R33 Rb30 Conversion

[Guilt-Toy]

ooo so i should be able to get 350bhp with stock rb25det injectors and malpassi?

[Sydneykid]

ooo  so i should be able to get 350bhp with stock rb25det injectors and malpassi?

Well yes, as long as you don't have to rev the RB30 to the same rpm as you would the RB25 to get your 370 rwhp.

[the phantom]

I managed to get 245 rwkw with the standard injectors with a malpassi rising rate regulator. With the original '25 it spat out about 145 rwkw on the same dyno from memory. So if you disregard absolutes thats quite a hefty amount of headroom you have available.

Yes...the RB30DET is a wonderful idea!!!

[Cubes]

Phantom,

Hows yours running these days.

Care to share your current turbo and power setup?

[Guilt-Toy]

Well yes, as long as you don't have to rev the RB30 to the same rpm as you would the RB25 to get your 370 rwhp.

370... WOOOOOTTTTTTTT.... are you serious... my mechanics say il run outta injectors at 300rwhp...

has anyone here got a rb30det with stock rb25det injectors WITH a dyno sheet?

[Guilt-Toy]

No problems with idle etc on the stock ecu?

 

 

Maybe its just a RB20 ECU thing due to a different head (valve sizes etc).

I am noticing idle issues now to be honest.... with stock rb25det ecu from 95 model auto ecu....

I can imagine how much you r32 dudes will be lovin the rb30det

[the phantom]

Hey Joel,

She's still running strong and now approaching 70000 km, but the button clutch is starting to show signs of slippage in the midrange on occasion. Not bad really, I didn't expect it to last that long, although I have tended to be gentle on it by avoiding high rpm clutch dumps! Work is precluding me from undertaking the next phase, although slow progress is being made. This should be a real rip snorter, and something unusual.

As for the setup, it has remained essentally the same since day one, other than an intercooler change, and minor incremental improvements.

The bottom end was fully reconditioned, balanced and carfully rebuilt with completely standard parts. Nissan gasket kit, ACL pistons and rings, and RB30ET oil pump. The head had some mild porting done; basically just a good clean up. Everything else is standard, bar some piping mods to adapt the new turbo's huge inlet to the AFM piping and BOV.

The fun factor comes in the form of a Garret GT30 series, part number SB8005, with a 1.06 exhaust housing. An external 45mm Turbosmart Progate, fitted on an adaptor block, is sandwitched between the standard exhaust manifold and the new turbo. The intercooler is the largest I could fit without resorting to more bumper mods...about 600 X 300 from memory. Exhaust is a 3 inch straight through with two mufflers.

Fueling and control mods just consist of a Malpassi regulator, a PowerFC, and Finer Filter air filter element in the standard air box. The standard AFM piping does implode so I made some flat alloy donuts that I squeezed into the convolutions within the rubber. Other than the wastegate, popping the bonnet reveals an almost completely standard looking thing. In hindsight I should have installed the wastgate pointing down and out of view, particularly with todays draconian policing attitudes.

Boost sits at 15 PSI with what was originally a simple bleed valve. This was subsequently replaced with a Blitz ID II boost controller, with significant improvement in boost response as a result. Boost starts at about 2500, and increases linearly before peaking at about 3,800-4000 rpm, with a huge surge in power. It certainly isn't as responsive down low as with the stockie turbo, but the capacity more than makes up for it, and, given its unholy desire to reach for the redline, its quite entertaining to say the least. Given another choice and further development with this setup, I wonder how a GT30R with its GT series wheel rather than the old school TO4S in the one I have would perform.

All up its nothing special really, but has delivered strongly and reliably, considering it gets flogged every day. I think the key to longevity is GOOD CONSERVATIVE TUNING. For those so inclined, I would suggest NOT skimping on this part, or reaching for ultimate dyno numbers, which will cause a meltdown as soon as the weather changes. I know this probably doesn't sound like much power to a lot of people, with everyone nowdays quoting obscene power levels, but for the road, it is by far the fastest and most entertaining vehicle I've ever owned, and can light up the tires with consumate ease irrespective of speed!!

PS: Citroen DS....very funny!

[Bl4cK32]

Ive got a gt30/40r coming. Its got the gt series wheels in it too. Only thing is its getting the 0.82 exhaust housing. How do you think it would go compared to the 1.06 housing you have now phantom?

[discopotato03]

Phantom , it sounds like your GT3040 has the seven bladed TO4S compressor in it . I speak from time to time with a production engineer from Garrett (Calif) who also hapens to be a petrol head and hates the "S"wheels . I'm thinking of starting a list of known Garrett GTBB turbos and their part no's so that all can identify what they have or order what they want .

Your RB30DET sounds exactly like what I want from mine . If this can be achieved with RB26 injectors I'll be rapt . I've also wondered how the GT30R would go with 3L and up to 1Bar . Does the waste gate adapter allow the gate to hold boost all the way up . Also is the use of externals defect territory in NSW / VIC / SA ? I would have thought if it had no leaks and merged before the cat and engineered the over zealous "Eco Nazis" have no say .

Have fun A .

[Cubes]

Darren,

Isn't it the GT35/40R you are getting?

