Aircon Regassers In Melbourne That Use Hychill Hr12 Gas

[funkymonkey]

i'll be contacting HyChill and getting a list of shops to do some ringing around today. I think if we ask them if we can bring in 5 cars to do at once we should be able to negotiate on a price for their service.

[arep3]

full flush out and check up of the systems and gassing in the deal and ill drive outta my way to get this. Ive received an email from Ross at HyChill on my local blokes but they are out in Pakenham. I think it would be better if we were to get a group buy to have it more cbd.

[R324DR]

JNK auto in mitcham used to use HyChill, so you could give them a try.

[R31Nismoid]

I'll be down for a group gassing also

Gotta refurb my compressor first though, been off the car for 2 years and its 20 years old now...

How soon do we wanna get it done?

[SS8_Gohan]

hi,

does this gas work in say home air conditioning units? or is that a whole different kettle of fish? considering how power hungry ac units are, it would be nice to make them as "friendly" as possible, especially with R134a being 10,000 times more potent than CO2 in terms of warming!

[arep3]

I'll be down for a group gassing also

Gotta refurb my compressor first though, been off the car for 2 years and its 20 years old now...

How soon do we wanna get it done?

im happy to go asap. get my 1st pay packet of the year tomorrow night!

[Mavric]

I have 2 cars that need gasing

[Leon.T]

my cressida also! Depends on how far the area to get the regas!

[funkymonkey]

sorry guys, was meant to ring around but haven't had the time. I'll do it tomorrow. How far are you guys willing to travel? We might be able to convince them to come in on a Saturday to gas us all.

[Kozeyekan]

sorry guys, was meant to ring around but haven't had the time. I'll do it tomorrow. How far are you guys willing to travel? We might be able to convince them to come in on a Saturday to gas us all.

How far? Well, I'm eastern (Doncaster) but if the price is right, I'll drive for up to an hour.

I work some weekends, but if it comes to it I can always get someone else to drop my car in.

[arep3]

most of us are se melb. anywhere round ur area is good for me shan.

[funkymonkey]

I've got a shortlist of 6 guys from dandenong that can do it. If they are mobile then I might try and get them to come see us all on one day. if not I'll try and get them to open up on a saturday or something to do all of us in one go. Will make calls tomorrow.

[Sandeep]

I'd be in for a hychill regas in se suburbs. if you need more cars I could probably get some friends... just give me a week or so notice.

btw level323, would this be safe for a z32 300zx aircon system? I was just confused why most zed owners prefer the r134a conversion rather than just going for the Hychill minus 30...

Edited January 10, 2008 by Sandeep

[funkymonkey]

Just got off the phone with Graham from XR Performance in Dandenong... he said he can do em for $66 for a simple regas (apparently a lot more for a flush as its a more involved process). He said he can only fit 2 in a day because it takes about 2 hours to recharge a car... but he's happy for us to come one by one every day, and 4 on next friday.

He only reopens on monday, so he asked if I could get a schedule of who's gonna be coming in when with their cars then he can sort us all out.

A lot of the shops are closed for the break, and only reopen next week, so I guess if people aren't happy with the price then I can call around then.

edit: he also mentioned he can convert the R134a guys to HR12 for $66 as well, as its a matter of bleeding the system and recharging it.

[DivHunter]

My car will need to be regassed next week after my A/C compressor is rebuilt.

[Leon.T]

Damn, dandenong a bit for a a refill aircon gas for a car without aircon lol.

[level323]

Hi again to everyone reading this topic,

I've had my head down and tail up since returning to work on Monday, but I've squeezed enough breathing space to reply to the new posts, where necessary.

I'll respond to each post below, roughly in date order.

Firstly though, regarding all the posts asking for their nearest AC workshop that uses HyChill, the best way to find out is to contact Ross at our office. HyChill is widely used across the country (and in a number of other countries) and so you can be quite confident that there is a HyChill-friendly workshop in your area.

