy and more to buy the inevitable cold air partition you need to install to stop the air intake temp rise

The alternative is the factory airbox which plenty of people making more power than you use and have no problems at all. Doesn't attract the police and keeps intake temps down due to being enclosed and drawing in air through the standard snorkels (or snorkels in the case of GTR).

But hey if you like to throw lots of money at a colorful wang extension instead of putting your money into actually useful modifications who am I to judge...