Gtr Turbo's

[No Crust Racing]

Yes I've searched and I've read a lot about this topic but I still have some queries I'd like clarified - car is a 96 GTR V-Spec.

It appears my car is not running stock boost as the stock guage is maxed out under WOT (I think that equates to around 13.5psi - is that gauge limited or would it go above 7 if it could?) From what I've read GTR turbo's do not like being boosted above 1bar (14.7psi yes?) which puts me close to the maximum limit of the turbo capability - oh dear. For reference the stock boost restrictor little olive thing is still in the line so I'm assuming the chipped ECU is controlling boost - it's an Impul unit.

I've also read that GTR's ingest the ceramic dust and often times can a blown turbo can cost you a motor - how does that work given it's the exhaust wheel that's ceramic?

I'm also wondering if there's a chance these turbo's were high flowed - is there any easy way to tell this without pulling them off as I also read that removing them vastly increases the chance they will die.

Ok so I've asked...

- Is the stock boost guage limited in it's range?

- How do RB26's ingest the ceramic dust from a blown turbo?

- Is there any easy way to check the turbo's for any modifications?

- Just decided I'd like to know if 34 GTR turbo's are a worthwhile upgrade(what are they worth? I know the only main difference is they're ball bearing) considering slide can do a pair for $1500 that are good for 300kw's and are steel wheel.

- What experience have people had running 1 Bar on stock turbo's?

Some of you will know that I'm selling my car but given that I'm not trying very hard to sell I'm still toying with upgrade ideas and continuing the maintenance cycle etc.

Cheers

[djr81]

So many questions...

- Is the stock boost guage limited in it's range?

Don't understand the question. It is a guage. It's range is written on it.

- How do RB26's ingest the ceramic dust from a blown turbo?

Turbos will do of the order of 100,000rpm. When they go bang stuff goes everywhere.

- Is there any easy way to check the turbo's for any modifications?

Pull the inlet side ducting off & have a look at the compressor face.

- Just decided I'd like to know if 34 GTR turbo's are a worthwhile upgrade(what are they worth? I know the only main difference is they're ball bearing) considering slide can do a pair for $1500 that are good for 300kw's and are steel wheel.

They are an upgrade. Depends how much you pay & if you do the work yourself. Don;t forget changing them costs $'s if you get a shop to do it.

- What experience have people had running 1 Bar on stock turbo's?

Mine has been fine.

Lastly, the engine ECU doesn't control the boost level.

[No Crust Racing]

- With regards to the guage... Could the needle actually go above 7 if the car was making that boost, does it go above and beyond the 7 on the guage or is there a pin/needle/stopper in place to stop it reading off the guage.

- Why don't RB25's ingest the ceramic dust then?

- What am I looking for if I remove the inlect ducting?

- What are 34 GTR Turbo's worth?

- how long have you been running a bar for and on what model GTR

Thanks!

Edit: So how is boost being controlled if the restrictor is still in place.

Edited January 25, 2007 by ActionDan

[sewid]

- With regards to the guage... Could the needle actually go above 7 if the car was making that boost, does it go above and beyond the 7 on the guage or is there a pin/needle/stopper in place to stop it reading off the guage.

- Why don't RB25's ingest the ceramic dust then?

- What am I looking for if I remove the inlect ducting?

- What are 34 GTR Turbo's worth?

- how long have you been running a bar for and on what model GTR

Thanks!

1. Get a boost guage real quick. I recommend you buy a Defi as they make amazing guages. There is a new official Defi distributor in Australia and he's got good deals. http://www.defi.com.au/ . He has a container load of Defi's on a boat right now. Alternatively go to Nengun. You need a defi turbo guage + a defi link controller v2.

2. Not everyones car ingests ceramic dust but some do and its not worth the risk. As to why RB25's dont... maybe they do but there is a significant difference in the manifold so ... dunno.

4. R34 turbos go for $750 and up depending on km's traveled, condition etc. They're fantastic turbos for running 1bar on in my opinion. Spool up faster than any aftermarket turbos and will last a long time at a moderately fun boost level. Ball bearing turbos tho so make sure you do your research in terms of restricting the oil lines when fitting any ball bearing turbo. I don't think its wise to just bolt them on without thinking about that. Those more technical than me may know better obviously.

5. I ran 1 - 1.1 bar on standard R34 GTR turbos on a standard R34 GTR motor for 6months and when i pulled the turbos off to upgrade they looked perfect. I drove it every day like that.

