Should I Get A Non-turbo R33/34 Or Others If I Am P Plate Driver?

[R-SPEC]

if you wanna buy a turbo but can't coz of p-plate laws etc then don't get a n/a skyline!!

trust me you'll get sick of it pretty quickly, everytime you drive next a turbo skyline you'll be like oh wish my skyline was turbo etc...

as others already said get something else, maybe a GTi corolla or something like that. even a v6 commo would be alright and would go harder than a N/A skyline

good luck

[R-SPEC]

for all you peoples that are bagging out n/a's STOP IT

UR ARE FULL OF SHITE! i own a r34 n/a and i love her to bits, i could have brought a gtt but i didnt want to, i didnt want to wrap myself around a tree...................people on there p's should learn how to drive first, so if it means getting a n/a so be it. there are too many kids getting off there p's going and getting high powered turbo cars and either killing themselves or having a very serious accident.

if you have nothing nice to say about non turbo then SHUT THE F#@K UP, i hate turbo cars but i will not bag them out. respect peoples decisions and their rides.

first of all - you don't have to be over 30 years old to know how to drive a fast car

2nd - you don't have to be driving a powerful car to wrap yourself around a pole

3rd - learning to drive in a piece of shit and then driving a powerful car is the same as going straight on to a fast car.

why "learn how to drive" in a slow gutless car when you can learn in a faster car and speed up your driving skills?

you can kill yourself even when riding a pushbike. you don't have to be driving an veyron to be in danger on the roads...

[scathing]

THe first post.. I thought it was pretty obvious. You said skyline's (One would assume you mean all) lack the qualities for good track/twisty work..

Does Bathurst mean anything to you? The list goes on.. I'm not here to say skyline's are some ultimate machine.

Someone needs to invent a version of Godwin's Law for Skyline otaku and calling Bathurst. It also conveniently ignores the fact that the Nissan teams had a much higher budget than most of the teams driving local machinery (the GT-R was a 911-priced vehicle racing against Holdens and Fords), which helps a great deal in racing.

Were you going to break out the old story that the GT-R was the first "production car" to break 8 minutes at the Nordschleife too? Sure it wasn't actually in production trim, but don't let that get in the way of a good yarn.

Secondly, one would only assume I "mean all Skylines" if they were incapable of understanding context. Try reading my post again, this time at a high school level of English.

My first paragraph clearly says that I'm talking about NA Skylines, and is a pretty short summary. The second paragraph goes into a bit more depth. Especially since the post I quoted is specifically limited to talking about non-turbo Skylines and I was replying directly to that.

[timheather]

Buy a datto 1600.... N/a but light, heaps of fun, easy to mod and you won't lose money on it. Buy a turbo (real ) Skyline when you can legally drive it.

No offence to na drivers, just my 2c

[scathing]

i didnt want to wrap myself around a tree

You shouldn't have bought a RWD car, then.

With a FWD car you're more likely to go head-first into a tree, but a RWD's greater tendency to oversteer means "wrapping" is a more likely scenario.

if you have nothing nice to say about non turbo then SHUT THE F#@K UP, i hate turbo cars but i will not bag them out. respect peoples decisions and their rides.

You haven't been on the Internet for very long, have you?

This is a discussion forum. That means you're going to get discussions, which will have multiple points of view. If you've got a problem with other people's opinions (and you can't respect their decision to vocalise them) you can always be proactive and unsubscribe from the thread.

[Lil_Lucky]

I started with an N14 pulsar. Pretty quick for a hatch (had Sr20) and if you do some suspension work it can be heapsa fun. Because it felt heaps quicker around the twisties than my r32 gts-t does. Oh and there dirt cheap, I sold mine for 7k with a heap of mods.

[ignuz]

You shouldn't have bought a RWD car, then.

With a FWD car you're more likely to go head-first into a tree, but a RWD's greater tendency to oversteer means "wrapping" is a more likely scenario.

You haven't been on the Internet for very long, have you?

This is a discussion forum. That means you're going to get discussions, which will have multiple points of view. If you've got a problem with other people's opinions (and you can't respect their decision to vocalise them) you can always be proactive and unsubscribe from the thread.

My point of view.. You are portraying N/A skylines completely negatively, when there are many positives.

Secondly.. You are gay lol thread over, I directed the first insult, a Mod should snap on this now and close it.

:sorcerer:

[timheather]

Ok, let's just say that skylines overall are great cars.... but a turbo RB will always be quicker and therefore more fun than an NA. Please don't start arguing about modified NAs with everything done to them.... forced induction = more power = more fun. They really are too heavy for a small capacity NA motor, so go for something a bit more exciting and lighter.... I might get flamed for this, but v-tec Honda's are fun and P-plate legal.... but I still say go the 1600.

