Piggy Backs, Timing And Power.

[The Mafia]

  Tangles said:

Just say you dont know mafia, and be done with it.

all this "advice" not to use a fpr.... WHY?

actually smartass, I do know.

The factory injectors and FPR are good all the way up to 230rwkw. Throw in 555cc injectors, a Nismo 275lph pump, with the factory FPR, and you are good for 330rwkw (as my setup is)

The factory turbo runs out of flow at about 210rwkw.

So you're running out of airflow BEFORE your running out of fuel, so why the hell do you need add MORE fuel, with a dodgey aftermarket FPR? I haven't seen an aftermarket FPR do it job properly yet, and I have seen 4 so far. All had inconsistant fuel delivery which made it impossible to tune. One run the AFR's are mid 11's, the next run without any changes they are in the high 13's... Swap back to factory, and everything is perfect.

The factory regulator apparently doesn't need to be changed until beyond 350rwkw.

Now for the rest of the mods - they are not a good idea to run with a FPR anyway.............

Seriously dude, throw away the FPR and put the factory one back on, bend some signals, get about 190rwkw, and be happy with that. Anything more, you'll need a powerfc or other complete replacement and and a new turbo.

The FPR absolutely does not need to be changed.

[Daboss]

Now that you guys have apparently finished could my question get answered please?

[_Ryan_]

  URAS said:

^^^ piss the lot off and just whack in an emanage skyline plug and drive kit 550-600 for timing and fuel control.

piss the FPR off.

i PM'd you ages ago, would you like to link me to where i can get one? PM please.

-Ryan

[Tangles]

  The Mafia said:

actually smartass, I do know.

well if you said all of that to begin with I wouldnt keep asking the same question then, would I?

I asked why all the advice not to use one, you asked me what I thought it did before youd answer the query, I replied, and asked again why not to use, then you reposted the same question of a question (even tho Id answered that question a post previously)................geez so fricken hard sometimes, isnt it?

a circle within a circle within a circle.

ffs

anyway, over 200rwkw is easily possible with auto/safc/sitc/fpr/040pump/fmic/full'zaust/etc.etc.

[Tangles]

daboss - one thing......... is your skyline a Manual or an Automatic?

with FPR's - I believe that the rising rate regulators are FAR harder to tune than the Nismo adj.fpr. My stagea has been successfully tuned numerous times with the $140 Nismo fpr and Im happy with the result with piggybacks + auto.

[The Mafia]

  Tangles said:

anyway, over 200rwkw is easily possible with auto/safc/sitc/fpr/040pump/fmic/full'zaust/etc.etc.

oh my god. You must not have a clue if you are still advising someone to use a FPR if they have a factory turbo. The standard injectors and FPR ARE FINE TO 230RWKW, the factory turbo will RUN OUT OF FLOW WELL BEFORE THIS...

Why in the absolute hell would you waste money on a aftermarket potentially waste of time FPR?

Tell me? Why do you need the extra fuel when the standard equipment will deliver it NO PROBLEMS WHAT SO EVER?

Do you even understand how this system works? Judging by your advice, you do not have a clue.

People PLEASE don't listen to this persons extremely bad advice.

You do NOT need an aftermarket fuel pressure regulator for any power under 230rwkw on the factory injectors and turbo

[The Mafia]

OP - Can you please be a little bit more clear on your original question? I will do my best to answer it. Your original post is very hard to understand

I apologise for the other posts, just explaining the way the fuel systems works for the people that don't know, but just preach hearsay.

[Tangles]

I use a far larger turbo than stock

oh thats right, we forget that you're GOD when it comes to skylines

[The Mafia]

  Tangles said:

I use a far larger turbo than stock

oh thats right, we forget that you're GOD when it comes to skylines

  The Mafia said:

You do NOT need an aftermarket fuel pressure regulator for any power under 230rwkw on the factory injectors and turbo

You obviously can't read.

The original poster is pretty much giving the impression that he is using a standard turbo.

I don't think anyone gives a shit about you using a "far larger turbo than stock". You probably have no idea what it even is either. It comes down to this - The guy that posted this thread has a standard turbo, is not making more than 230rwkw, and certainly does not need an aftermarket FPR, that could potentially be causing 60% of his problems.

I'm not god when it comes to skylines, but I certainly don't give misleading bullshit information to people looking for decent help.

You're going on about FPRs, but you have NFI what they do or how much they can affect the engines running and fuel delivery.

[Daboss]

  The Mafia said:

OP - Can you please be a little bit more clear on your original question? I will do my best to answer it. Your original post is very hard to understand

I apologise for the other posts, just explaining the way the fuel systems works for the people that don't know, but just preach hearsay.

