2007 F1 Season

[m3gtr]

for once I completely agree with you there.

Richard, why exactly have you got it in for a guy that bested Schumi in his prime, not once but twice, taking machinery out of the equation?

i dont see you argument. Ive met both of them and they seem like regular joes apart from all the photo opps..

Edited July 5, 2007 by m3gtr

[ctjet]

Alonso is the new schumi in a way

Those who like him, love him... those who dont like him, despise him

[m3gtr]

Alonso is the new schumi in a way

Those who like him, love him... those who dont like him, despise him

cant really hold it against a guy who hates to lose..

although taking that into account, no one should chuck their toys outta the pram the minute things arent going their way...

[Beer Baron]

i don't know what it is about alonso, but I just can't stand the guy. I think his first few years of F1 he was not so hot. he had all the good gear but didn't really do anything with it. I mean in 04 schuey took double the number of points as ferny. 03 was pretty much the same deal. he didn't score any points at minardi. I just think he's a midfield driver (granted the top of the midfield) that's been lucky enough to get into some damn fine cars. sure he beat schuey twice, and at least when gonzo was given his WDC capable car he actually got the job done and won it, but especially schueys last season I would say he easily had gonzo's measure, he just didn't have a reliable car and the monaco thing didn't help either. the fact that alonso is so easily bettered by a rookie team mate shows 2 things. 1. how good the big mac is and 2. how average alonso is.

[ctjet]

I think your brushing his double WDC wins aside too quickly by saying "sure he beat schuey twice" He didnt just beat schumi you understand... he also beat an very quick kimi Raikonnen and Mclaren in 05. Also the fact that he won enough points in the opening rounds of the 2006 season to negate the fact that Renault lost their mass damper system and hence a lot of the front end balance MID SEASON, was luck on the side of Ferrari. And lets not start on the whole 'holding up Massa in Monza' joke. Ferrari only ever displayed more speed than Renault after that controversy. I would suggest that if Renault had been allowed to run their system, they would have smashed Ferrari quite badly by the time the season ran its course.

You cant just brush aside his somtimes remamarkable quali performances against quite obviously stronger rivals. Or his ability to withstand pressure from very experieneced drivers and teams. The guy is a legend in the wet, something some of his rivals (*cough* Massa) are STILL yet to master. The man is good, rank him against his team mates and his shaded them all. You have also remember the guy is only 25 years old, he's still very young.... 25 ffs!!

And its all very well to say Kimi's speed has left his this year because he is having trouble adapting to the tyres. Michelin and Renault were absolutely in sync for many years, Alonso is also on a completely different set of tyres much like Kimi. But i've never once heard anyone bring that up. What if schumi had to adapt to Michelin rubber after most of his career on Bridgestone? What sort of job would he be doing? People are too quick to judge.

Alonso might be an arse, ill be the first to admit it, but classing him as mid-field is a gross underestimation of his abilities. He may not be schumi to you, but the guy is fast, very consistant and is hungry to win... If i had to pick a driver in todays field to pilot one of my cars, he's the guy i would kicking down doors for. Much like many of you i would suspect.

Our server is down, i having nothing to do

/end

[Beer Baron]

well I have no decent answer to that except to say that half your argument centered around ferrari v renault. not alonso v schuey v the world.

yeah, perhaps I am a bit harsh on old dirty sanchez, but I can't help but have my sad little man fantasies about schuey and his massive jaw.

I guess what shits me is. look at schueys career. he was always at the top of the game. and always great to watch. wet weather??? schuey is the rain freakin master. and I guess I just felt a bit put out that this young talented guy (alonso) came along, and sure won 2 WDCs but people are saying stuff like "he is better than schuey" "the next schuey" "blah blah" and I took offence I mean yeah he's good and had 2 good seasons, but in 06 he beat schuey by about 12 points. and considering schuey pretty much lost 10 in that monaco thing and another 10 in japan, and then had tyre failures in his last race at brazil it was a pretty bloody close run thing. you'd hardly say schuey got smashed, but that's the way everyone was talking it up. 05 was a different story, and a woefull year for ferrari, and schuey too I guess. he DID get smashed by alonso that year with alonso doubling schueys points. but the 2 years before that it was the other way around. so I'd say on balance over the years they raced together schuey dominated alonso, except for 05. alonso is a great driver, but he is so 1 dimensional to me, and so massively camp. I can respect that he is a great F1 driver, but I'll never be a fan.

[ctjet]

Whether we like it or not Schumi was Ferrari and Alonso was Renault. Both of them drove their teams to success and without them you can see whats left behind. Look whats happened to Mclaren since Alonso jumped on board... their reliablity is very impressive. And Ferrari? I havent seen that many red car retirements in a very long time.

LOL look to be honest i think your holding the old schum a little to close to your heart baron... we all know he was good but poeple get old and have to move on. Nobody will ever be the next schumi, or senna or prost or anything... in 10 years time people will be saying <insert name> will be the next Alonso, and ill be greatly offended like you are now with Schumi.

