Rb20det To Fully Modify Or Not To

[bLaQ.bOi]

hey guys, well im considering doing the full works on my 32 gtst

im not sure what i want from it yet, i wouldnt mind a track car but occassional streeter!

the thing is, ive got the money to spend, but i have my heart set out on working the shit through the rb20!!!

i know i know rb25 or 25/30 ftw... but

i just really want to keep it rb20, the question isnt "is it worth it" obviously it isnt

my question is, will i be happy with the power? im not chasing huge power ri just want a prettty quick car for the track (im going to drif tit maybe twice a year)

i dont really know what im asking here

but should i do it? also its going to be heavily modified, not jsut a few btis and pieces here n there, if i do it the whole thing is going to be modified, bottom to top inside to out

cheers

[r32woohoo]

How would you define heavily modified?

Like every bolt on go fast bit you can find?

Or a forged bottom end etc?

If you were going to rebuild and stick with the 20 do a search on an RB24 (rb20 with gtr crank etc)

[R31Nismoid]

Take Troys car as an example (Roy on the forums) and go from there.

Simple as that

He has the fastest RB20 powered R32 in Vic, also helps to be able to steer a car aswell.

[Duncan]

yeah but it seems to be prone to crashing and catching fire? not sure if that is the rb20's fault though.

mate.....just go for it, the most important thing about getting on the track isn't power, it is having money for tyres, entry fees and accom! If you want to modify something, start with suspension and brakes, maybe a little extra power - but if you chase too much normally you just end up with an unreliable car.

[Eug]

If you want to modify something, start with suspension and brakes, maybe a little extra power - but if you chase too much normally you just end up with an unreliable car.

well said.

[Al]

Take Troys car as an example (Roy on the forums) and go from there.

Simple as that

He has the fastest RB20 powered R32 in Vic, also helps to be able to steer a car aswell.

I totally agree.........

Troy's car is simply amazing and defies logic. $400 wrecker motor, standard everything apart from bolt-on. He has been running about 230-260rwkw, using a TD-06, top mount manifold and ext.gate, for a few years and is on the limiter at every event. The engine is as strong as nails and is yet to show ANY sign of blow-by, smoke, etc.

Why spend $5,000-$12,000 building up an rb20, when it is proven to be a very tough motor in std form? If something was to fail, you'd just replace it for $400 + Labour

On the other hand, if you wanted more torque, off boost response, etc then the rb25det or rb30det would be the way to go. But in my opinion these aren't as strong as the rb20det, in STD form/internals; but they are both very strong in there own rights.

That's what Troy has been deciding for the last few years:

Spend a shit load of money, just to basically have more torque (maybe power)

or

Keep the rb20 std and replace it for approx $400 IF it ever lets go

[Roy]

i just really want to keep it rb20, the question isnt "is it worth it" obviously it isnt

Well what your proposing isnt worth it.

I was fortunate enough to in my first few track days meet Uncle Duncan. He was miles quicker then me in a std R33. I got a few suspension mods and he was still miles quicker. It took me a lomng time to get to a point where i could seriously consider that i was gettign near as quick as him (allowing for tyre differences)

My point? Who cares what motor you are running. It hurts my fragile male ego to say but even when std my car was quicker then me. Today with a bunch of mods the car is still probably quicker them me. So rather then worry about modding the car you are probably better of getting out there and start getting laps under your belt. Its much easier/better to learn in a std car then a car with more grunt then std.

I think the best approach is just top get out there in a well serviced/maintained car ...if you have to mod it then look at suspension, cooling, then brakes, then breathing mods, then perhaps chasing more power out of it.

The old Rb20 can punch well aboves its weight...but the thousands spent ot get there is far better off ebign spent on event entry fees, petrol, tyres/pads etc

[R31Nismoid]

True true.

Having a highly modded car without even having really been out there before, you wont be fast.

And it'll take a long time for you to get to that stage.

As Troy said, better off to get out there and get the laps, and slowly change the car rather than bolt on 400rwkw and away you go

[bLaQ.bOi]

How would you define heavily modified?

Like every bolt on go fast bit you can find?

Or a forged bottom end etc?

If you were going to rebuild and stick with the 20 do a search on an RB24 (rb20 with gtr crank etc)

i mean everything full rebuild bottom end top etc yada yada

ive got the money from the bank so just waiting it out and seeing what i want to do is not an option, i dont want to pay repayments for money thats just sitting there

i was sctually thinking about stroking the thing

but f**k i got no idea any more, so confusing

[dmr]

the money you'll spend with stroke and bore would be better off dropping an rb25 in it.

there's a good thread on the rb24 somewhere, do a search.