[No Crust Racing]

Was swapping over an AFM just before and I could see the front turbo housing. I could make out Garrett and A/R .53 Is that right for a Series II V-Spec?

[Angus Smart]

i wouldnt waste you time with just a standard r34 gtr turbo.

you may aswell pay and either get http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbobygarre...0R_707160_9.htm

same as aa403's

or a set of used r34 n1's 14411-aa403, -aa401 or -aa402. most common are the aa403's

that pretty much covers you on 34 gtr n1 turbos,

as they have steel wheels and ball bearings.

[markimak]

ok my GTR turbos are Steel wheel 95% sure. and my guage goes just shy of +7.. which im not sure what that is in PSI. my mates GTR is running more PSI and the guage keeps going on R32.

BNR34 turbos are no good even the N1 are not worth the money. ull spend 3-400 at a shop fitting them. do it urself on this long weekend

with GTRs make sure ur oil feed line and oil return line are free of carbon deposits.. (freqeunt changes of oil and filter will work well as well as a good oil)

[paulr33]

me and someone else debated the whole ceramic dust kill rb26 myth

i think it might have been me and r31nismod, or maybe someone else??

i dont think its ceramic dust that does the damage, i think due to either manifold design or how the twins are split, ie one turbo is cylinders 1,3,6 and the other is say 2,4,5

when one of the wheels lets go it basically causes excessive backpressure or some form of exhaust backlog and causes excessive detonation

i just dont see the culprit being ceramic dust

[wrxhoon]

-

Is the stock boost guage limited in it's range?

- How do RB26's ingest the ceramic dust from a blown turbo?

- Is there any easy way to check the turbo's for any modifications?

- Just decided I'd like to know if 34 GTR turbo's are a worthwhile upgrade(what are they worth? I know the only main difference is they're ball bearing) considering slide can do a pair for $1500 that are good for 300kw's and are steel wheel.

- What experience have people had running 1 Bar on stock turbo's?

The stock boost gauge is useless, if it works it will only show up to about 14 psi.

When the exhaust wheel lets go at say 100,000 rpm it smashes into 1 million+ pieces . There is only 3 cylinders spinning this turbo, at some stage of the cycle there is overplap on the valves so no exhaust gasses pushing out for those 3 cyls, the vacium sucks some ceramic pieces back in the engine via open exhaust valves. Most Rb 26's that loose an exhaust wheel will suck some ceramic dust back in, some more than others. I have seen plenty, it happened to one of my ex cars ( 33 GTR) a few years ago, unfortunantely I wasn't driving it so I didn't get the pleasure of blowing it , only the repair bill.

Why it doesn't happen on RB25's? RB25's have 6 cylinders in to 1 not 3 so at anytime you have exhaust gasses pushing out ( its only what I believe, others may have other ideas) . Don't forget a few years ago no-one would believe you if you said the engine sucked ceramic dust back in when a turbo let go.

If you care to do a search under my user name you will find the original thread when my turbo let go with pics of the pistons .

If you know what you are looking for you can tell if the turbos have been rebuilt or not on the car but its not easy, especialy if you dont know what to look for .

R34 turbos are better because they are ball bearing and newer, You could probably buy a pair from $700 up, depending on age and km. I sold mine a long time ago for $1500 but there were like new and genuine under 20k k's ( from a series II with the log books ). I don't know if its worth your while if you are going to pay someone to do the swap ( you won't get a cent for your turbos ). As sewid mentioned you will need restrictors on the oil lines for any ball bearing turbo , DON'T overlook that , you may blow the seals.

If I was you I would buy new turbos or used from someone you know or can trust, buy either GTSS or N1 R34GTR turbos, anything bigger on a stock engine you are looking at a rebuild if you use the power .

I know you will find others that will tell you " I have GTRS'S on mine without any problems ". All depends on how deep your pockets are ..

[wrxhoon]

i just dont see the culprit being ceramic dust

Here you go another none believer............ I have the proof dude , the cylinder head had imbebed in it ceramic pieces and I still have the pistons with the pieces in them .. what more proof do you need ????

