Tsukuba Race Prep (all Finished, Some Vids & Pics ) !

[Snowman]

But the best thing about this one is it has one of Duncans attessa controllers, so I can make it very rear biased and hopefully be able to handle it!

Um.... actually it won't. The lowest setting on those controllers is "standard" and all other settings are just increases in FWD bias.

Sorry but the only way you are going to make it more RWD biased is to take the front shaft out or avoid accelerating hard in a straight line.

Anyways.... Go Saints.

[Willo]

street class - street tyres (>100 UTQG)

race class - semi slicks

I think the international "rules" are >140 UTQG. I don't think a blanket tyre rule is the best answer but it's certainly a lot simpler than some of the other ideas going round. Simple is best.

I agree that Russ should be left to come up with some rules and put them up. Not everyone will agree with them, but if he is putting in the effort to organise such a huge event then I think he should get final say and be respected for it.

I'm sure Russ values the opinions posted here but it is his series and I'm pretty sure he has a set of rules in mind which will be made available as soon as they are finalised. People then have a choice, run within the rules or don't run.

[FranZ]

Just to throw a cat amongst the pigeons and get you all talking somemore, Redline Time Attacks 2007 Rules: http://www.redlinetimeattack.com/docs/2007...tackRulesV2.pdf

[swanny180]

I think those rules look pretty reasonable, except perhaps considering the intended japanese focus of this event would mean that the widebody/overfender rule for street class wouldnt be too appropriate, considering there would be a fair number of purely street driven cars with overfenders or widebody conversions.

EDIT: Just read the modified class rules where widebodys etc *are* allowed.

I guess this would now more depend on whether 3 classes are needed/desired...

Also, just my personal opinion, I dont see why headlinings should be removable in street class.

Carpets are a bit iffy, but I guess justifiable considering some people do drive without carpet in their street car...

But really, removing roof linings would be moving a little bit too far away from street cars I believe.

I also think the no pro drivers for street class rule is a good idea

Edited December 22, 2007 by swanny180

[fatz]

am i the only one who watches repeats of All Saints on my dvd player installed by Doran pro audio whilst at the track?

im just so attached

[9krpm]

Lets not forget that this is intend to be a SAFE time attack event. The intention is build your best car, try to have fun on the track and achieve the best optimal time (SAFELY). It's looks like the main sticky point here is tyre selection. Is there any reason why we could not have 3 simple and fair classes of shonky street tyres, semi slick and slick?

Personally, I don't care about a $50 trophy. I care about the racing spirit, my safety and being able to drive the car to the track without getting ping for using slick on the street. I will never put street tyres on my GTR cause it's just so unsafe and I will get kick off the track for drifting as well

So can we agree to disagree on the tyre aspects. What's next? Trims/panels/chassis modification?

[Downforce]

If you're talking about the 'racing spirit' and it's being called a "time attack" event, then shouldn't there at least be some effort to align with the original Rev Speed event rules? I think the rule of no slicks, any tyre up to semi slicks is my suggestion. Most competitors will not run street rubber if they want good times, so having a street tyre class, and a semi slick class is a silly thing. Just make it any tyre people want to run, but they must have tread pattern. Done. Remember, it's about keeping it simple.

[Eug]

semi slicks are just like a bolt on mod.

[Duncan]

No pete I'm with you. I've got the DVD player and TV in the stagea for exactly that reason.

[Sydneykid]

Just to throw a cat amongst the pigeons and get you all talking somemore, Redline Time Attacks 2007 Rules: http://www.redlinetimeattack.com/docs/2007...tackRulesV2.pdf

There is some dumbarse stuff in there;

- Sequential Gear Boxes Not Permitted in Street Class.

- Sequential Gear Boxes Not Permitted in Modified Class.

But sir, my car (35GTR, M3, M5, VW, Audi etc etc) comes standard with a sequential gearbox

- All Street Class vehicles must use DOT street tires with a UTQG tread wear rating of 140 or higher, Tires with UTQG tread wear rating under 140 are not permitted in Street Class

But sir, my car (35GTR, M3, M5, VW, Audi etc etc) comes standard with a tyre rated less than 140

- All Modified Class vehicles are required to use DOT approved tires with UTQG tread wear ratings of 50 and above. Tires with less than a UTQG rating of 50 are not permitted in Modified Class.

No problem, Hoosier make a tyre that has a rating of 50 printed on it, but it's really a 30

- Front under tray cannot go rearward past the center-line of the front axle

But sir, my car comes standard with a front undertray that goes rearward past the centre line of the front axle

And lastly;

- All vehicles must use tires that are legal for use on public roadways in the United States, Japan or the European Union.

What about us Ozzies?

Merry Xmas

Gary

[hrd-hr30]

Lets not forget that this is intend to be a SAFE time attack event. The intention is build your best car, try to have fun on the track and achieve the best optimal time (SAFELY). It's looks like the main sticky point here is tyre selection. Is there any reason why we could not have 3 simple and fair classes of shonky street tyres, semi slick and slick?

