Howard Vs Rudd

[stolen_s15]

Hmm, interesting.

1. The Hawke/Keating government introduced the HECS (Higher Education Contribution Scheme) which means if you go to uni you pay the tax man. Plain & simple. O/S (full fee paying) student have been at our unis for many, many years. Good on them. Why should they be denied an education as well?

2. All politicians are liars. Plain & simple. Actually they are not. If you (or anyone else) had everything they ever said scrutinised & debated & misrepresented then you too (& me & everyone else) would be termed a liar. Rudd has the advantage of not having been around long enough to have piled up baggage.

3. Howard fkd up on the first change when they introduced the AWA's. But now that they have implemented a no disadvantage test covering the most important benifits you can't get little of no compensation for trading your penalty rates etc. Try working on a salary - you don't get any O/T, penalty rates or anything other than your salary. Not everyone works on wages or can even get access to AWA's.

4. Kyoto is a lame duck. Ratifying it will make bugger all difference. If Rudd had any bollocks he wouldn't be banging on about a target in 2050 - thats what four changes of government & 15 elections away. He would map out a short term target (say every year until 2020) & set out how he would achieve it. So would Howard. But they are both too gutless.

To finish: what I hate the most about this election is the me too, cloning that is going on in the policy areas. Weak as piss.

1. Labour will invest in our eduaction system. The lack of govt funding to universities in the form of government funded uni places (outlined in the recent OECD report mentioned in the debate last night) has forced universites to take on full fee paying students. I'm not being racist when refering to O/S students, I just belive that we should be educating or own citizens first and foremost and then looking overseas.

2. Howard lied on the Tampa and the GST. The argument that 'rudd simply hasn't been around long enough to lie' is baseless.

3. The fairness test is great in theory, I have pesonally seen friends be disadvantaged by this test. So forgive my pesisism.

4. Ratifying it will at least put some targets in place! John Howard has been a documented opponent to the climate change theory, only in the last few months has he put any effert into addressing the issue (No doubt in repsonse to his pathetic poll results). The fact that Rudd has some targets impresses me, hence why I included the point

I do however agree with you on how similar the policies of the two major parties ar these days. I think a debate that involves the leaders of all parties would be more valuable to the public.

[Snowman]

This guy is a classic example of why you shouldn't vote Labour. The world would be a better place without him...

You see this dickhead a good number of years back now came into my old mans Business waving his Union Flag getting all the employee's excited about all the stuff he could get them if they joined the union. In the end it was all crap just for the sake of making himself look important. It forced my old man to sell his business as he couldn't deal with the bullying to a multi-national company who in turn shipped the entire operation off shore to Thailand and just left a warehouse here in Australia altering the workforce there from 280 jobs to 10 in under 2 years.

There are so many stories like this and things like the IR reforms are the only things that will prevent more from happening. These idiots love to try and look good for small short term gains that end up with everyone having big long term losses.

Oh - and he's the Labor Candidate for the Federal Seat of Maribyrnong at the next Federal Election. So vote for him if you want to lose your job.

[djr81]

1. Labour will invest in our eduaction system. The lack of govt funding to universities in the form of government funded uni places (outlined in the recent OECD report mentioned in the debate last night) has forced universites to take on full fee paying students. I'm not being racist when refering to O/S students, I just belive that we should be educating or own citizens first and foremost and then looking overseas.

2. Howard lied on the Tampa and the GST. The argument that 'rudd simply hasn't been around long enough to lie' is baseless.

3. The fairness test is great in theory, I have pesonally seen friends be disadvantaged by this test. So forgive my pesisism.

4. Ratifying it will at least put some targets in place! John Howard has been a documented opponent to the climate change theory, only in the last few months has he put any effert into addressing the issue (No doubt in repsonse to his pathetic poll results). The fact that Rudd has some targets impresses me, hence why I included the point

I do however agree with you on how similar the policies of the two major parties ar these days. I think a debate that involves the leaders of all parties would be more valuable to the public.

1. Uni's have had full fee paying students for a very long time. Overseas students are mostly full fee paying students. The difference is the Liberals have allowed some Australian full fee paying students. Amongst a whole range of other changes. You may have a point about the funding levels to uni's, however.

2. Well Reith lied about the Tampa. You can easilly say that Howard was at minimum misled by Reith. Mostly it is just used as an excuse by the ALP for losing an election they should have won.

