Garrett Gt30r Flavours

[Lithium]

I also want to know the peak power, can you help Lithium? I'm definately ready to take the .82 husing off and drop the .63 on.

I didn't quote peak power or post the dyno plot for a couple of reasons.

1/ The thing has boost creep, so boost climbs from 9psi at 3200rpm to 1bar at 5700rpm, where the dyno tuning stopped as I don't want boost over 1bar - and it won't stay below there from that point. The power beneath the curve is DEFINITELY where I think this setup will excel, considering it isn't even holding 1bar flat it feels VERY solid on the road.

2/ The whole dyno comparison thing - I know hub dynos probably read a bit higher than Dyno Dynamics rolling roads and know this forum can be a bit rough for knocking power figures that seem higher than people might expect so was just trying to give an impression of how the turbo actually behaves.

Following the curve I expect it to make 280-290rwkw on 1bar when its holding boost and fully tuned to 7000rpm, though please note this is on a Dynapac Hub dyno so I don't think that power level would apply to the Dyno Dynamics dynos most of you seem to use. For what its worth, compared to other cars that have run on the same dyno - its looking VERY good so far.

Anyway, here's the dyno plot SO FAR - I will post somewhere suitably when it is tuned to 7000rpm and holding 1bar right through the rev range but it should give a rough idea.

[Nabil]

Im selling my gt30 if its any use to you.

It has 10months warranty on it and its like 2months old

Have a look:

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...153081&st=0

[Cubes]

Boost creep.

Lithium, whats your setup?

Garrett .63 Internal gate

Machined RB .63 Internal gate

or External gate?

[Lithium]

Lithium, whats your setup?

ATP T3/T4 style housing with TiAL 38mm wastegate mounted off it - a setup we've tried and found to work (at least with T3/T4s on RB20s) fine. The wastegate port has been bored to 38mm. At the moment I am thinking/hoping that it might be more to do with how it merges back with the main exhaust stream, its merging back pretty close to the wastegate/turbine... which I have the impression isn't ideal.

Some pics (won't show the image as not sure that everyone would be interested):

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q95/mrlith/portedwg.jpg

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q95/mrlith/External2.jpg

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q95/mrlith/gtlurk.jpg

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q95/mrlith/Engine2sm.jpg

[The Dan]

Yes you can machine the guts out of a Hitachi exhaust housing and that lets you bolt the turbo to the manifold and dump pipe to the turbo . The problem is that the turbine housing was designed to have suitable gas flow velocity for the standard engine/turbo and the manufacturers desired power characteristics .

Turbines are designed to work with their matching family of turbine housings and very rarely work as intended with other types . Turbines come in a huge variety of diametres/trims/tip heights/blade numbers and blade forms . They are specifically designed to suit a turbine housing with the matching nozzle/nozzle inlet diametre (and width) and volute cross sectional shape and volume . Because there are countless thousands of variations its almost impossible to throw non native housings and turbines together and have a hope of expecting them to give a good result .

The problem exists because people want to compromise the whole upgrade effort by finding any means of getting the desired turbo onto their exhaust manifold . The original goal was to get better performance not just to hang the turbo off the engine with the cheapest dodgy means available . Doing it properly is often expensive but you can't cut corners here and expect it to work as intended . To think otherwise assumes you believe the people who design and test these things are morons and don't have a clue what they're doing . Wrong . Far more work (development) goes into turbine and housing design than the cold side because its the power source for the compressor end . Get it wrong and neither the turbocharger or the engine gets to function properly .

How well do you want it to work ?

This combination has been done many times before and tested. The results are very good. The setup is done by MTQ engine systems so it's not like it hasn't been researched.

[Cubes]

Interesting...

What supporting mods 3lit3 32?

[The Dan]

Interesting...

What supporting mods 3lit3 32?

Completely stock. Response is very good for a turbo of it's size.

