The Epa Thread/Roadworthy Thread

[wht510]

good info guys ^

few months back a padded half cage was legal, now its illegal.... and vic drift just changed its reg now every one must run at least a cams spec bolt in half cage for 2013

Gents, the best thing to do is speak to your local roll cage manufacturer. The rules are constantly changing and as I said "I think" which means i am unsure, but at the time (about 5 months ago) it was illegal to run any cage. If anyone has more up to date information, please add it here!

[wht510]

Great write up, from what you're saying about brakes sounds like GTR Brembos into a gtst should be fine but a car like mine for instance would need to be engineered because I don't have ABS and the Brembos are designed for cars which do?

Bloody good question!

GTR Brembo's into a GTST would be a very easy conversion to get engineered. You would have to use the GTR Master Cylinder too. As you are changing the dynamics of the car (even if it's OEM) you will still need to speak to an engineer and potentially get a certificate for this change. As it's a safety system (and a damn important one at that), the chances you need a cert. for something like this is very high. The amount of work required though for an OEM style change such as the GTR brembo is minimal because you can use a very simple justification to state the weight of a GTR is slightly heavier than a GTST, the brake performance is better, therefore fitment onto a GTST using the correct Master Cylinder etc. should be just as good if not better than the factory GTST OEM system. Ends up being a fairly cheap certificate and potentially not even requiring the brake test (depending on the engineer!!!)

IF a GTST came from factory WITH Brembo's then you can fit them without a certificate..... It's a fine line. I think you could potentially get away with it, but....

The fitment of D2 style or Alcons or any other non OEM style disk and caliper will require more calculation/testing/proof to make sure the brake system functions correctly such as:

1. Correct fluid amount if there is a leak in the front/rear, and how big the MC reservoir is to compensate.

2. Swept area of pads and pistons compared to the rears, to achieve correct bias. If you go with OEM ratios, you are pretty safe. The weight of the car is a factor with this. If you are changing the weight dramatically with your modifications you need to change the bias accordingly.

3. Master Cylinder size to achieve emergency stopping G force and provide suitable pressures without locking fronts or rears.

4. Performance under repeated emergency stops. I can't remember what the requirement is, i'd have to look it up, but basically you do a few cycles of 100 to 60 on a 'closed road' and then do one emergency stop of 100 to zero. The G force must be over 0.8 and pedal pressure must be within range, which leads into the next requirement.

5. Pedal pressure. Suitable testing is carried out for an emergency stop with a pedal force gauge. There is a specific requirement for an emergency stop to be a specific force (I can't remember what it is off the top of my head..) The car must achieve a G force of over 0.8 from a specific speed with a pedal force of the requirement to pass the test.

6. Pedal travel must be a certain requirement. You don't want an on/off pedal, and you don't want a pedal that takes a heap of travel to do nothing and not even have capability of providing the correct locking pressure.

7. All the stuff I have forgot goes here.

8. And here too...

This does take time for the Engineer and costs accordingly. One option when I was looking at calipers for my 1600 was Wilwood. They make a model that bolts straight onto the R31 strut ears. Unfortunately they weren't street legal because they didn't have an extra dust seal on the piston which is a requirement for ADR compliance. The Engineers know all of this! I ended up using R33 GTST calipers and R31 rears as the pad and piston areas are similar to a car with the same engine (200SX) and the master cylinder I used was S14 Silvia. The weight bias of the car was similar to S14, so away you go from there.

[Curmi]

the best thing to do now in vic since all these stupid stupid rules and cops on the road is to have a track car and have a stock as a rock ve or fpv.....

[MrSheepMoose]

the best thing to do now in vic since all these stupid stupid rules and cops on the road is to have a track car and have a stock as a rock ve or fpv.....

The problem is cost though.

It's not like Japan where you can buy some unregistered/ready to drift car for $2,000 or something.

Paying for a track car, then paying for a daily is a lot more expensive than it should be. If police could let people off with modifications on the basis that they only thrash it out on track, then we wouldn't have this problem.

[eightsixboy]

Just paint the brembo's black and have no Brembo sticker on it, as if a cop will know the difference.

As long as you keep mods looking stock ie highflow, nistune etc you can get away with alot without getting defected or getting into trouble, no need for a track only car unless your serious to the point of doing wtac and big events, you can still have a quick somewhat legal street car that'll be a good all rounder.

[eightsixboy]

With engineers certs even if you get your car 100% engineered for every mod Im pretty sure a cop can defect you or send you an epa letter if they think your to loud,low or if they wanna fine you for the sake of it (but that never happens ) You have to remember this is Vic, the only state where your guilty until you prove your innocence.