As for the GST well he went to an election with that in his platform, so one throw away line (Never ever) is not really worth all the hostility heaped upon him for it.

3. Labors new workplace agreements (whatever they will call them) have a similar fairness test. So take your pick. I know many people who are better off for their AWA's - they like them.

4. We have a Kyoto (unratified) target which apparently will be met. As opposed to places like Canada who have a ratified target which wont be met. The fact that ours is a pathetic target shouldn't cloud anyones judgement. Rudd's 2050 (or 2060) target is meaningless. Who is going to measure that & hold him accountable? Simply no one because no one can.

Edited October 22, 2007 by djr81

[inark]

Is it me or does Rudd wanna be a rapper?

seriously... everytime hes interviewed and asked a question... he speaks... in little... sentences at... a time... which means.... it takes longer... for him to answer.... to help him.... think on the spot... and in between... every little pause... is a deliberate.... hand movement.... to help him keep.... the beat... fricky fricket

[inark]

or maybe this is his idol

[Snowman]

Mr Tamborine Man?

[R-PWR]

Im with snowman all the way, honestly if you have half a brain when it comes to business and financial future you would vote liberal. In all honesty people are voting anti howard because they say he has been there to long. Well if the man is doing well leave him there I say, our economy is doing so well, not to mention how low interest rates were. Does anyone remember 18% INTEREST RATES under LABOUR!!

Anyways I have probabley been a bit to harsh, but honestly really think twice before you vote labour. Beazley/ Rudd same crap its labour and its policies that will never progress this country to a successful future.

IM OUT

[gun32gtr]

it dont matter who gets in they'll only get richer as we get poorer....they all line there own pockets in redicliuos ways i reckon.....

[gun32gtr]

in saying that i also agree with snowman the economy is best its been

[stolen_s15]

I agree that Howard has "balanced the books" quite well when it comes to the economy. But dont forget that alot of the positive economic figures are being inflated by the huge resources boom.

[R31Nismoid]

in saying that i also agree with snowman the economy is best its been

Its alright for people that own houses

Me, owning a house has gone from a real possibility (5 years ago), to absolutely no chance in my wildest dreams.

[NickR33]

a blind, deaf, mute monkey could have run the economy well over the last 10 years... not really a claim to fame IMO

as long as we keep digging dirt up and selling it to China we will be fine... as long as China and India continue to grow we will be fine... don't forget the last recession wasn't just confined to Australia...

but just like America over the last 10 years in this country the rich have got richer and the poor are just further in debt

ps. and I'm still not happy about Iraq, the AWB thing, Woomera detention centre and the list goes on... that smug little f**k thinks he doesn't need to explain or take responsibility for anything... just keep quiet and eventually we will all forget about it while we swim in our pools filled with champagne and dry off by rolling in piles of hundred dollar bills...

[adam-__-]

I'm still too young to vote, but if I could, I would vote Rudd. I've never experienced Australia being under 'control' by anyone else, but Howard. I just want to see how Australia will be like under Labor's control.

I obviously don't have any idea how everything works

[Paradizzle]

For all those saying Howard is a lieing shit etc.. Just wait to see what you will say about Rudd if he got in come the next election, he will be just as bad. They are all liers. Rudd just has not had a chance to prove to anyone he is a lier yet...

But Johny is the man to vote.

[Kozeyekan]

I'll be voting Rudd, simply because Howard has no fking idea what he's doing.

Children overboard scandal: Howard says he didn't know. So is he innefectual or just picked the wrong people to look into things for him?

Iraq war: Why are there troops there, and when are we pulling out.

280 million on ads telling us how great work choices are. If this money was spent on setting up free education for the areas that have severe skill shortages (say plumbers, electricians, builders, etc.) then there'd be fewer people pissed off about it all.

Tax cuts. Everybody loves them, but the only time Howard gives them is when there is an election coming up. It like getting belted by the school bully, then him saying "I'm sorry" when the parents turn up, only for him to belt you again tomorrow.

On the Labour economic model, I seriously doubt it'll send us into the shitter. They'll probably go to the self same economic experts to do their models that Howard does. I think the previous auditors were from Price, Waterhouse Coopers, though I could be wrong there. From what I hear, they get the basic economic outline, evaluate it and suggest changes, which the government generally goes along with.