[R334door(s2)]

LOL

I'm glad I got my P plates before the laws kicked in,

I'll be even more glad when I get off them in feb.

If you really want a skyline, get a skyline! I had an N/A R33 before my GT-T and it was a good car

night time curfews suck hard

[scathing]

My point of view.. You are portraying N/A skylines completely negatively, when there are many positives.

Given that we're talking about this:

I could care less about straight line power..Twisties/track is where the real fun is at.

I'm struggling to think of one "positive" a NA Skyline has. Especially when Kevin84 was initially asking if he should buy a NA Skyline over other NA vehicles he could consider.

I'll concur that the NA Skyline, having less weight up the front, should turn in and change direction a little better than a turbo Skyline (all else being equal) and will have far better throttle response and more linear power delivery but, compared to the other NA cars Kevin said he was considering the GTS has still got a big, long, cast iron lump hanging past the front struts. And a pretty long wheelbase. It doesn't add up to a car that's going to want to change directions.

As a car for the twisties, I'm not seeing the positives over an SR20DE powered S13, Pulsar SSS, a EK Civic DC2 Integra VTiR, Mazda MX5, or a Peugeot 205 GTi (all of which should be starting at around the AUD$10K mark). If you're not caring about straight line power, the cars I've listed are far more chuckable by virtue of their weight and short wheelbase.

Go to $15K range and you're into RenaultSport Clio territory, which has the R33 GTS (and most production cars) beat on the ability to get from one end of the twisties to the other in the least amount of time, while putting the biggest smile on the dial.

So, as a twisties/track car (and, for the latter, trust me when I tell you that you need power) what positive does the GTS have?

[ignuz]

So, as a twisties/track car (and, for the latter, trust me when I tell you that you need power) what positive does the GTS have?

A good base by which to start for those new to the skyline scene. It is an average track/twist car at best, but that's what you pay for. You're mistaken if you think I've made it out as some awesome track machine.

Other benefits include

- The looks of a skyline

- The potential to be a reasonably competitive track/streeter with work (suspension etc or even a turbo for a nice high comp hard pulling car with minimal lag.

- Most of the features that many other skylines have.. LSD, ATTESA etc

- Better fuel economy than most other turbo cars out there under the same price range

- A great base for those new to the skyline scene, to learn the inner workings of RB'S and the rest of the car come time to buying a turbo if you want.

- Cheaper to insure

- Lower maint costs

You need to stop looking at the GTS as a car by which you want to get the absolute most out of for street/track performance.

And on a side note they're great fun to wipe the smile's off rx8 owner's faces

[Eug]

they are a good starting point as a first car, respond well to suspension mods, and have alot of variety in aftermarket bits.

it's a good stepping stone if you intend on going for something with more power down the line - and admittedly you can never have enough.

definitely would be in a much better position going from an na skyline to a 200+rwkw rwd car, than someone who's gone from a corolla into a 200+rwkw car.

it's a progressive thing that builds on both the car and driver. the myriad of parts available is definitely a buying factor to consider, back then it was more financially viable to sell an NA and buy a GTST. with all the turbo motors getting rebuilt nowadays, along with a large supply of caliper/rotor combos available; you can do all the suspension mods you want while on Ps, and rebuild a motor to throw in when you're off onto opens.

[joeyjoejoejuniorshabadoo]

Buy a shitbox gemini or something that will be cheap to replace when you write it off.

p platers are shit drivers. Fact.

now lets not have a bunch of 18 year olds come in here and complain about that comment like i just f**ked their mum.

why do insurance companies have p plate excesses? Cause p platers crash too often. It takes a few years to really be safe on the roads. Not a few weeks.

i wrote off my first car, as did many people i know and would always recommend buying something cheap as a first car.

[adam-__-]

Buy a shitbox gemini or something that will be cheap to replace when you write it off.

p platers are shit drivers. Fact.

now lets not have a bunch of 18 year olds come in here and complain about that comment like i just f**ked their mum.

why do insurance companies have p plate excesses? Cause p platers crash too often. It takes a few years to really be safe on the roads. Not a few weeks.

i wrote off my first car, as did many people i know and would always recommend buying something cheap as a first car.

Isn't one of the guys racing in V8 Supercars on their P's (probably off by now, but he was doing pretty well when he was still on P's).

