Gym And Supplement Discussion

[2lazy]

There is so much stupid retarded stuff its not even funny.

protein is for muscle development, too much will increase inflamation

carbohydrates is for energy, too much will decrease the release of ATP

unless your joiced up, the only form of maxing hypertrophy is by:-

1- full body work outs involving compound weights (squats, bp, dl,pu etc) all weight lifting should involve barbells

2- to increase recovery should not plateu, always leave 1 rep in the tank, also decrease the risk of injury, workouts should last 45m to 1hr

3- Diet is part of building muscle, eating the right amount of protein and/or carbos at the right time is the key, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4pEcB5jWRI...feature=related this is just an example, there is nothing wrom with the mediterranean diet, nothing wrong with raw eggs.

4- psychological aspect, determination, disciple and dedication, remember the three D's.

There is a lot more depth for these four points but you get the picture, olympian weight lifters dont do and dont heat 90% of the junk on this thread.

Edited June 1, 2010 by 2lazy

[2lazy]

You wanna know what the real problem is in here? A small number of the posters posting in here, frequent the fitness section on NS.com. Over there, the majority of the regular posters are powerlifters, and many of them train at PTC in Frankston under Markos. There's no problem there, and anyone who does read the NS.com fitness section would know that there are some strong guys training there and achieving, as far as what they're after, great results.

The problem is that these same guys, have little to no respect for anyone who doesn't train purely for strength. They mock pretty much everyone else who's mantra isn't squat/dead/MP and eat. The typical topless guy at summadayze etc, they laugh at.

Any weight lifter mocks bodybuilders because they build definition when they dont have any mass to build, does that make sense?

Mass then definition.

Why are you going to the gym if you are not training for strength??

[dezz]

Any weight lifter mocks bodybuilders because they build definition when they dont have any mass to build, does that make sense?

Mass then definition.

Why are you going to the gym if you are not training for strength??

I said 'purely' for strength. Some people enjoy looking good as well...

[2lazy]

I said 'purely' for strength. Some people enjoy looking good as well...

Looking good like what? You mean fit?

[gersfan]

Looking good like what? You mean fit?

Everyone has their own reasons for training, sure strength is an aspect but not its not the only reason for many people.

sense of achievment, confidence or just simply enjoy trying to better yourself and end joy the excersise. Perhaps just enjoy what you do and let others do the same without trying to seem superior.

Edited June 1, 2010 by gersfan

[Birds]

You are sounding a bit "heil Hitler" there 2lazy. That's the problem with lifters, they can't see any reason to be at the gym other than to get stronger. Body builders are just as guilty when they pay out on people for not exercising every muscle in their body or chasing definition.

You wanna know what the real problem is in here? A small number of the posters posting in here, frequent the fitness section on NS.com. Over there, the majority of the regular posters are powerlifters, and many of them train at PTC in Frankston under Markos. There's no problem there, and anyone who does read the NS.com fitness section would know that there are some strong guys training there and achieving, as far as what they're after, great results.

The problem is that these same guys, have little to no respect for anyone who doesn't train purely for strength. They mock pretty much everyone else who's mantra isn't squat/dead/MP and eat. The typical topless guy at summadayze etc, they laugh at.

Now, I've been to summadayze, KMG, Future etc, and we all know there's plenty of guys there with their shirts off, some even train specifically for these events, so that they can get their shirts off and pick up, or just look good (in their opinion) in general.

To be honest, from what I've seen on NS.com, the bodies aren't something I'd aspire to personally. They might be capable of squatting/benching/military pressing and dead lifting big numbers, but from an aesthetic point of view, they're not what I and many others are after.

Now, no one is saying that they're wrong to train the way they do, but that doesn't mean that how they train is RIGHT, and how anyone else trains is WRONG. I'd much rather look like the typical 'gear head from summadayze' than the typical powerlifter on NS. They'd all laugh at that, and they do, the only problem is some people take it to heart, whereas I couldn't give less of a f**k what someone else thought of my goals if I tried.

Agreed, this is what I was getting at when I talk about people thinking there's only one way about achieving results, when everyone has different goals. Some of those PTC newsletters...it's pretty disgraceful the lack of respect the writings show for anything but what they do.

[dezz]

Yep, and the section is actually starting to go downhill because of it (although as far as they're concerned it's perfect as it's squat/deadlift/bench/MP or f**k off) Opinion is no longer allowed if it differs from theirs. Pretty sad really.

