Gibson Gt-r

[djr81]

You mean with statements like this....

No doubt the GTR was the class of the field in Gp A racing. Its success in Aus and Japan proces that. But GMS with Winfield money and Skaife/Ricahrds woudl have just as likely won irrespective of the car they were running. Look what they did in the 2nd year of V8s with Winfield money and a class act team.

So the fact that one of the big 3 strongest teams happened to have a technical advantage just made it that much easier.

So outside of Grp A if you look at the Production Racing history of the R32 GTR it was not as great. Turbo and gearbox failures, brake problems and lack of pace, most notably in the Bathurst 12 hours where its ass was handed to it by the RX7s and 968 Porsches and M3s. If the GTR was clearly the better car off the showroom floor then it would have been far more competitive. Its production success (or lack of) seems to be in contrast with its Grp A results where it was well funded and supported, with mostly privateer teams struggling with the GTR (Falken GTR at the mountain springs too mind)

Great car...but not the unbeatable beast that we all assume

I agree with what you are saying 100%. Yes GMS did do well when the V8's were introduced - once the aero updates on the VP Commode were put in place. They continued to do well up until the Yokohamas lost any pretence of competitiveness against the Bridgestones.

As for the GT-R outside Group A - again I agree. But it is perhaps a little harsh a criticism given the whole intent of the original GT-R design was to win in Group A. So job done there. If you look at the strong points/weak points of the car you can see how the regulations shaped the design. For example the brakes are rubbish, but the Group A rules allowed this to be fixed so it was all good on the race cars. The pistons/rods are relatively weak. Again, not a Group A problem.

On the upside the productions cars' induction system is a work of art - no real manifold freedoms for your race car so you can see why they had to get it right.

I could go on for a bit (as far as my memory allows which isn't far). But anyone who has tried to punt a GTR around a race track would be well aware of it being less than the invincible creation that many keyboard warriors insist it is.

Edited February 5, 2008 by djr81

[Roy]

As far as being invincible...i see them as a blan canvas. The building blocks are there to build an almost unbeatable package.

[Marlin]

Agree with both of you as well! The GTR was hatched as a great basis for a competetive Group A vehicle. I guess in a similar way the the Sunny Gti-R had similar aspirations on the world rally scene, but it didn't quite come off for them, as many other manufacturers had similar and/or better ideas.

I'm sure many of us remember reading original (road car) comparisons and tests in the likes of Wheels mag etc, where the 32 typically blitzed everything, and being a little dismayed that it didn't translate into "showroom spec" on-track success, like in the Bathurst 12 hour you mention.

[djr81]

As far as being invincible...i see them as a blan canvas. The building blocks are there to build an almost unbeatable package.

I will try to remember that when I am getting spanked by an Evo.

Invincible means you don't have to lift off the throttle, yes?

[Marlin]

LOL!!!!

[Roy]

Walls, armco...just punch on straight through them. But a 1400kg, 650-700hp AWD car with good track and wheelbase, with reasonable weight distribuition/dynamics serves as a good basis for a quick car. Shame it costs 80-120k to get the whole show

[djr81]

Walls, armco...just punch on straight through them. But a 1400kg, 650-700hp AWD car with good track and wheelbase, with reasonable weight distribuition/dynamics serves as a good basis for a quick car. Shame it costs 80-120k to get the whole show

More worried about the fk off big dump truck tyres they use instead of armco at my local track. (Collie). I don't think you would punch through them so much as bounce off them into some sort of geostationary orbit.

I suppose anything can be made to go hard if you tip enough dollars into it. 650hp will have to wait until I rebuild the motor. But yes it does make a better starting point than most cars.

Anyway, given the thread title maybe we should go back to talking about R31 gearbox fragility & the 1988 Sandown 500. How did they end up fixing it, or didn't they?

Also Bo Seton - brilliant engine builder or not. Discuss.

[floody]

The gearbox fragility fix can be described in one word : Holinger.