[joeyjoejoejuniorshabadoo]

i was fairly obviously generalising

[Freddy Kruger]

dont get a non turbo skyline on your Ps. Save the money that would have been wasted on insurance for when your off your Ps and can legal drive a turbo.

and if youd like to know, after 3 years on full comp, its about $7k on insurance...

get something thats cheap and only need 3rd party insurance to cover you. like perhaps a VP Commodore for just an example. $250 insurance per year 3rd party. can find them for about $2k+.

add what you saved on buying a commodore and what you saved on insurance... thats a fair bit of cash!!!

Edited October 3, 2007 by Freddy Kruger

[scathing]

Other benefits include

OK, lets go through your "benefits as a twisties/track vehicle".

The looks of a skyline

Oh-kay. How does "looks" make it go any faster through the twisties or track?

-The potential to be a reasonably competitive track/streeter with work (suspension etc or even a turbo for a nice high comp hard pulling car with minimal lag.

I'm still not seeing how a big, fat, front heavy, car is still better than a lighter and shorter car as a base for modifying. Its not like the Silvia or Integra are missing a solid aftermarket range, and so they can get suspension work done.

You've still yet to address my concerns that the Skyline's too long and with far too much engine in front of the front struts to have good steering response, and a lot heavier than its competitors which punishes it under brakes, on turn-in, and exacerbates the front heaviness problem when trying to change direction through a set of switchbacks.

The only way you can really "fix" that is to install a shorter, lighter motor. Which defeats the purpose of buying the Skyline in the first place.

-Most of the features that many other skylines have.. LSD, ATTESA etc

He's not comparing it to other Skylines. He's comparing it to other cars.

-Better fuel economy than most other turbo cars out there under the same price range

- Cheaper to insure

- Lower maint costs

Once again, pretty much irrelevant to your "great for twisties" assertion.

- A great base for those new to the skyline scene, to learn the inner workings of RB'S

OK, so its a great car if you want a career as a mechanic. Its got sweet f**k all to do with being a good car for the winding road.

You need to stop looking at the GTS as a car by which you want to get the absolute most out of for street/track performance.

I will, once you take back your comment that its actually any good for street/track performance.

Half the examples you've given above is that its cheap, not fast.

And on a side note they're great fun to wipe the smile's off rx8 owner's faces

I can do that in a Mazda2 or Pulsar SSS, which don't even look like a sports cars and so are even more offensive when the RX-8 driver gets chopped.

You seriously don't know what the word context means, do you? Kevin's question is if should he buy a NA Skyline over other NA sports cars, not why he shouldn't not buy it. You've given reasons why the GTS isn't that bad, not why its better than a Silvia, Clio, Integra etc. You say its good for twisties/track, something I asked you to clarify since the laws of physics are against you, and your above "benefits" do nothing to prove it.

Edited October 3, 2007 by scathing

[Eug]

He's asked if he should get an NA R33/R34, and I say why not? They did make them for a reason.

I don't see why all the 'turbo owners' are saying to get a run around car for 2 years then 'upgrade', like owning an NA is some kind of taboo. (I am just generalizing with 'turbo owners' here).

Get real, a car is a car... and a non turbo skyline is that. Despite its age, it will out perform any 'run around car' and provide a solid foundation for any type of motorsport the owner chooses to do. Not to mention it's a fundamental stepping stone in providing the skills and know-how in what everyone calls 'upgrading'.

Extreme case senario; hold off on buying the 'oh so wonderful GTR' and just get a run around car, then upgrade in 50 years into your pagani zonda.

I may seem bitter, but I'm not. I can afford owning a gtst/gtr - i just choose not to. The R33 GTS does everything I require of it. If anything I've probably seen more track time than many 300HP gtst owners, so what is it exactly that you have the turbo for then? (Again generalizing with the turbo).

If we can skip all the garbage in regards to turbo vs. na; it's a never ending arguement - you will see that there's absolutely nothing wrong with owning one. I've driven a turbo, I like the turbo, but I don't feel as though I need a turbo - it's a personal preference, and people have to stop pushing their own ideals onto others.

[joeyjoejoejuniorshabadoo]

Fair point, although i still think one's first car should be cheap and replacable.

[scathing]

If we can skip all the garbage in regards to turbo vs. na

But, if I don't keep trying to tell people that NA is best, they'll never learn!

I thought about it, and if I could afford two cars (daily driver runabout and a dedicated sports car) I'd get the runabout with a turbo, set up for fuel economy like the Saabs or turbo diesels) and get the sports car as NA, for the responsiveness. A dedicated sports car will be ultra lightweight anyway, so I don't need power.