[Bl4cK32]

whoops...my bad typo after work

yer its the gt35/40r....damn fingers again

[the phantom]

Hi discopotato33,

I think a list of ACTUAL GARRETT PART NUMBERS is a great idea. Way to much confusion is causes by the several local turbo suppliers who insist on creating their own HKS type nomenclature for the sake of sales, with a hodge podge of different wheels and housings and horspower ratings, with subtle and confusing variations between the makers. These names mean absolutely FA to Garrett, seemingly only part numbers are recognised on the database. In my case the turbo does haves ball bearings, and is called a GT30, but has a TO4S compressor!!!???

Yes the TO4S is old school, thats why I would have liked to try the newer wheels, just to get a feel for the supposed newer technology and improved response.

The boost control is good all the way, but you have to have a wastegate spring that is close to what you want to run, not just winding up a 5 PSI spring to 15 PSI and expecting good control. Also even though it seems to be at 90 degrees to the exhaust flow, look at the name brand manifolds out there, HKS et al. They too seem to have the wastegate tubes at 90 degrees to the flow.

Seeminlgy ANY mods here in SA are deemed illegal, with little recourse or mechanism for engineering approval. We're in the dark ages down here, with government entities that rule with an iron fist and little intelligence.

Bl4ck32, if I was going to get another I'd get what your getting but still go for the 1.06 housing. I feel that if the boost response is anything sharper than with the old TO4S wheel it would be difficult to control smoothly, and with a .86 one would think it much more abrupt. However this is my personal opinion, and I cant back it up with actual results. What you are about to do will certainly be an interesting comparison, and very important information. What are the part numbers and components for what you have in store, and where are you getting it from? Please keep us informed. Worst case scenario is a new housing for you, so it wont cost that much, relativey speaking.

Bl4ck32....new response in light of your typo! This is now up a rung to what I thought we were talking about. In this case, I agree with your choice to start with a .86, but again, only your road impressions will tell the story...

[YO880]

guys,

quick question for you regarding ECU's, i am starting from scratch (as this isn't going into a skyline (well R series atleast )

so far i have

RB30E (from R31 Skyline) bottom end

RB25DE (i assume it is from an R32, doesn't seem to have vct) head (incl. most sensors)

RB25DE wiring loom (from R33)

RB25DET injectors (have the rail too, but they don't look too different from DE)

RB25DET exhaust manifold

it isn't all together yet, as i am trying to get all the parts i will need (on the cheap) before assembly (though i am probably at the stage now where i can get into it)

i am going to throw a turbo onto the mix as well (not sure which one yet, but probably a T34R, not that i know much about turbo sizes, i was just told by a friend who can get them cheap, that it would be good.) .. question is.. what ecu should i be looking at?

I was going to go down the path of an Autronic (but not after needing to buy the CDI, and having to run wasted spark), so now i am looking at powerfc or a rechipped R32 ecu.. question is.. which one?

will the rb25DE wiring loom fit into a rb25DET computer (of course i presume i will need to run some extra wires for the missing ones?)

If powerfc is the go (which leaves me only with the rb25det comp choice i guess), which one, the AP eng. one, D-Jetro (i havn't got an AFM yet), or the normal.. will not having VCT confuse the APFC?

similarly if a rechipped ecu is the go, should i get an RB25DE one and does anything need to be done for the turbo, i presume the turbo side of things is run independantly through a boost controller?

thanks guys, this has confused me for a while!

[Bl4cK32]

Part number 714568-0001

Core assembly spec:

GT35R

56 Trim compressor

GT40 Compressor

2.41/3.22 Compressor wheel

65 lbs per min flow

84 Trim turbine

2.45/2.68 turbine wheel (inconel)

Compressor cover 0.7 AR with 4'' bell mouth inlet

Going on a HKS cast tubular manifold with external gate. See this thread -http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42538

inlet manifold will be a RIPS rb25de front facing job, using a bigger tb.

then the usual cams (265/264) and larger exhaust, ic core (100mm thick)

already installed is a r33 box (needs a bearing kit:() and os twin plate, 550cc inj, 044 pump, pfc, q45 afm....

cant think of anything else atm....

[Bl4cK32]

y0880 - because you are using the rb25de head, its easier to use the rb20det loom and AP Engineering pfc. The use the all the sensors you have, except change the aac valve on the plenum.

This is only if you want to ditch the vct....

[YO880]

as far as i know, it doesn't have vct anyway (well, atleast i can't seem to find anything that indicates it is vct)

using the Rb20det AP eng. PFC, that would mean i would also need to go low impedence injectors? (GTR ones, meaning replacing the fuel rail for top feed too?)

damn.. and after a 2 month search for an RB25DE loom

would i have the option of using an RB25DET computer? or are the looms (and sensors) completely different (if so what is the difference?), and the lack of vct too much?

[Bl4cK32]

whatever loom you use, use the computer and sensors to suit.

As far as i know they dont make a pfc for rb25de.

I wouldnt use GTR injectors in the rb20 PFC comp (see recent gtr injectors in rb20 threads)

Dont mix match comps and looms....

[YO880]

okay, i just found the other thread you replied to (rb25de powerfc), it makes more sense now.. i didn't think that the RB25DET and DE sensors would be different on the same model engine..

i guess it is RB20DET loom hunting time

are you talking about the problem of needing the GTR resistor pack to lower the resistance for the GTR injectors? i assumed that having the AP engineering PFC (being for low impedence injectors), you wouldn't need this? or are you talking about another problem with them?

[Cubes]

RB25DE loom will be fine.

[YO880]

and what computer?