Gym And Supplement Discussion

[-FIGJAM-]

thanks for the info, as said i cant get on them due to an existing heart condition, but there a few boys on the juice in my gym, all got good physiques on them but never really see them do much whilst at the gym.

[vspecIInur]

I've been on a few basic types that I think I've made mention from this thread ages ago. I know what it exactly feels like. A lot harder than how it actually sounds. You got to train extra hard, push much heavier, food is a big big factor. Most important is when coming off cycles; more important than the cycle itself actually. You want to do it properly? Your're going to have to spend that extra $$$ to really maximise the benefits. I've stopped for quite a while and stopped now because it's too much effort to maintain plus you get addicted then get depressed when your off the cycle.

One last thing, most these guys that are big, ripped or look amazing have either been doing for more than 10 years flat stick or are single and spend all their hard earned cash on it and show nothing else for it since. It's anecdotal evidence. I spend my money on my 34gtr, house and getting married soon

[-FIGJAM-]

thanks for the info Nathan.

I was just curious as to how much they actually do for you.

One of my mates did 1 cycle he put on 12kg through it (i think 7 stayed on). Whilst he did get bigger he didnt look impressive or anything, but he didnt do any of the post cycle stuff so had me curious.

Good to know that they still have to work hard to some degree to get decent results.

[TM7GTR]

thanks for the info Nathan.

I was just curious as to how much they actually do for you.

One of my mates did 1 cycle he put on 12kg through it (i think 7 stayed on). Whilst he did get bigger he didnt look impressive or anything, but he didnt do any of the post cycle stuff so had me curious.

Good to know that they still have to work hard to some degree to get decent results.

Sorry, but your mate is an epic asshat. No PCT??? Does he enjoy being a man?

Edited March 19, 2013 by TM7GTR

[-FIGJAM-]

well he is a bit dumb. also got off them because he was sick of people commenting about how big he got and asking if he was on gear....

thats the next thing i dont understand. If you are on juice why not just say you are instead of hiding it being ashamed off it?

not like you're sniffing your sisters dirty undies

[TTT]

because they feel like they cheated.

People who don't understand gear think that you take it and become huge because you took it and didn't do the hard work.

when in fact it's the exact opposite.

you work even harder.

but that is how it is seen

so in the general public eye, you take roids, you're just a cheat and didn't want to do the hard slog.

[SRS13]

I dont think I agree about having to 'work harder' ie a person on steroids has to work harder than a person not on sterioids. Is that what you guys are saying?

Never taken them but from what I understand they help you push more weights, recover quicker and therefore train more frequently. I think a person not on the gear has to work just as hard in that they push the weights they can, recover when they can and train as often as they can. It may be less than the person on the 'juice' but each is working to their physical capacity.

Most think of it as cheating as they are using a banned or illegal substance hence they hide it. Thats only amplified by its negative image in sports, olympics etc

[Birds]

I understand roids, but I still see it as cheating, simply because it will get you somewhere faster...regardless of how much "harder" you have to work for it. It still results in a greater output; knocks down a brick wall that exists in the natural state. If natural guys could train as hard and often as juicers, without the roids, and get better results faster, they would. They're not devoid of working to their limits themselves. If juice wasn't a huge advantage (i.e. cheating in sports/competition) then people wouldn't use them, but they do and it is. The simple fact it's an advantage means less work overall to stay ahead of the competition.

Also, for the hard work involved perspective/hypothetical...let's say our goal is to have a professional bodybuilder physique. Who is likely to get there with less work, the roid user or the natural guy? The latter would have to train for 5-10 years, assuming he even gets there. I think the harder work lies in the natural state. Not to mention dealing with injuries and body limitations that roids can push through.

However, I do agree that the public who have never picked up a barbell in their life, have a warped view of it all, resulting in most of the shame behind using juice. They seem to think you inject away and instant strength. But they tend to have a warped view of everything gym related - girls think they will gain 50 pounds of lean muscle if they do weights for a couple weeks; guys who are skinny or fat think that you started off fairly muscular before you joined a gym; my mother still blames me being lean on my genetics, despite several transitions between 80 and 90kg.

[TTT]

I didn't say geared people "have to" work harder.

I said that geared people "work harder"

Meaning that because you can recover much quicker and eat more and create more muscle, you work harder and harder.. lift more weight, do more sets/reps, train more frequently.

All of this means you are working harder than the non geared fella because you can.

Assume you take a pair of twins.

say 25 years old, 5'10", 85kg, 12% body fat.

Both have identical lifts, and look identical in terms of body shape and size.

If one of them was given good gear at good dosages and sorted out his PCT at the end, and the other did nothing different in regards to supps/gear, and both of them did the exact same workouts using the same weights/sets/reps/rest/frequency.... and ate the same foods etc... at the end of the trial, geared bro would probably be in better shape.