The best ways to contact Ross are:

1. By phone during business hours on 1300 HYCHILL (that's 1300 4924455)

2. By email to [email protected]

Our lists are as up-to-date as they can possibly be, but it's important to keep in mind that workshops move, change hands and change product allegiances all the time so it's hard to keep the lists perfectly accurate. So if one shop on the list can't do it, try another. Even better, let us know if you have problems with any particular AC shops and we'll update our lists if necessary and try to help you out further.

Here's my responses/comments to the newer posts:

btw level323, would this be safe for a z32 300zx aircon system? I was just confused why most zed owners prefer the r134a conversion rather than just going for the Hychill minus 30...

Sandeep, I'm not sure where you're getting your info from, but my guess is that the most Z32 owners get R134a conversions because they're not aware that there is a better and cheaper option... or they're deciding based on misinformation from a workshop that has swallowed the f-gas industry's hook.

Using HyChill Minus 30 in a Z32 should work fine. Z32 AC systems are fundamentally no different from the others.

Just got off the phone with Graham from XR Performance in Dandenong... he said he can do em for $66 for a simple regas (apparently a lot more for a flush as its a more involved process).

For all you guys that are currently using R-12 or R-134a (f-gases), I would highly recommend that you get a flush. A flush will remove the lubricant also, which is good because that means you can replace it with a superior oil that doesn't have the toxicity and corrosion problems that PAG oil has. Instead, request a high quality POE type or mineral type oil, or HyChill's own synthetic (PAO type) lubricant.

Why? Because a regas will leave a residual quantity of f-gas in the AC system (entrained in the oil). The consequences of this are:

* Your AC system will continue to be at risk of internal corrosion and problems relating to the corrosive nature of the residual R134a and the lubricant.

* If there is enough residual f-gas in the system, operating pressures will higher than they need to be. This means that cooling times and engine load may not be as good as they could be. The amount of residual f-gas depends on how good (and how long) the vacuum pumping process is.

Compressors usually cost at least $800 - $1200, and often more. Getting rid of the corrosive issues by completely removing both the R134a refrigerant and the PAG lubricant is the SINGLE MOST beneficial thing you can do to get much longer life out of your compressor. Removing these corrosion sources will have similar effects on the longevity of the other two expensive parts of your AC system, the condenser and evaporator.

The story is different for R-12 systems (that is, basically all pre 1994 systems). R-12 does not have anywhere near the same corrosive issues as R134a, and R-12 is compatible with mineral oils. So most (if not all) R-12 systems use a non-PAG oil. This means that conversion of an R-12 system to HyChill is much easier, because you don't need to remove every trace of the R-12 and lubricant. A good regassing is all that's needed in this case.

edit: he also mentioned he can convert the R134a guys to HR12 for $66 as well, as its a matter of bleeding the system and recharging it.

That's good news, but I cannot stress enough the long term benefits of changing the oil as well. Although it is an added up front expense, getting a flush will remove the corrosive oil and refrigerant AND any 'gunk' that's developed due to the corrosive action of these fluids up until now. Your compressor will pay you back this courtesy with a significantly longer lifespan.

Note to the hopeful: HyChill Minus 30 is superior, but it's not a magic potion. If your compressor is 90% dead it won't magically make work like new again. Just thought I'd make sure we're clear on that!

does this gas work in say home air conditioning units? or is that a whole different kettle of fish? considering how power hungry ac units are, it would be nice to make them as "friendly" as possible, especially with R134a being 10,000 times more potent than CO2 in terms of warming!

That's a very good point you raise, SS8_Gohan.

This is a big topic, but I'll try to keep my response brief(ish!).

