commodors vs skylines

[Cubes]

My mate went from a older shaped supra to a VT SS and said the same thing.

1 year later and he has sold it and bout a newish S15.

[PuppaDuck]

Didn't Skylines beat Commodores in all the big races to the extent that Holden cried till they got rid of the Skyline and changed the name to V8 Supercars ??

Gives them a better chance of having Commodores win when there are barely no other cars racing in the league...

Get rid of the competition and makes some sales...

Also, pity about the depreciation...everyone I know who got a loan to pay for their new Commodores actually have more debt than value left in their car loan...

First year - buy the car for 50K...owe 50K...

Second year - you owe 44K...car is worth 42K...burns oil

Third year - you owe 38K...car is worth 34K...burns more oil and rattles

[summoner]

puppaduck.. 1stly shut the **** up you clueless net parrot.

for the billionth time. Yes skylines dominated Group A racing(wha tu expect from a car built to do it), but it wasn't Holden who cried. Infact no1 started turning up to races, it was boring every race being dominated by Richards and Skaife.. and it was becomming to expensive to run. So eventually they phased out Group A racing world wide.

The 2 make series was proposed due to being alot cheaper to run(by using local components) and it took off from there. Now the racings 1 of the most watched formula's in the world.

PS. i notice this attitude is most prevailant in r33 gts-t owners... most of whom's cars are shit slow compared to a decent commodore(read bog stock LS-1). This is all i want to say on this topic again.. because face it. All you guys do is dribble the same shit about it over and over so. Oh and when u do beat that VC with the starfire 4cyl.. that doesnt mean u have a commodore killing car ****heads.

[Roy]

This is a pointless argument, but heres my buck-fifty anway

Im with Summoner re - Grp A.

The Grp A category died the world over, so Australia like the Italian/British/German etc etc all had to adopt another formula. In Aus we chose V8s. Looking back our formula appears to be the only one still intact today!

I like my Skyline, always have liked Skylines back to the farmer Fury days of the DR30.

Look back a few years and you will see Nissan despite having had successes with the Bluebird, DR30 and R31 was fed up with being beat worldwide by the Sierra, BMW and yes in Australia by Commodores (i recall Gricey even took a VK OS and won a race in England)

So along comes a purpose built sports car, with twin turbos and 4wd. Hardly a homologation special based on a hatchback (Sierra) or a sedan/coupe (3/6 series BMW & Commodore).

I for one loved seeing Nissan (too bad Seton had left by this stage) dominate, i also loved seeing Percy and Grice win in '90 with the VL and come 2nd in the VN a year later.

As for Commodore v Skylines, i couldnt care less, id take a good example of either, one thing though. It pays to remember that the Commodore gave it to Nissan and our Skyline for years.

Between 85 and 92, compare the Skyline v Commodore scorecards at Bathurst. GTR 91 & 92 v GpA Commodores 90, 87, 86. Thats 2 to 3 ppl.

Oh... and in 85 - Holden came in ahead of Nissan

88 - i think Holden came in ahead of Nissan again

89 - R31s came in ahead of Commodores in 3rd & 4th

Im off to hide:D

[summoner]

thankyou roy for showing to me that not all the sau'ers are narrow minded gumbies

[Morgs]

Yeah nice post Roy

[Cubes]

The Monaro's look damn nice..

I saw a yellow one driving around locally of late and it looks very nice.

I've had a bad experience with my lemon of a VS V8 5 Speed but oh well...

How do the new Commodores take to a hammerering i.e diff's blowing and gearbox's dieing?!?!

[Roy]

How do the new Commodores take to a hammerering i.e diff's blowing and gearbox's dieing?!?!

Dont know, i dont imagine not all that well, but why would you get in a car and hammer it?

You can still enjoy a car and what it can do without doing flat changes, revs and dumps, aka hammering.

Also consider the weight of the car and the torque of the engine, and its no wonder they dont handle abuse as well as the Skylines... that and i dont think you can argue they are as strong anyway.

Im probably the only one on this forum that if i had plenty of cash to throw at a nice weekend/club car, id get a VL Brock, then id go the Tremec 5-spd, Motec Twin throttle injection, Alloy EFI heads, Harrop 6 pots with some nice FR17" or FR18" Simmons, some coil overs and susp work, a 9" diff, some good internals and presto an easy 450hp and 7000rpm in a light, tidy body.

I like imports for the bang they offer , and they were a different flavour compared to the masses of modded cars on the roads in sydney.

3 years later and its now rare that i see a modded car that isnt an import, (for good reason i might add... they are great value for money) ,

Plus when you do the numbers on the wish list VL it doesnt make a lot of sense $$$, when my current R32 gets its new turbo it will do basically the same job.

Oh and just to sh1t stir some more, if any Sydney folk go to Motoconcepts days at Eastern Creek, you may be familiar with a VK grp A Brock.

It hauls courtesy fo an Ian Tate motor, wasnt it funny to watch it repeatedly blow the doors of a genuine R34 GTR Nurberg jobbie.

[JimX]

Originally posted by summoner

thankyou roy for showing to me that not all the sau'ers are narrow minded gumbies

Summoner, I would be more inclined to agree with many of your points (as I do with Roy) if you weren't so abusive in nature. You see a Skyline owner bag out Commodores and you take it all personally and start belittling Skylines for no apparent reason.