Had the geared bro been allowed to train more weight/sets/reps/frequency (which the gear would have allowed him to recover from), and eat more like he would have wanted to, he would be in even better shape.

Honestly, if someone said to me... Hey, this here gear will solve all your knee/back/shoulder/elbow problems, I'd sign up.

But even as a lifter that does comps in an untested federation, I wouldn't bother using gear to get better.

Just not wired that way in the brain area.

lol... one of my dogs gets shots every 6 months for her arthiritis in the elbows... called Zydax I think... The last visit I actually asked the Vet if it had been trialed on humans... apparently it has and it doesn't have the same effect... spewin...

TLDR? gear "allows" you to train harder and so you do... that's the main reason to take them...

Obviously there are many different steroids and some have different effects, but all in all, you can get bigger and stronger, faster than without.

[GHOSTrun]

In Bigger Stronger Faster documentary, they said a lifter on steroids could eat crap, go out partying/drinking every night etc, not get much sleep, and still surpass a dedicated natural lifter who ate well, slept well etc. That's how good the recovery effects of AAS are, according to BSF doco. That's a pretty freakin huge advantage...

[TTT]

Can you do the same thing on RES100? lol

[TM7GTR]

If you're natural, and it bugs you that people take gear because it's "cheating", you probably shouldn't be lifting, or you should jump on the good stuff yourself.

Most of the guys I know that take gear are humble, nice, and happy to give you pointers all the time.

Whereas the above mentioned natural lifters who seem to be constantly snarling at them really need to build a bridge. Work on your own physique however you want and stop worrying about who does what.

Stop treating it like it's a bodybuilding comp in your local gym lol.

[L33SH]

Do many women take gear?

[TTT]

some.

women lack testosterone and have more estrogen.

test is required for muscles.

I'm sure you've seen photos of women bodybuilders. they get the jaw ting happening and eventually look like men.

this requires many MANY years of many MANY steroids.

Women wanting to get bigger and stronger would benefit from it.

there are side effects to everything obviously.

[-FIGJAM-]

the only thing that annoys me about some of the guys at my gym on the juice is when they tell me I should be doing more isolation exercises because that worked trumps for them. Oh and seeing one of them not even doing half reps yet still has a good chest, arms, shoulders, wide back and 6 pack. Dont know his diet but yeah from the offset it annoys me.

don't get me wrong, i don't care if someone gets on steroids or not its everyone's own perocative and if i didnt have a real heart condition I would probably have done a cycle or two or ten by now.

my real question was how much of a difference it would make. I would love to go on a cycle or two without changing anything else in my lifestyle and see what the end result was.

Still have to finish watching the BFS docco but have been flat out with work, uni and house renos.

Cheers,

[TTT]

Getting real gear and then not changing your habbits to get the best of it is like installing an HKS turbo to your RB20det with stock everything.

it's just dumb.

if you get an HKS turbo, you get a good free flowing exhaust, intake, injectors, intercooler, afm, ecu/tune

you get gear, you eat right, train hard and sleep well.... and not f**k about with things like booze or late nights.

Sure old mate at the gym is doing half range reps and has a good shape, but if he did full range and focused on lifting more weight and didn't take the gear to look good at festivals, he'd have an even MORE impressive physique and not give out stupid advice.

[Birds]

If my goals were to get as big and strong as possible, I'd probably get on it. But all I wanted was a bit of muscle and I feel I have done that. These days I'm just increasing strength for the hell of it, without aim and without conpromising body shape/size.

If you can achieve your goals without it, you'll be better for it; there are of course negatives to using. And I daresay it is more rewarding to achieve said goals without; bit like playing a game with god mode on.

It's not the physical hard work that's hard about gym. Anyone can push weights at a gym. It's the perseverance and patience to keep at it until you get your results, which is why people join gyms for a month and then f**k off back to the couch. And that's where I say steroids are cheating, because they will do it much faster for you. You're less likely to hit that brick wall or get depressed over getting nowhere with your training. My goals didn't need them, so I'd rather prove to myself that I can get there on the longer, more mentally taxing route.

[Birds]

Tolga, even though it's untested, has anyone in said federation been suspected of using before or talked about it? Stares and whisper behind backs etc? Is it looked down on or no one gives a fk?

[TTT]

Mate I don't get involved in that side of it.

I'm a lifter and try to better myself and that is all I care about.

There are tested Feds and non tested.

Even though some people have been caught in the tested one in the past so I guess you can safely say that there are users in the non tested fed and I am totally ok with that.

You running E85 in your car yet?

I have to run 98 so that means you are taking advantage of something that gives great performance over me because you can.

[TTT]

Birds

PTC April Novice Comp

Sunday April 14