Dont spend you time hating the man, you could spend the time so much more wisely by enjoying the racing and the drama of the next spisode of our fortnightly soap

[Beer Baron]

yeah what it boils down to is me having a bone on for schuey. I'm 26 so I've been wathcing schuey race since I was a pretty young guy basically from my early teens through to know. and I've seen him race at melbourne every year for the last 5 or 6 years. I think 2002 is a stand out for me as schuey won that race and webber came in 5th in his debut. the place went mental when that happend. lots of schuey fans celebrating, and lots of new webber fans converting! I have so many fond memories of watching schuey race at a time when F1 (to me) was a lot more exciting. These last 3 years it seems F1 has gone a bit off. I mean even look back to the late 90s and the drivers all seemed much more willing to risk binning their cars (and often did) to put out quick laps, or big overtaking moves. and schuey was one of the best. I think the racing then seemed much more 'frantic' that seems to be the most appropriate word to sum it up. I was always on the edge of my seat. now adays it's much more to do with strategy and whilst I still love watching the races it's not frantic any more. I'm almost relaxed when watching it. It seems all the movement up and down the field happens gradually, and you know what's coming long before it happens. I reckon forget traction control. bring back slick tyres and more importantly bring back full manual gear changes. maybe even H pattern! it would mean a lot more passing with missed gears etc happening from time to time. maybe I just need to accept the fact that schuey is gone.

[ctjet]

I think you'll find the lack of on track action is due to the FIA's hard on for utterly rediculous rules and nazi like stance on assimilation, and not he result of drivers becoming more passive in their driving skills. I second the dumb down of some technologies, its making it far too easy to drive these things... ffs Vettel is 19 and he got his car in the points on his first drive!!

But i still thing the drivers skills are as good as ever, these cars are mightly fast and you have to be on you toes to keep it on the island. Im just rolling with the punches these days, hoping that they dont completely wreck the sport before some time in the future im able to watch a race with my son and say "mate, you know how poontang i knocked back in my younger days just so i could come home to watch these races every fortnight"

... he'll be a lucky boy

Edited July 6, 2007 by ctjet

[djr81]

I think you'll find the lack of on track action is due to the FIA's hard on for utterly rediculous rules and nazi like stance on assimilation, and not he result of drivers becoming more passive in their driving skills. I second the dumb down of some technologies, its making it far too easy to drive these things... ffs Vettel is 19 and he got his car in the points on his first drive!!

But i still thing the drivers skills are as good as ever, these cars are mightly fast and you have to be on you toes to keep it on the island. Im just rolling with the punches these days, hoping that they dont completely wreck the sport before some time in the future im able to watch a race with my son and say "mate, you know how poontang i knocked back in my younger days just so i could come home to watch these races every fortnight"

... he'll be a lucky boy

Wow you knocked back the captain of the Australian cricket team?

Personally I never liked Schumacher since him & Walkinshaw stitched up Roberto Moreno.

Anyway Adelaide was always better than Albert Park.

A bit like Monaco really, ahh memories.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2KfCtTcG0k...ted&search=

Schumacher was a hack. A hack I tell you..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrpYIq0NbFM...ted&search=

Edited July 6, 2007 by djr81

[Beer Baron]

your youtube evidence doesn't hurt me. (as I can't watch them at work )

[Necx0]

Interesting point you should bring up Baron.....I have developed the opinion that there is 1 major obstacle to overtaking these days. The drivers.

Of course its easy for me to sit at home and say "oh he should have a go" but no-one is really prepared to take risks now. People say you can't overtake in F1....bullshit!! If you REALLY want that place.....you will get it.

The man who has helped me develop this opinion more than anyone......Alonso. I am not a huge fan of his but he is willing to take a risk and subsequently when people talk about the overtaking moves of this era he is the one they will talk about.

Taking Schumacher around the OUTSIDE of 130R at Suzuka, opening lap of Hungary 06 and another demostration on Heidfeld at Magny Cours 07. It doesn't always work, looks at Canada and Bahrain for this year. But at least he is willing to have a go!!

[m3gtr]

Richard you are entitled to your opinion but you dont really have a base for sledging alonso except for the bone in your pants, as you put it, for schumi..

I used to seriously dislike Michael and here is a collection of race clips comparing senna to schumi that im sure will make you go a little...how should i put it? ..."limp".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7__-hESRD0g...ted&search=

He was a pretty dirty racer as everyone knows. I was in Adelaide when he belted Hill out of the championship for his first crown. I witnessed his blatant ramming of Jacques at Estoril in 1997. I cringed at the farces of Austria gate and Indianapolis. I couldnt believe the audacity and dangerous tendencies he showed in literally driving other competitors off the road when he felt like it and that on a regular basis. I was appalled at his pathetic attempt to cover up an obviously intentional error to block the road on Alonso's qualifying lap in Monaco last year. His contempt for Hakkinnen and Coulthard during their time at McLaren, a time where a Ferrari resurgence was gaining momentum is the stuff of legend. Think how he has, more often than not, escaped punishment from the powers that be.