Im sorry I will try to be clearer. I was saying that I took the advice and put everything back to stock and wanted to start a tuning afresh. Now I checked my timing after I put everything back to stock and it is at 15 btdc at idle with the cas fully advanced. RPM sits at about 900 and when i remove the tps it shoots to around 1180 or so, I cleaned the aac valve and tried to set the idle by the screw that is on the acc but as soon as I replace or move the tps it goes down(when tps is connected), and idles higher (when tps is disconnected). I then tried to set the idle with ecu only to find that the ecu in the car does not have the screw you turn or a led on. So now I am stumped and really need some assistance as to where to start.

[The Mafia]

ok, I'm definately not a timing expert, but I think your Timing might be out on the actual cam gears etc. The CAS shouldn't be fully advanced to make 15 degrees. Maybe the belt has jumped a tooth or something like that. Defiantely not right.

I'd be looking right into that, but as I said, I'm not an expert so I'd be consulting someone that knows what they are doing when setting timing.

[jase-r34]

Well this is certainly one of the most entertaining threads ive read recently!

Mafia is spot on tho, an after market FPR is total waste of time for your setup. I laugh hearing bout how someone has put in a new reg in and bumped up the pressure. goes heaps harder now. hahaha

[Daboss]

  The Mafia said:

ok, I'm definately not a timing expert, but I think your Timing might be out on the actual cam gears etc. The CAS shouldn't be fully advanced to make 15 degrees. Maybe the belt has jumped a tooth or something like that. Defiantely not right.

I'd be looking right into that, but as I said, I'm not an expert so I'd be consulting someone that knows what they are doing when setting timing.

Is there anyone you can advise? Also by the belt jumping a tooth on the cam gears that would affect ignition timing? Is there anyway for me to just take a look at it and see whether or not it skipped a tooth without taking off to many parts?

[Adriano]

Yes, remove the cas, and timing cover, turn the crank pulley clockwise until it reaches TDC. Now check that the timing marks on the camshaft pulleys line up with the marks on the backing cover, if they are around the other side, turn the crank pulley 360 degrees, if the marks dont line up within about 2mm, the cam timing is out.

Im with mafia on the FPR. There is only one reason to use one, and thats to extend the scope of an injector, and on a turbo car a proper rising rate one is even better, as it doesn't require the base pressure to be raised. However FULL engine management should be used before you get to this stage, as a FPR will change the mixtures at all the load points, not just at full throttle.

[The Mafia]

lol thanks guys.

And good luck Daboss

[Daboss]

  Adriano said:

Yes, remove the cas, and timing cover, turn the crank pulley clockwise until it reaches TDC. Now check that the timing marks on the camshaft pulleys line up with the marks on the backing cover, if they are around the other side, turn the crank pulley 360 degrees, if the marks dont line up within about 2mm, the cam timing is out.

Im with mafia on the FPR. There is only one reason to use one, and thats to extend the scope of an injector, and on a turbo car a proper rising rate one is even better, as it doesn't require the base pressure to be raised. However FULL engine management should be used before you get to this stage, as a FPR will change the mixtures at all the load points, not just at full throttle.

Ok I will attempt this tomorrow, thanks guys. If it is out a tooth that means I will Have to remove the timing belt in order to get it realigned or is there another way to do it? Also if it is out a tooth how could this have happened if the timing belt has never been touched?

[Adriano]

Yes, if it is out, then the belt will have to come off to fix it, i would look at the belt anyway, as if it hasnt been changed, then its probabaly overdue.

[Daboss]

  Adriano said:

Yes, if it is out, then the belt will have to come off to fix it, i would look at the belt anyway, as if it hasnt been changed, then its probabaly overdue.

No it has never been change and the car has 94000km on the clock. I will check tomorrow and keep you guys informed. If that isn't the prob do you have any idea what else it could be thats causing me to have to fully advance my cas in order to get 15btdc?

[Daboss]

Ok forum I checked my timing belt and these pics are the results I got. The points look to be one tooth out, Can you confirm this?, also the white mark on the belt is not lined up with any of these points as u can see in the pic. Can normal wear and tear make the timing belt be one tooth off?

Edited December 2, 2007 by Daboss

[GeeTR]

  Adriano said:

However FULL engine management should be used before you get to this stage, as a FPR will change the mixtures at all the load points, not just at full throttle.

My invisible freind says that my "ceiling paint" analogy...

"Its like painting everything in your room with the white colour you want on the ceiling only, then wiping all the paint off the carpet, the door handles, the windows panes, and everything else you didn't want to have covered in paint… leaving just the ceiling"

was way cooler

Edited December 2, 2007 by GeeTR