[Sydneykid]

It is worth keeping in mind that Nissan recognised the "standard" R32GTR's shortcomings as far as Production Car Racing was concerned, hence the N1 suite of parts. Unfortunately Australian Production Car racing did/does not run to the FIA N1 regulations, hence no N1 parts were allowed. Nissan internationally had a policy of running only in events conforming to FIA N1 and Group A regs.

Keeping the above in mind, the R32GTR that ran in the 1992 12 Hour was not factory supported, was a privateer (1 car) effort, ran a 100% Australian spec car, was grossly underfunded with amatuer drivers and the car preparation was hasty to say the least. Compared to the full Mazda (3 cars) and Porsche (3 cars) works supported team with professional drivers. It was never in the race, pardon the pun.

Cheers

Gary

[Beer Baron]

As far as being invincible...i see them as a blan canvas. The building blocks are there to build an almost unbeatable package.

yeah the building blocks are there alright, it just takes a lot of money for the construction...

I reckon with what I know now $80,000 would be plenty to buy and build a nice, fast, reliable R32 GTR.

[Roy]

It is worth keeping in mind that Nissan recognised the "standard" R32GTR's shortcomings as far as Production Car Racing was concerned, hence the N1 suite of parts. Unfortunately Australian Production Car racing did/does not run to the FIA N1 regulations, hence no N1 parts were allowed. Nissan internationally had a policy of running only in events conforming to FIA N1 and Group A regs.

Keeping the above in mind, the R32GTR that ran in the 1992 12 Hour was not factory supported, was a privateer (1 car) effort, ran a 100% Australian spec car, was grossly underfunded with amatuer drivers and the car preparation was hasty to say the least. Compared to the full Mazda (3 cars) and Porsche (3 cars) works supported team with professional drivers. It was never in the race, pardon the pun.

Cheers

Gary

So summarising...the GTR sucked balls

[chola]

G'day

Hoping someone can help me with some information (pics would be great as well if available).

Does anyone know what type of engine fan/s the Gibson Motorsport Winfield R32 ran? Was it the normal viscous type, or was it swapped out for thermo's?

I also need to know about the brakes, I know at this point they weren't cross drilled, but were they slotted?

I would love any pics of the brakes and suspension (especially with a wheel removed, and also looking in the engine bay forward (to see the fans).

Thanks in advance for any assistance.

Edited February 5, 2008 by chola

[Alf]

For those who don't have the 91 & 92 footage on their pc.

http://www.crystalnode.net/bathurstvideos/...hurst91divx.avi

http://www.crystalnode.net/bathurstvideos/...hurst92divx.avi

approx 650 mb each

[Roy]

Nice vids...any chance of you having the 87, 88 ,89, 90 races well. Hell any of the other Grp A races? My tapes grow old and tired...and some lost

[ajrichar]

G'day

Hoping someone can help me with some information (pics would be great as well if available).

Does anyone know what type of engine fan/s the Gibson Motorsport Winfield R32 ran? Was it the normal viscous type, or was it swapped out for thermo's?

I also need to know about the brakes, I know at this point they weren't cross drilled, but were they slotted?

I would love any pics of the brakes and suspension (especially with a wheel removed, and also looking in the engine bay forward (to see the fans).

Thanks in advance for any assistance.

Sydneykid - this may be one for you......

[Roy]

So can we post up all things Grp A or should that be another thread?

[Jetwreck]

I think there should be a Nissan Group A thread or just a Group A thread in general. Then we could at least let everyone know were we are racing and post pic's of the RB20's kicking arse.....maybe even the odd RB26's kicking arse as well.

P.S. Not forgetting the Group C stuff either!

P.S.S I hear there's a new owner of a Sierra(Hand Grenade) about to start racing. Hint: The car has only ever raced in Aus once before.

[N1GTR]

Easy done

[Tomek]

Not sure if this has been added to this thread...

But was a great watch...

[Swiper the Fox]

yeah the building blocks are there alright, it just takes a lot of money for the construction...

I reckon with what I know now $80,000 would be plenty to buy and build a nice, fast, reliable R32 GTR.

yeah...you'd buy mine and have $20 000+ to spend on brakes, rubber and other nick naks.