[The Dan]

The only downfall to this setup is obviously you don't get the inconnel housing that comes from Garrett but there is absolutely nothing wrong with RB25 housings. I wanted to do one for an RB20 housing also but MTQ informed me that there was not enough material to match the housing to the cartridge.

There is also the option of buying a GT3071 for $1300 and then putting your turbine housing onto it. Rated at 500hp and slightly cheaper than the previous setup. The GT3071R is available without turbine housing (hence the price)

[Cubes]

I'm still skeptical seeing how hard it is to push 300rwkw out of a GT3076r with genuine housings. :S

But I can't help that.

[discopotato03]

To each their own , the Hitachi housings are designed to work with a turbine a fair bit smaller that 60mm and nothing like the UHP one . Next time you see a propper GT30 housing have a good look at the volute size/volume/nozzle shape . Compare this to a Hitachi housing thats had the centre machined out of it and tell us they look the same . Then fit each one alternatively and compare the response and turbine inlet pressures . You always find that TIP is up and turbine efficiency is down on what the Garret housings can do . All this for the limited convienence of being able to bolt up the std flange style dump pipe . Since everything else around the turbo plumbing wise has changed and serious punters are going to use a fabricated dump pipe anyway why not use the housing designed for the job ?

That housing Lithium has is a Ford style of Garrett turbine housing known in the US as the "5 bolt T3" , the aftermarket ie Turbonetics have had them cast as well . This is the one I often mention when people try to compare the Nissan T3 housing used on Z18's , FJ20's , VLT's , 280ZXT's to the larger turbine series T3's used in the US . As I've said Nissan opted for the small turbine series T3 (59mm turbine series vs US type 64mm turbine series) , their housings cope better with non std (larger) turbines than Nissans ones do but still far from ideal . Its also the reason why T3/T04E hybrids worked better in the US than here - more turbine diametre AND a housing designed for the turbine diametre and tip height .

Things to do cheers A .

[GunMetalR33]

So how much more boost are you going to run with the cams to make 300?

To get to 300rwkw I would think about 21psi should be enough. But I will probably stay at 17-18psi and see what I get. Would be happy with 280rwkw atm.

[Pauly33GTS-t]

What about intake and dump pipes???

intake and dump pipes will bolt straight back on bill has told me. he will make everything 'stock' exhaust side so my fabricated custom dump will get on there.

Im going with Bill, 2250 for the turbo, setup, lines, fitting, +~400 dollars inc towing and labour is what ill pay for good service, great warantee etc. so yeah.

thank for all you guys chipping in knowledge this will be one for people to reference down the track.

[Cubes]

Thats not going to make much over 250rwkw Paul.

If thats the case (Bill using your existing turbine and compressor covers). Just buy a GCG highflow through SK for $1750, bolt it on with a mate; at least you then know the R&D has gone in to the highflow and it makes boost stock like yet makes massive amounts of average power.

The std housings are no good for much over 250rwkw, you 'can' push a little more with the stock housings BUT require more than just the usual 'stock' motor. Your looking at cams, plenum, nice exhaust manifolds etc.

Bill comes across as a Top bloke and is a great salesman. Don't let this cloud your judgement.

[tridentt150v]

intake and dump pipes will bolt straight back on bill has told me. he will make everything 'stock' exhaust side so my fabricated custom dump will get on there.

Im going with Bill, 2250 for the turbo, setup, lines, fitting, +~400 dollars inc towing and labour is what ill pay for good service, great warantee etc. so yeah.

thank for all you guys chipping in knowledge this will be one for people to reference down the track.

Sorry, but I'll have to remain a little skeptical on this one for now. Your talking $2650 for a std - maybe hiflowed - turbine housing??? You can buy Nabils GT3071R kit for $2800 for everything [no association just pointing out].

I really can't see the money in it all. There is service and warranty though.