[Roy]

OK, I HATE WANKERS THAT USE CAPS LOCK...SO LOL THAT MAKES ME A WANKER

BUT, DO NOT BORROW MONEY FROM THE BANK TO MODIFY YOUR CAR TO GO TO THE TRACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

If you have an accident at the track, which is a very real risk if going to the track, then all that money you owe on mods could end up being towed home and worth nothing. Sure do some mods...but seriously, until your going quicker then a 250rwkws std RB20 can propel you...then pocket the banks mone.

Tweak the brakes, tidy up the suspension and after you have some experience at the track thrown some semi slicks on the thing. You will end up going quicker then anyone would every have thought. The amount of ppl i know who have gained 60-70rwkws to barely go half a secnd quicker....

The fun is in being out there circulating...not in a workshop spending money you dont have on mods to the point you dont have any money to go to the track and end up selling the car at a big loss...blah, blah, blah

PS, in case i havent sounded like enough of a wet blanket read Duncans post again. LOL but it is your car and money so you have to do what you want

[Al]

I totally agree with Troy (Roy)

Silly move to borrow money to modify a car, that is still 100% functional, then take it to a track, with no experience, only to risk ploughing it into a wall

[nedi]

i spent lots of time and money on th track, so please consider this advise.

dont waste another cent on the rb20. once you get out on the track and start getting confortable you'll just want your car to go faster and faster and you'll end up spending a fortune modifying evrything to make it track worthy. before you even realise what your doing, (catch can, fuel pump, brakes. tyres, cage,) you'll have ended up spending enough money to buy a repectfully modified r32 or even r33 gtr and still have plenty of change. a gtr, sorry to say, will rip the doors off any rb20 all day long around a track. ( i dont care how its modified) further they'll be far more enjoyable and rewarding to punt around a track.

it like first time snowboarders wearing all the crappy hire gear, as they learn, they buy all the good stuff to make the experience more enjoyable and also so they fit in and have the things all the other good snowboarders have. they same thing will happen to you when you get into trackwork with your car.

dont underestimate how much you end up blowing on the rb20 to make it reliable and ,as well as track worthy. 25k might sound alot for a gtr but you'll spend that much on the rb20 within 6 months of getting addicted to track days. trust me i know.

further, never underestimate how good a gtr is compared to an rb20 on a track. your loyalties to your beloved rb20 will dessert you real quick.

a great engine the rb20 is not. spend the money on a gtr, a sump baffle, good brake pads and a catch can and you'll never look back on your rb20. and you'll actually spend far more trying to make your rb20 half as quick around a track as a gtr then you would buying a used(slightly mofified) gtr.

[Eug]

the best mod you can do is to improve driver skill, i think alot of people lose sight of this and it's a much simpler equation when money = power mods = instant time improvement.

[Roy]

i spent lots of time and money on th track, so please consider this advise.

dont waste another cent on the rb20. once you get out on the track and start getting confortable you'll just want your car to go faster and faster and you'll end up spending a fortune modifying evrything to make it track worthy. before you even realise what your doing, (catch can, fuel pump, brakes. tyres, cage,) you'll have ended up spending enough money to buy a repectfully modified r32 or even r33 gtr and still have plenty of change. a gtr, sorry to say, will rip the doors off any rb20 all day long around a track. ( i dont care how its modified) further they'll be far more enjoyable and rewarding to punt around a track.

it like first time snowboarders wearing all the crappy hire gear, as they learn, they buy all the good stuff to make the experience more enjoyable and also so they fit in and have the things all the other good snowboarders have. they same thing will happen to you when you get into trackwork with your car.

dont underestimate how much you end up blowing on the rb20 to make it reliable and ,as well as track worthy. 25k might sound alot for a gtr but you'll spend that much on the rb20 within 6 months of getting addicted to track days. trust me i know.

further, never underestimate how good a gtr is compared to an rb20 on a track. your loyalties to your beloved rb20 will dessert you real quick.

a great engine the rb20 is not. spend the money on a gtr, a sump baffle, good brake pads and a catch can and you'll never look back on your rb20. and you'll actually spend far more trying to make your rb20 half as quick around a track as a gtr then you would buying a used(slightly mofified) gtr.

LOL...i love those posts. In all sincerity we are all entitled to our own opinions...but i guess you dont own a GTR that gets tracked? If you did you are either far more fortunate then other GYTR owners i know, or are able to get a lot more speed out of a std GTR then ppl i know....i watch what ppl spend on their GTRs and it takes me a lot longer to get to that level of mods

Its about getting out there and having fun and getting experience. If it was all about lap times then we would all drive 700hp GT2 Porsches. And for the sake of an argument, i dont know of a single lightly modified GTR that is quicker then my car! Those that are quicker have far more mods then my car. The drivers more track experience, and mods that are wirth well in excess of my car.