The short answer is "it depends". Here's the salient points:

• If your AC system is more than a few years old, then it's probably using an f-gas called R-22. R-22 is from the same era as R-12, damages the ozone layer like R-12, but has different thermodynamic properties to R-12, making it more suited to home air conditioning applications. HyChill makes a product (called Minus 50) which, by design, works (very well) in systems designed for R-22. Minus 50 has all the same benefits as Minus 30. However, conversion of these systems can have more issues than converting motor vehicle AC. I'll save you from the details and instead just state that one-off conversions of home AC systems are not really practical because they usually need to be assessed on a case by case basis.
  
• If your AC system is one of the newer ones then it will be using other f-gases (such as R-407c or R-410a, which are still massively globally warming but are not ozone depleting like R-22), and HyChill doesn't currently have an alternative for these gases. HyChill isn't really interested in developing an alternative gas for these either, because it's actually easier for AC manufacturers to just take their older R-22 designs (which are cheaper and simpler anyway) and change them to HyChill hydrocarbon refrigerants.
  
• This topic you raise goes into areas that the general public have very little awareness of. Most people think 'CFC free' labels on their fridges or AC systems mean that their fridge or AC uses an environmentally harmless gas, but this is simply not true. Most of the fridges and AC systems sold in Australia use these 'poor cousin' f-gases and although they may not damage the ozone layer, they are massively globally warming. It's really quite clever deceptive marketing.
  
• Most people don't know it, but these 'newer' f-gases aren't recently developed at all. They (or their components - some are mixtures) have been around for ages, but they've never been widely used or promoted because they simply aren't as good (in performance and safety terms) as the likes of R-12 and R-22. The were only promoted when the f-gas industry was told by governments that R-12 and R-22 must be phased out due to ozone depletion, and so they went back to their chemical playbook and dragged out these poorer cousins (like R-134a, R-407c, R-410a) and singing their praises while spreading FUD about natural refrigerants along the way. Now (finally) there are already moves afoot to phase out or ban completely R-134a and others because they are massively global warming. If only the AC industry hadn't been so entrenched in the f-gas industry, the world could have avoided this whole generation of 'poor cousin' f-gases altogether and switched to natural refrigerants, which are a permanent solution that will never be phased out.
  

A better approach for tackling the problem of home air conditioning and fridges is to make sure your next purchase is an 'f-gas free' product. Read the data plate on the product. If it uses R-134a, R-410a, R-407c, R-22 or any other f-gas (any gas with 'fluorine' in it's chemical structure), avoid it. Ask for a product based on a natural refrigerant. If they stare blankly back at you, direct them to contact us at HyChill and we'll set them straight.

The majority of the world's domestic fridge sales are now hydrocarbon (HC) refrigerant based (HyChill refrigerants are HC's), although you wouldn't know it here in Australia - the f-gas industry has done a good job of keeping HC fridges off the showroom floors in Aus... but you can get them. Top brands like Miele and others make HC fridges. Big W and Aldi stock cheaper brands of HC fridges also, if I remember correctly.

DeLonghi makes a HC-based split system home AC unit, and I believe there are a few others. HyChill hopes to be making some big announcements about Aussie designed 'f-gas free' domestic and commercial AC systems very soon.

Awareness is still growing for these f-gas free alternatives. But in time the awareness of their environmental credentials and energy efficiency will overcome the momentum of the f-gas dinosaur.

I hope the readers of this topic find this information helpful.

Cheers

John Clark

Technical Advisor

HyChill

[hot300zx]

john,would you like to come onto the 300zx forum and explain if it is safe to do this,there seems to be a conception this is explosive and dangerous

http://www.aus300zx.com/forum/showthread.p...1192#post661192

[crofte]

Group re gas. Lets all put in and buy a bottle of HR 12 and i will charge all your cars for free.

[Kozeyekan]

OK, to clarify.

My R32 has been imported, and the aircon has not been regassed at all since compliance. I had my front pipe replaced, and this apparantly involved disconnecting the aircon pipe, which emptied the gas. Now, is there a place near doncaster that can flush me and fill me with hy-chilly goodness?