Basically, I find Howard to be extremely deceptive and sly, and not a man I want representing the country. Rudd is far from ideal though, but he has been booted from a strip bar. Provided he does not simply take our dependence on the US and sub it for China, it should be all OK.

[xRHETTx]

I will be voting for Rudd.

I can't see why people keep saying that Howard has been running the economy well when the world economy is so strong at the moment.

Interest rates have increased 5 times in the near past, housing affordability is so low now that most people will never be able to pay off a house within their own lifetimes.

Howard is an absolute liar who would sell his own mother to win the next election. The lied about Tampa (of course he knew what was going on) and he lied about Workchoices.

He knows he is heading towards an election loss, so he has pulled out the Sudanese Refugee debacle, almost said sorry but won't, next week I'm sure there will be another terrorist scare the way it is going.

Howard has no idea about the environment or climate change, it is too important to not ratify Kyoto just because we will be slightly economically disadvantaged. (Which i highly doubt we will)

And Workchoices and AWA's are an absolute joke. Its fair enough for the majority of people with a university education who are on individual contracts to say they are a good thing, but what about all those millions of people out there who have no other option? What about your kids when they go for their first jobs? At my old job at a pub I was offered a place in a Certificate 3 in hospitality. the only catch was that I would have to sign an AWA which meant I no longer got any overtime or shift loadings. But because I was getting the course paid for (about $500 a year) it passed the fairness test.

But make up your own minds.

Or just trust the worm's judgement, which those bastards in the "liberal" party tried to pull the plug of on Sunday night.

[krzysiu]

wasn't it under labour that the interest rate increased to 17%?

[SuAvE-1]

labour will copy costello's economic success althoguh IR revisions will attempt to reflect increases in supply side efficiency rather than demand (labour's touch on things).

I know not nearly enough of Rudd, but I know Howard is full of Sh*t

Howard kisses too much american arse

This may not directly apply, and it may not necessarily happen, but a change may get the cops off our back with regards to traffic law.

Finally, if labour is elected, there will be much uncertainty. This is rarely good for an economy.

For me personally, i'm studying to be a lawyer. if the country has problems, they will proably be evident in the legal system in a few years time, just about when I'm able to practise... more business for me. if things run smoothly and labour does a good job, good for all of us.

I think its a matter of the lesser of two evils.

Edited October 22, 2007 by SuAvE-1

[r-power-r33]

i would vote but then both sides of the fences have there own problems 1 main issuse is for liberal with ir laws i lost my job over that stupid law lowest payed shit hours but then theres labour i own a house and i cant afford for the intrest rates to go up thats why i've never enrolled dont wana be apart of something i cant control

Edited October 22, 2007 by r-power-r33

[GTR_STEALTH]

This guy is a classic example of why you shouldn't vote Labour. The world would be a better place without him...

You see this dickhead a good number of years back now came into my old mans Business waving his Union Flag getting all the employee's excited about all the stuff he could get them if they joined the union. In the end it was all crap just for the sake of making himself look important. It forced my old man to sell his business as he couldn't deal with the bullying to a multi-national company who in turn shipped the entire operation off shore to Thailand and just left a warehouse here in Australia altering the workforce there from 280 jobs to 10 in under 2 years.

There are so many stories like this and things like the IR reforms are the only things that will prevent more from happening. These idiots love to try and look good for small short term gains that end up with everyone having big long term losses.

Oh - and he's the Labor Candidate for the Federal Seat of Maribyrnong at the next Federal Election. So vote for him if you want to lose your job.

This is the single most reason i would not vote for a Labour government.

All these other issues are pretty much confetti compared to this. Australia has already lost a number of big businesses overseas for this simple reason. Everyone complains of "fair pay", "affordability", and "job conditions"; yet it has happened many times in the past and you dont have to be a scientist to work out that:-

A company under Union control=

Company pays very high wage

Company keeps getting pushed for more and is subjected to bullying

Company is subjected to industrial action and low working hours

Company incurs loss of production hence is no longer viable to run

Company then either closes doors and calls it quits, or goes over seas where people are willing to work

Union officials take your membership fees and move onto the next company

You are now left standing in the wind with ur dick in ur hand

....yer, so much for Unions "looking after" you. Im sure that after your many years of loyalty and paying fees to them they'll now feed your family, pay your bills, pay your mortgage.......wait.......hang on......