It was for these reasons among others i found it hard to respect him as one of the greatest due to his mistake smeared copybook of a career.

Alonso on the other hand possesses more sportsmanship than the great German and has displayed that on many occasions during his brief career. Ive seen his latin temperament get the better of him a number of times but ive not seen him once recklessly endanger a rival all for the sake of a championship point.

perhaps that ruthlessness was what got Michael all those championships but dont discount that the "gonzo" already has 2, went about it completely differently, is 25 with at least 10 years left in him if he wants and has the equipment needed to do the job just as Michael did, but now faces the salivating prospect, at least for us viewers, of having to go up against Hamilton in the sister car who might just actually be faster than him. Not to mention he ferraris breathing down his exhaust pipes.

...ill make you as bet, Richard.

If Alonso wins the championship you have to become a convert and if he doesnt, beers on me next time your in Tokyo.

Hes younger than you too....and your probably just jealous of all the poontang he gets and tha fact that hes much better looking than you!! :)

[Beer Baron]

...ill make you as bet, Richard.

If Alonso wins the championship you have to become a convert and if he doesnt, beers on me next time your in Tokyo.

Hes younger than you too....and your probably just jealous of all the poontang he gets and tha fact that hes much better looking than you!! :)

I'll take the bet. and it's true I am massively jealous of the fact that he can land more にくまんじゅ in one week that I can in a lifetime. and of the fact that he earns more money than me, and he gets it driving race cars and he does it all at one year younger than me! but no way is he better looking. I console myself with the fact that whilst he has far more talent, money and women than me I am far better looking and have a much bigger donger.

ps. for those wondering nikumanju is 'meat bun' lol.

[Muz]

Here endth all serious discussion.

[m3gtr]

Here endth all serious discussion.

is that a bad thing?

back on to other things...

I have read about this saga involving the FIA, ferrari, Mclaren and the supposed sale and receipt of confidential design information with great but tempered interest. Not only does it involve both teams leading the world championship but also the very fabric of the championship itself.

Its a messy, terrible situation for all concerned and to me it seems like another shady and ill advised and conceived attempt by Ferrari to rattle their competitors proverbial cages.

The political back stabbing is an art Ferrari know best out of all the teams in the field and their powerful lobbying within the sport cant be underestimated.

Enzo used to throw all his weight around when he didnt get his way and his legacy still thrives at Ferrari today decades later. More often than not, Ferrari gets what they want...

It wasnt so long ago that the mass damper saga threatened to derail, and almost DID derail, Renaults championship bid. Ferrari spearheaded the political attack because they were losing the fight on the track and they knew it. Had they not done this im sure it would have been a landslide 2nd half of the season in favor of Renault but as it was Alonso held on only by the skin of his teeth and just as well because Ferraris attempt at political sabotage literally blew up in their faces when schumis engine decided to lunch itself. A fitting end to their title hopes.

I really think this is what is happening at the moment and this has had Ron Dennis ( admittedly no saint himself ) almost in tears at a press conference today, as he tried to express his disbelief that others could think he and his team were capable of this type of treachery. The fact that Ferrari have used Nigel Stepney, a man very much his worth and instrumental in ferraris successes over the past few years, as their conveniently placed scapegoat also gives away the undeniable gestapo type tactics the team are employing in unsettling and demoting those that are either ready to leave or are doing better than they are.

Think about this. How ironic is it that this is all happening just before the British GP? Just before a possible Maiden win for a British driver? Driving for a British team in front of the home crowd and that the said team happens to be Mclaren, who are coincidentally leading both the drivers and constructors titles? Add to that Stepney is also British and you can start to see a common thread thats too obvious to ignore.

Anyone can plainly see this terrible wound upon the sport and certain individuals was inflicted DELIBERATELY and planned methodically to coincide with this stage in the championship.

Disgusting to the core and ANOTHER black mark against the sport. I hope Mclaren can shake this off and just keep pushing forward and if it were an eye for an eye i would be getting some serious payback in the leadup to the circus arriving in Italy.

why is it, whenever this shit happens bloody Ferrari are at the center of it??? They are like the Mob boss you cant expect to leave without some exit wounds...as poor old Nigel Stepney is finding out the hard way.

I can totally understand why Ron would be so upset..he probably cant believe Ferrari would stoop so low to do something like this but he shouldnt be surprised if he takes a quick look at the history books...

[Marco-R34GTT]

ON that you-tube video... Don't forget that Senna had 1000+ BHP and super soft 'quali' slicks....

[Roy]

Lewis on top early. Interesting to see how 2nd practice goes. Im hoping Lewis has a bit of a woopsie! For no other reason then it woudl be good to get the press to shut up for a moment, but mostly be good to see Alonso, Kimi and Massa close the points a little.

Wet race, watch Trulli come good

[Eug]

raikkonen around 0.5 seconds faster than anyone... noice

[Roy]

Hmmm. 11th. Going to be a long race