[IOWNU]

Those exercises are the key to any workout regime, bodybuilding or power lifting, just customise according to need.

[2lazy]

Yep, and the section is actually starting to go downhill because of it (although as far as they're concerned it's perfect as it's squat/deadlift/bench/MP or f**k off) Opinion is no longer allowed if it differs from theirs. Pretty sad really.

I am speaking from experience, you either take it for free or you dont, you provided a vague explanation on what you want to do, and i still dont understand what you mean by fit, skinny? med? cut?

Whats funny is you actually get someone that knows what hes talking about and nobody wants to listen.

[2lazy]

You are sounding a bit "heil Hitler" there 2lazy. That's the problem with lifters, they can't see any reason to be at the gym other than to get stronger. Body builders are just as guilty when they pay out on people for not exercising every muscle in their body or chasing definition.

Agreed, this is what I was getting at when I talk about people thinking there's only one way about achieving results, when everyone has different goals. Some of those PTC newsletters...it's pretty disgraceful the lack of respect the writings show for anything but what they do.

Yeah Markos is not good with words sometimes but he means well, I dont agree with not wearing a belt, if your not wearing one I sugestt a spotter.

Its up to you, you want to achieve a goal in 2 years that can be done in 1 be my guest.

[Birds]

People are happy to listen to experienced experts but you have to be able to listen to them too instead of just telling them their way won't work, or won't work as fast as yours. There is more than one expert in this thread, and again, everyone's goals differ so widely that you cannot tell me what I want to achieve will be done in 2 years under my instruction where you could do it in 1 year. You have no idea what my goals are so you can't make that assumption that your S/D/B workout is going to get me my results faster. These basic compound exercises are not key to everything. Take for example, I could be a runner who goes to the gym and wants to exercise only legs and cardio...no heavy upper body so as to save on dead weight up top. Following the S/D/B "key to any regime" exercises is going to f*** me over - I will have to customise that program so much that not much of the S/D/B workout is still going to be key.

[IOWNU]

I think the advice to stick to big compounds is given assuming a young male wants to get bigger, leaner, stronger and so on. All you need to do is tweak your diet. I'd say 90% of guys who train want to get bigger and leaner. Those who say they are happy to stay lean and small, lie, they want to get bigger. Those who say they are happy bulky and big, lie, they want to get leaner. Those in the middle are rapt lol. Obviously if you want to be a marathon runner or a swimmer, muscle mass isn't a big factor, then your training would deviate from standard bodybuilding and powerlifting compound movement techniques.

[2lazy]

I think the advice to stick to big compounds is given assuming a young male wants to get bigger, leaner, stronger and so on. All you need to do is tweak your diet. I'd say 90% of guys who train want to get bigger and leaner. Those who say they are happy to stay lean and small, lie, they want to get bigger. Those who say they are happy bulky and big, lie, they want to get leaner. Those in the middle are rapt lol. Obviously if you want to be a marathon runner or a swimmer, muscle mass isn't a big factor, then your training would deviate from standard bodybuilding and powerlifting compound movement techniques.

Exactly, that was my assumption... but yeah a marathon runners workout is different from a sprinter.

[adznight]

Hey just to lighten the mood I thought I'd tell you about my experience with booze and weight loss/gain.

I had a check up in November last year when I was using some (legal) sups which can affect cholesterol. I have a history of heart disease so my new doctor wanted a full medical done.

Anyhow, one of the tests was a liver function test. A bit of back history, I'm not a regular drinker (a glass or wine or a beer a few times a week), I'm more of a binge drinker and it would be maybe 3 weekends a month or less but when I did drink, I'd put away a shit load with the boys.

Anyhow, personally I'd always find I carry extra weight after a BIG weekend on the booze. At maximum up to 3kg!! No doubt this was extracellular fluid which is typically cause by irritation/infection.

My liver function test came back with results out of the normal so my doctor wanted me to go booze free for 2 months for a follow up test which happened to fall over Christmas/NYE - no way that was going to happen.

I've been booze free for 12 weeks this weekend and have had my follow up test done and it's now perfect, as is my cholesterol @ 3.3. The BIG difference is weight loss though, I've shed a large amount of body fat, and not the easy stuff, I'm talking the really stubborn belly and love handles. I'm now starting to see a 6 pack etc!