"most of whom's cars are shit slow compared to a decent commodore (read bog stock LS-1)." <- All I can see is a lot of insecurity with statements like that. Both cars run 14 second quarter miles when stock, is that really "shit slow"? On top of that, are "most" Skylines (that are owned by readers of this forum) stock-standard? What are you really trying to cover up for here? That a 10-year old Skyline makes almost as much power as a brand new Commodore? (how does it fare with the VR's and EL's of the same era?) Or maybe that there are many people trading their Commodores in for Skylines, but very few going in the opposite direction? Why would that happen at all, if Skylines are slow pieces of shit as you say? I also can't understand how you can say that an R33 Skyline beating a VC Commodore is not valid, but a VX/VY beating an R33 is? The age differences are roughly the same in each direction of the R33.

Flame away if you must, but at least put what I've said into perspective. I find PuppaDuck's comments about Group A racing to be both inaccurate and not relevant (but his comments about depreciation are fairly close to the truth), but I don't feel the need to abuse him or his choice of car for it. And nor am I abusing yours.

[Cubes]

Well holden have upgraded up the brakes etc considerably since the VS this is why I ask.

You can still enjoy a car and what it can do without doing flat changes, revs and dumps, aka hammering.

Thats true but I never used to flat change's or burnouts in the VS.

Hard launches off the line is what killed the diff and what caused the rear chassis to crack from one of the diff mount bolts causing around 45degree's camber and the car's arse end sitting on the ground.

Then there was the gearbox poping out of all gears just after a hard launch in first.

The old VL I had took a hammering then again it didn't have LSD so not as much torque etc was getting to the ground on launches, same with the old mild 250 4 speed cortina.

Sure you can enjoy a car without giving it stick but why bother buying a 'Performance' car......

[summoner]

stock.. you guys all claim they come in stock.. filter and exhaust is not stock. reason i abuse them is because its the same inane dribble time and again. As for age differance.. theres plenty of older cars quicker than commodores and skylines *shrugs. While harsh i may have been it gets frustrating seeing idiots open their mouths just to get in that same line "remember bathurst" etc.

Commodore gearboxes are extremely strong being based on the Borg Warner T56 design and currently built by Tremec.

As for comparing years. I used to see constant posts from people who "killed" commodores in their gts-t's.. yet most times they race the bottom of the line commodore so hardly a mean feat. the gts-t is 1 bellow the gt-r in grand scheme of things so it'd be like me beating a bog stock gts n/a and claiming i can kill gt-r's etc.

[Roy]

At the end of the day im an oddball, id love to put a 1JZ or a 2JZ into a VF Valiant coupe so dont listen to a word i say

[Cubes]

summoner...

When a mate at work owned a VT SS Auto (stock) my R32 was decently quicker when it was stock. When I say stock it was stock, stock exhaust, airbox stock etc.

It made 115rwkw on a DD Dyno then with a little bit of fiddling (timing etc) it made 125rwkw. Still stock though.

Then after an exhaust and 1.5psi extra of boost it made 152rwkw and used to beat on several occasions a VX Manual GenIII that had an exhaust fitted.

And would accelerate at the same pace once up and rolling as a R33 GTR.

Then there was the 'stock' 255LS1 Maloo ute around here with Maloo as the number plate. I would still to accelerate quicker right up until 4th where we backed off half way through.

He got the better launch off the lights and pulled in front by third gear was started nudging in front again.

I was actually very suprised when the 32 was up there accelerating slightly quicker than the Maloo 255LS1 as I expected to get cleaned up. Same with the GTR...

(i've got a mpg of a run that was done with the GTR & VX Manual GenII commodore, it was taken from the VX GenII. 3lane lineup.

[PuppaDuck]

Summoner - All of what you replied with may be true, but you have not said anything that disproves anything of what I said...

Except you threw in an insult which shows you are a little emotional about the subject...and to that I will yield because I can't recall any links to shove in your face that details the threats of boycotting that occurred during the whole saga...

ps. I never mentioned comparing apples and oranges, of which you sound like you are, speaking of bodge stock LS-1s...and GTS-Ts...

Me thinks because you have paid a pretty penny for your obviously superior later-model car (yes in its stock form), you'd like to be hailed the better man when comparing yourself to GTS-T owners...

So to put you in your place, I am TELLING YOU that your APPLE is mightier than my ORANGE...

The reason why you will hear a lot of people try to put you in your place by mentioning Bathurst, is because it is one instance where Commodores and Skylines were able to be put in THE SAME CLASS...hence to compare an APPLE and an APPLE...

So no need to get personal...

No need to compare your car vs my car...

No need to put anyone down...

And the moral of the story - EVERYONE should be able to enjoy fruit !

[PuppaDuck]

Personally - I just want one !

[toby19]

Summoner,

I have full respect for you.

Commodores appeal to certain types of people with certain needs. Skylines appeal to people with other needs. As long as people find fulfillment in whatever choices they make, that should be enough.

Let us also be careful with the "factual" information that we post. It may reflect on us.

[summoner]

yeh i dont mind either car.. infact i've just recently bought a nissan import etc.. but it does get up my goat when every comparison made ya just hear "bathurst".. atleast in HPI's comparo it avoided it

[Guest INASNT]

Originally posted by summoner

yeh i dont mind either car.. infact i've just recently bought a nissan import etc.. but it does get up my goat when every comparison made ya just hear "bathurst".. atleast in HPI's comparo it avoided it

blue cefiro hey??

[summoner]

correct

[Guest INASNT]

are u gonna comvert it to LS1??