[Beer Baron]

a couple of points.

markimak: what makes you "95% sure" your turbos are steel exhaust wheel? short of removing them there is no real way to tell externally unless they say HKS GT series etc on them..

also, as for R34 turbos being "no good" for a mild upgrade they are very good. as for R34 N1 turbos being "no good" that is so wrong. they are one of the best ways to get around 500hp out of a GTR. great response. nice top end. cheap price. bolt on fitment. what more could you want?

Paul: this quote:i dont think its ceramic dust that does the damage, i think due to either manifold design or how the twins are split, ie one turbo is cylinders 1,3,6 and the other is say 2,4,5

it's wrong mate. the manifolds go 123 456 I have NFI how you'd have 2 manifolds running 136 245. it would take up a ridiculous amount of room and would be a waste of time.

listen to wrxhoon. as he has lots of experience with these turbos, and breaking them. and replacing them.

[markimak]

removed them checked with a t25 off a 180 different substance and made a different soudn when flciked. i didnt check park numbers but they are garret and VGC. and have been off my gtr before. so its good enough for me thanks beer baron.

[wrxhoon]

listen to wrxhoon. as he has lots of experience with these turbos, and breaking them. and replacing them

.

Wrong mate on the braking part anyway, like I said some other bastard broke mine, I had the pleasure of doing the build job... You are correct however on the replacing bit , I have done a few over the years .....

As for sucking the ceramic dust back in, no doubt on that part at all, ( not 100% sure on my theory though) besides there are a few others on this forum that know about it, I'm not the only one. I'm surprised there are still none believers though just because they haven't seen it happen ...

[saliya]

me and someone else debated the whole ceramic dust kill rb26 myth

i think it might have been me and r31nismod, or maybe someone else??

i dont think its ceramic dust that does the damage, i think due to either manifold design or how the twins are split, ie one turbo is cylinders 1,3,6 and the other is say 2,4,5

when one of the wheels lets go it basically causes excessive backpressure or some form of exhaust backlog and causes excessive detonation

i just dont see the culprit being ceramic dust

Hey,

If you think about it:

If an exhaust wheel lets go the last thing it's going to cause is excessive backpressure; unless the bits happen to block up

an exhaust port or two. Perhaps _before_ it let go; but not after.

I've had a wheel let go; no damage - others have had them let go and have spent big dollars cleaning crap out of their

motors. So many things are happening at once; it's conceivable that large pieces will find their way back through open

exhaust valves (I've seen an aluminium spacer off a carby go _right through_ a v8 motor on 700thou lift) and result

in "interesting" stuff happening to your bores. It's worthwhile taking other experiences into account - just because mine

wound up as bits in the cat and nowhere else is no guarantee that every other explosion will be similar.

Regards,

Saliya

[No Crust Racing]

Some good reading there guys and I appreciate the feedback.

Still have a few unanswered questions though.

- Can the R33 GTR Guage read above +7? (I know I should get a boost gauge for it and I'm going to drop the front drive shaft and fuse and put it on a local dynodynamics dyno to see what AFR's, boost and power are doing)

- Can someone confirm if the Garrett AR .53 umbers on the turbo housing are right for this car as I've got conflicting info.

EDIT: - How is boost being controlled if the restrictor is still in place as I thought 9psi was factory and if the guage is reading +7mmHg then that's like 13.5psi?

Cheers

Edited January 26, 2007 by ActionDan

[Blitz]

BNR34 turbos are no good even the N1 are not worth the money.

Some of the top workshops and tuners both in Japan and Australia disagree with you.

[heller44]

According to this chart, the only .53 ar comp housing on a standard issue turbo is on the bnr34 stocker..

Now, I don't have these, I have never seen these, And I hope that it is true. ( Basic intarweb disclaimer )

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/tbroom/Turbos.htm

[gun32gtr]

As sewid mentioned you will need restrictors on the oil lines for any ball bearing turbo , DON'T overlook that , you may blow the seals.

im putting gt2560r-5 on my gtr,whats this oil restrictors ya talking about.i was just going to bolt them..will happen for sure blowing the seals if i dont??

cheers kane

sorry to hijack thread action dan

[No Crust Racing]

I was able to get these pics, can someone tell me anything from these? Actuator looks stock (still trying to work out where my boost is being controlled from) Writing says Garrett AR .53 1-2 on it (are these stock R33 GTR units?) Included a pic of the compressor if that helps at all?

Edited January 26, 2007 by ActionDan

[Angus Smart]

Some of the top workshops and tuners both in Japan and Australia disagree with you.

because i disagree with him.

i love my twins