I never would have realised how much of a difference booze makes to weight loss. Sure I understand the livers role in fat metabolism and the effects alcohol can have but I never realised just how much difference it makes. I can now eat much more junk and still stay trim, even loose weight! Wish I had of tried this earlier

Just thought I'd share because I see a lot of guys slogging it out gym then hitting the booze hard over the weekends eating up all that hard work!

[NZM.031]

i dont agree with wearing a belt, only because i like to apply things from the gym into real world applications.. so id prefer to build up lower back strength as you dont wear a belt when your not in the gym... therefore.. your pure strength routine maybe working your major muscles.. your supporting muscles may be lacking.. and your only as strong as your weakest muscle.

i agree that alot of people are vein.. they want to look different.. they want to be big like that guy.. or be ripped like that guy.. or have arms like that guy... they will never be happy.. and they may be a good thing.. they will strive to keep trying and that can only be a good thing... until the motivation is lost because.. i think its better to accept your body shape.. and do the best with what youve got.. dont get depressed, because you will have something that they dont.

its always been an age old battle between the body builders and the strong guys.. how do you judge whos better??? do you judge someone by the intensity of the workout.. or by the weight they lift?? or by the size they are?? do you mock the little guys?? even if they are lifting the same ratio of weight to body weight as you are?? be honest..

id like to ask a serious question..

im happy with the development of my hammys... im happy with the thickness and width of my hammys... but my quads are lacking.. especially in the width part.. and mainly the inner part... so ive been thinking of doing front squats, but the weight that i can squat.. my chest and arms cannot hold.. it sits on my collarbone and feels uncomfortable, but with the weight that i can hold, id have to do a gazillion reps to feel that illustrious burn we all strive to achieve..

thoughts?? any other leg moves you guys have found that use your quads more than the hammys.. pure freeweight workout, no machines.

[NZM.031]

Hey just to lighten the mood I thought I'd tell you about my experience with booze and weight loss/gain.

I had a check up in November last year when I was using some (legal) sups which can affect cholesterol. I have a history of heart disease so my new doctor wanted a full medical done.

Anyhow, one of the tests was a liver function test. A bit of back history, I'm not a regular drinker (a glass or wine or a beer a few times a week), I'm more of a binge drinker and it would be maybe 3 weekends a month or less but when I did drink, I'd put away a shit load with the boys.

Anyhow, personally I'd always find I carry extra weight after a BIG weekend on the booze. At maximum up to 3kg!! No doubt this was extracellular fluid which is typically cause by irritation/infection.

My liver function test came back with results out of the normal so my doctor wanted me to go booze free for 2 months for a follow up test which happened to fall over Christmas/NYE - no way that was going to happen.

I've been booze free for 12 weeks this weekend and have had my follow up test done and it's now perfect, as is my cholesterol @ 3.3. The BIG difference is weight loss though, I've shed a large amount of body fat, and not the easy stuff, I'm talking the really stubborn belly and love handles. I'm now starting to see a 6 pack etc!

I never would have realised how much of a difference booze makes to weight loss. Sure I understand the livers role in fat metabolism and the effects alcohol can have but I never realised just how much difference it makes. I can now eat much more junk and still stay trim, even loose weight! Wish I had of tried this earlier

Just thought I'd share because I see a lot of guys slogging it out gym then hitting the booze hard over the weekends eating up all that hard work!

without going into it too much... basically... when you consume alcohol.. your body goes into code red.. it wants it out... so it shuts down as much as possible to get to work on getting the alcohol out of your system... this includes shutting down your digestive system.. so everything youve eaten gets put on hold, and not digested properly.. it also means you are incredibly hydrated, but not with water, so you are actually dehydrated.. so your body attempts to store as much water as possible because it doesnt know when it will get water again, it stores it around the belly area..

[adznight]

Yeah spot on mate. I've done a hell of a lot of reading on the subject but was still amazed at the results!

[NZM.031]

im not a drinker.. and i personally dont understand why people drink so much.. and when you throw smoking into the mix.. it just baffles me..

and these people look at guys like us weird because we take supplements.. otherwise known to them as "steroids"

[adznight]

I don't think you realise it's not that bigger deal until you actually stop drinking for a while to be honest. What I found amazing is when I went out to Pubs etc for parties people would look at me really weird when I said I wasn't drinking, like there was something wrong with me and drinking was the normal, not vice versa. Made me realise just how much of a drinking culture we actually live in.

[NZM.031]

yeh i definatly get that alot.. theres something wrong with me because i dont drink... and theres something wrong me with me because i prefer to breath clean smoke free air...

wierd wierd crazy people eh!