[gtr jet]

Your right. I've had mate's with almost standard cars that have been forced to go through an epa test just because the cop was having a bad day.

Another mate got canaried for having 3 piece rims and a cage even though he had the complete vic roads rules and regs in his glove box to show the officer that what he had was legal. The copper just said that he didn't care and wanted him off the road.

I had no idea the rules about cages had changed. Looks like my car might end up being track only.

Does anyone know much about club reg and how different it is to normal road reg? I heard some club reg rules have recently been changed also.

[W0rp3D]

The problem is cost though.

It's not like Japan where you can buy some unregistered/ready to drift car for $2,000 or something.

Paying for a track car, then paying for a daily is a lot more expensive than it should be. If police could let people off with modifications on the basis that they only thrash it out on track, then we wouldn't have this problem.

Lol that's funny, how long do you think that situation would last before some idiot screwed it up for every one?

Playing with cars has never been cheap, if you don't want or don't have the money to spend to do things right then I suggest you find a new hobby

[MrSheepMoose]

Lol that's funny, how long do you think that situation would last before some idiot screwed it up for every one?

Playing with cars has never been cheap, if you don't want or don't have the money to spend to do things right then I suggest you find a new hobby

In this country? Wouldn't take long at all to be honest.

I admit that the system wouldn't work perfectly, but considering the resources police have to impound/fine and even jail drivers at times, I don't see why the focus should be on modifications.

Yeah, it's expensive to buy cars. It's still more expensive to buy a track car, and then a tow car.

Also, a follow up question, can you get an engineer certificate for Bride seats, or do they have to be ADR approved? Anyone ever engineered some Brides? Would really love some aftermarket recline-able bucket seats, and the only ones which are ADR approved are the cheap Autotechnica's that I'm not too fond of.

@Eightsixboy: Yeah I get what you mean completely. The only reason I'd get an engineering certificate would be so I wouldn't have to put much effort into getting the car cleared of any defects. I don't think engineering certificates are for avoiding defects as much as they're for avoiding the hassle of the defect, if you catch my drift.

[Miguelone]

You can run Recaro SR series they're OE seats,

[MrSheepMoose]

I went to check out a car today.

Seems like the stock intercooler piping hole has been cut.

My question is, how could this affect a RWC, and what's the best way to fix it up? A mate suggested using a rubber grommet, but would there be any other ways that would be more effective?

[alr33x]

What car 32 / 33?

Do u intend running stock cooler piping back through there?

[MrSheepMoose]

It's a 180SX, actually.

I don't plan to run stock piping through it JUST yet. I'm planning on running an SR20DE, so it would be open/visible.

[alr33x]

Airbag model?

I'd say it will be a pain In ya backside potentially I'd weld a plate over it I guess

[MrSheepMoose]

Non-airbag model.

I don't want to purchase a car which mightn't pass a RWC, so I'm unsure if I should go for this or not.

[Curmi]

thats fine mate just buy some rubber edging which goes around the hole and thats it.

[jukic.j]

I got my first EPA notice for exhaust noise about two weeks after getting my R33. Points to anyone who guesses already where i'm going with this.

Bought car with registration

Registered car must be sold with RWC

EPA notice 2 weeks after purchase

RWC lasts 30 days

EPA'ed while still having a valid RWC

Can I use that to fight off this bullshit EPA notice? It clearly states an exhaust system and emissions pass on the RWC.

[jukic.j]

Ok so in another thread i've come to understand that the RWC part of exhaust does not cover noise level.

I got EPA'ed 2 weeks after I bought my car so if it's going to happen with that kind of frequency it makes sense to fix it. Is that an unusually short period of time to get done for exhaust noise? I wasn't driving like a dick or anything I was in a 40 zone taking my partner out for dinner and got done in the street I parked in.

[alr33x]

As u stated rwc and EPA are unrelated essentially

It's not that frequent in theory you have had 1 EPA during ownership of the car...

But it's likely you'll get more so depending how loud it is may be worth getting something quiet but basically anything other than a stock exhaust will fail

[MrSheepMoose]

What's the legalities with exhausts?

Of course, I understand that you can't remove the catalytic converter, and it must be within 90db. What about design? How far can it protrude from the car? What's the maximum angle allowed? What about mufflers? Can you have twin "blast pipes" providing they're within legal limit DB wise?

Also, does anyone know if you can get away with removing a turbocharged engine and putting an N/A engine into a car that didn't come with that N/A engine? For instance, SR20DE in a 200SX. Would it be P-plate legal?

Cheers guys.