[Cubes]

There's really 3 options in my book. From cheapest to most expensive

1. Slide highflow bolt on ~250rwkw

Total ~$700-800

2. GCG Highflow bolt on ~250rwkw with slightly better response

Total ~$1750

3. GT3076r .63 or .82 internal gate up to 300rwkw - $1720, new dump -$300, intake pipe $70-$100, lines $200-$300, T3 spacer plate ~$30-40

Total ~$2500

Grab a copy of the engine/service manual and bolt the thing on yourself OR quiz Boostworx what they would want to drop the turbo on.

Doing the setup ATS is going to do really is pointless for the $$ its costing. The GCG that will have better response yet still make around the same power.

[tridentt150v]

And he is not stupid. Cubes has got it right.

[Pauly33GTS-t]

um. i think bill said something about using GCG parts for the rest of the turbos housing. im going in there with a mate 2moro to see exactly what im getting for that price. pixel8r got the same kit I asked him about Bill's service and he said the same thing. Excellent. dont change my mind now my cars been thru hell and has been off the road for 2 weeks and I cant be f**ked looking now for diff options as I have made my mind up and dont mind spending extra $$$ for peace of mind. I'm getting guarantees and warantees and helpful assistance. Bill told me ill see 300kw with this package hes making up for me. im getting what im paying ~2500 for dont u worry. and cubes the turbo is good for 500hp. thats ~340kw if im not mistaken just off the top of my head, with GCG made up kit to bolt my fabricated dump pipe back on and not to make a waste of anything seems good to me. Im doing it tomorow and i'll be done with it. EMU, Injectors and an FMIC will see me at the power I want then ill start doing stuff engine and manifold side of things. its all happening within 3-4 weeks so i dont need to hear from u "ur doing stuff all wrong" because no matter how marginally a time frame im doing it, its all getting done and the car will see 245kw fairly soon on a safe tune. thanks once again

Paul.

Edited January 29, 2007 by Pauly33GTS-t

[Bl4cK32]

dont change my mind now my cars been thru hell and has been off the road for 2 weeks and I cant be f**ked looking now for diff options as I have made my mind up and dont mind spending extra $$$ for peace of mind. I'm getting guarantees and warantees and helpful assistance. Bill told me ill see 300kw with this package hes making up for me. im getting what im paying ~2500 for dont u worry.

<snip>

so i dont need to hear from u "ur doing stuff all wrong" because no matter how marginally a time frame im doing it, its all getting done and the car will see 245kw fairly soon on a safe tune. thanks once again

Paul.

Why even bother asking for ppls opinions then if u make up your own mind, then get people telling you its not worth it, but still go ahead with what u want anyway?

Bill is a good salesman, ill give him that. Will he give u a money back guarantee if u dont get the 300 he said u would?

What clutch are u planning on running, tyres, eCu ? Its more like another 1-2k out of your pocket before u see any real numbers over 200...

[Cubes]

And 245rwkw it will be.......

Just don't be dissapointed when you get bored of 245rwkw, go to push more boost in and only pull out another 10rwkw or so before hitting the wall of detonation due to turbine backpressure.

Definitely not telling you your doing things all wrong.

Just trying to future proof you a little better; don't get all grumpy. lol.

I really hope for your sake the ECU your using has 6 coil drivers; you weren't too clear on that in our last discussion, it didn't actually sound like you knew. :S

[Pauly33GTS-t]

I was only getting grumpy cause Black32 said Bill was a nice bloke and just a good salesman. hes installed more turbos than youve seen your own mother I think I can trust him. And I bloddy hope so with a reputation like his. He knws the guys from MTQ systems very well and I asked MTQ for a quote first and for the same thing Bill can do a few bucks cheaper and cheaper doesnt mean second rate. I'll tell you how all goes and I'll get it dynoed with my stock (minus exhaust being not so stock ) setup then with my EMU, FMIC, injectors on and you tell me if it wasnt a good descision after that. I'll get the power I'm looking for Im absolutely sure of it.

I said thanks didnt I? I havent forgotten you cubes.

Edited January 29, 2007 by Pauly33GTS-t