S amall bolt on turbo with ECU and breathing mods with some simplke suspension changes and your GTSt will be a fun car to learn how to drive in.

So not saying a GTR is no good,...but my god dont let anyone believe that a quick track GTR is cheap. Especially when the engine lets go!!!! What

...a sump baffle, good brake pads and a catch can and you'll never look back on your rb20. and you'll actually spend far more trying to make your rb20 half as quick around a track as a gtr then you would buying a used(slightly mofified) gtr.

Ok, so how much money are we talkign for good brakes, installed sump baffle and catch can?

the best mod you can do is to improve driver skill, i think alot of people lose sight of this and it's a much simpler equation when money = power mods = instant time improvement.

Agree 1000%. And the golden rule is its easier to drive a slow car fast then fast car fast. So its harder to learn to do track work in a heavily modified track car. General perception is the mods are what makes a car quick...but its still 100% up to the driver to punt the thing

Anyway...i strongly disagree with that post, especially as advise to someone that is looking to venture out on the track for the first time. Like you said yourself "i spend lots of time and money" Not all of us can afford to spend lots of money, and lap times is all relative. You have just as much fun going a few seconds slower then uber modified cars

[Beer Baron]

to make a GTR as fast as bloodnut in his GTST will cost you around the $50K mark to make it fast and reliable. GTR is a very heavy car which means you need, bigger better tyres, bigger better brakes, more power, better suspension just to go the same speed. and you need to replace all those things more regularly as the GTR is very hard on brakes and tyres.

either way borrowing money to modify your GTST (or GTR) for track is a bad idea. a standard GTST with exhaust, boost, and good pads and fluid is a good place to start. if you have a bit more cash get a second set of wheels with semi-slicks. then get out there and do as many days as possible. experience is what will make you fast, not mods.

[Gts-t]

i have a rb30 that im collecting parts for slowly, but in the meantime im getting a little bored and have been thinking about rebuilding the old 20 with a set of forgies for 2.1 and 9.0 comp.

Thoughts?

[R31Nismoid]

dont underestimate how much you end up blowing on the rb20 to make it reliable and ,as well as track worthy. 25k might sound alot for a gtr but you'll spend that much on the rb20 within 6 months of getting addicted to track days. trust me i know.

further, never underestimate how good a gtr is compared to an rb20 on a track. your loyalties to your beloved rb20 will dessert you real quick.

a great engine the rb20 is not. spend the money on a gtr, a sump baffle, good brake pads and a catch can and you'll never look back on your rb20. and you'll actually spend far more trying to make your rb20 half as quick around a track as a gtr then you would buying a used(slightly mofified) gtr.

The things you talk about here are not realistic as far as ive seen.

Using Troys car as a real world example of the RB20/R32t, its cheap, reliable and affordable for the average punter.

When i say cheap, there is a bit of money spent on it of course, but thats nothing compared to a GTR. Not even in the ball park.

Let alone keeping a track GTR running in top condition which are much higher again.

The fact is, a 25k GTR (and a R32 GTR at that), isnt going to be withint a sniff of a 12k R32t with 10k spent on it. Not even close.

You'll have spend 10k on the GTR to get it upto a level where it would be faster, and thats not including the motor rebuild which is inevitable.

So whats cost more? The GTR. What will cost more to run? The GTR.

So is a GTR cost effective? Depending on your budget, probably not for most people.

I'd like to know who's stock R32 GTR would be as fast as mild modded R32/RB20. If you could provide names/cars/examples it would be appreciated.

Stat for stat, yes the RB20 has nothing on the RB26. But the reliability is there, and the cost savings are there... something you wont find on paper specs.

[Ronin 09]

yeah - don't be confused - RB20 is much more than the sum of it's parts.

interestingly, there are more RB25 and RB26 failures in the engine failure thread

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...showtopic=46581

[Yidz]

Nice thread guys. I've been tossing up the same thing as my car only has the usual mods and if I wanna go further the money begins. I was tossing up spending the dollars on an RB25 conversion, which at the end of the day I imagine is worth it. I enjoy driving my RB20 though and with a little bit more money into it I think it will do the job as an all round car, because I want to eventually take it onto the track.

I can't imagine a loan for mods would be any good. You'll get sick of the power really quickly. You should modify the car doing one thing at a time, testing the differences, tweaking each mod to the best way it suits you. Not bolt everything on at once and just feel the instant power hit. I don't know if thats just me but my 2c anyway

Either way good luck with your plans!