Personally, I don't care about a $50 trophy. I care about the racing spirit, my safety and being able to drive the car to the track without getting ping for using slick on the street. I will never put street tyres on my GTR cause it's just so unsafe and I will get kick off the track for drifting as well

So can we agree to disagree on the tyre aspects. What's next? Trims/panels/chassis modification?

only reason is that time attacks have street tyre and semi slick classes, and no full slicks. is there any reason it should be done different here?

there's nothing unsafe about using road tyres on a race track. but if you think you have too much power for them, then stay on your semi slicks and run in that class. no problem.

the point is its a much easier way to seperate the classes than trying to make your own rules based on levels of modifications. your case is a perfect example - a heavily modified car won't want to run on street tyres and therefore will be in the race/semi slick class. perfect. doesn't mean the street tyre class shouldn't be there for less modified cars. And if a heavily modified car were to run on street tyres, they'd probably struggle to beat much less modified cars that aren't overpowering their tyres, so they act as a bit of a 'leveller'.

if the classes are going to be based on mods, then using an established set of rules makes alot more sense than trying to come up with your own. either Duncan's (I think it was) suggestion of using Production and Improved Prod rules or the Rev Speed rules.

If you're talking about the 'racing spirit' and it's being called a "time attack" event, then shouldn't there at least be some effort to align with the original Rev Speed event rules? ...having a street tyre class, and a semi slick class is a silly thing.

isn't that how the original time attack rules are - street tyres and semi slicks?

[Downforce]

isn't that how the original time attack rules are - street tyres and semi slicks?

Not sure how they group the classes/results, but I was referring to the rules not permitting full slicks. I still think the street tyres are a waste of time hehe

Gary has some good points tho, whatever rules Russ comes up with should be relevant for Australia, and not include over-complicated restrictions..

Merry Xmas all!!

[N1GTR]

Lets just let Russ decide and get on with it

[T04GTR]

There is some dumbarse stuff in there;

- Sequential Gear Boxes Not Permitted in Street Class.

- Sequential Gear Boxes Not Permitted in Modified Class.

But sir, my car (35GTR, M3, M5, VW, Audi etc etc) comes standard with a sequential gearbox

- All Street Class vehicles must use DOT street tires with a UTQG tread wear rating of 140 or higher, Tires with UTQG tread wear rating under 140 are not permitted in Street Class

But sir, my car (35GTR, M3, M5, VW, Audi etc etc) comes standard with a tyre rated less than 140

- All Modified Class vehicles are required to use DOT approved tires with UTQG tread wear ratings of 50 and above. Tires with less than a UTQG rating of 50 are not permitted in Modified Class.

No problem, Hoosier make a tyre that has a rating of 50 printed on it, but it's really a 30

- Front under tray cannot go rearward past the center-line of the front axle

But sir, my car comes standard with a front undertray that goes rearward past the centre line of the front axle

And lastly;

- All vehicles must use tires that are legal for use on public roadways in the United States, Japan or the European Union.

What about us Ozzies?

Merry Xmas

Gary

that is pretty retarded. is this a cams rule list? of the top of my head 048 advans come with 60 treadware lol.

[9krpm]

there's nothing unsafe about using road tyres on a race track. but if you think you have too much power for them, then stay on your semi slicks and run in that class. no problem.

I've tracked less powerful cars, my stock s2000 and C32AMG, with street tyres before. After a couple of laps the tyres got too soft and it's not much fun. The stability control on the Merc prevent the car from loosing control but the s2k is more than a handful to control. The attessa system on the GTR is a beauty. With twice the power output of the c32, it doesn't have significant stability problem with street tyres until the tyres get too hot. So, it really depends on the format of the time attack. If it's a 20 mins session, then I would hate to see accidents on the track because people run around on overheated street tyres just because they want to qualify for this class. Also by allowing people to run only street tyres, you are not bridging the gaps between modern cars with stability control and cars without any electronic stability control system

the point is its a much easier way to seperate the classes than trying to make your own rules based on levels of modifications. your case is a perfect example - a heavily modified car won't want to run on street tyres and therefore will be in the race/semi slick class. perfect. doesn't mean the street tyre class shouldn't be there for less modified cars. And if a heavily modified car were to run on street tyres, they'd probably struggle to beat much less modified cars that aren't overpowering their tyres, so they act as a bit of a 'leveller'.

The questions are do we want any leveller in a time attack event where we should be trying to get the best time we can achieve and what is stopping someone from winding down the boost and use street tyres?

What ever the classes will be, I will be keen to attend all of them if possible. I just hope that the rules will be simple without too many restriction. I will use all tyres; street, semi and slick; to see what is the best time I can achieve....just for the fun of it. As mentioned before, the winners will still be $100+g gtr and the extreme European exotica. Neither of which will be mine

Edited December 27, 2007 by 9krpm

[ferni]

Semi's also overheat in a 20min session and go off.

[Downforce]

Not as quick as street rubber.

[Duncan]

well it depends on the tyre compound, the pressure in the tyres, driving style etc. Those rotten Yoko A048r we race on can last an hour's racing.

[giant]

hey duncan

what compound are the ao48's??

[Sydneykid]

hey duncan

what compound are the ao48's??

There are 3 "compounds" of A048, so called "soft", "medium" and "medium/hard", not all compounds are available in all sizes and to further complicate matters, Yokohama Australia (in their infinite wisdom) don't bring in all the available compounds and sizes. Consequently it woiuld be my understanding that Duncan has to race on "medium/hard". This season we changed one of the race team cars (not a Skyline) from 17" wheels to 16" so we could run the "mediums", result being 0.75 secs faster at OP. With no discernable difference in tyre life.

So if you are contemplating running A048's I strongly suggest that you check the sizes and compounds first, before you buy wheels (too late he said).

Happy New Year

Gary