GT2530 - Not impressed

[Steve]

Thats pretty bloody good for a turbo that size! You still running around putting down 280rwkw?

If you are too worried about the internals, you could always throw a nice head gasket on there, 8.6:1CR, 1.5bar, sweet

[TokyoTaxi]

Pete / Fatz,

Nah, Sorry, GCG took the T3/T4 back in exchange for the turbo they gave me. You shoulda grabbed that R34 GT-T turbo off me when you had the chance

For everyone else, thanks, now at least I know not to get a GT2540 should I decide to change turbo's again. I'm going to go ahead with the dyno and see what the results are like.

Franks, I think your idea is a good one in superimposing the 2 dyno maps ( once I've got the car sorted again ) to see exactly what's going on.

I think it's that old scenario where you hear people rave about how good something is and then when you do it yourself you find the results are not as good as your overinflated expectations have become. I'll let the dyno tell the truth ! At least then I'll have a better idea of what I've actually got bolted to the side of my engine.

[fatz]

yea too true scotty

to true

the waiting game continues

pete

[JimX]

Originally posted by Steve

I have never, ever heard anyone say anything bad about HKS turbos, except the 2540.  I have never, ever heard anyone who has driven cars with garrett turbos, and a correctly sized HKS turbo say they prefer the garrett.

I won't say anything bad about HKS turbos, but I will say something about the price. FAT32 mentioned that to replace the bearing core will cost around $2k? You can buy a whole new Garrett turbo for around $1800. If you have the money to throw around then a HKS turbo is worthwhile, but if you're a poor bastard like me then I don't think you can go past Garrett. As I found out the other day, rebuilding a Garrett is only $350.

I don't know how much better a HKS turbo would be in the place of my T04, but I do know that I was very happy with my T04, and that was back when it had a faulty wastegate. It's good for around 250rwkw, which is probably even a bit more than I want to run in my stock engine with stock injectors.

[TokyoTaxi]

JimX,

Is the T04 laggy ?

What do you have to do to fit it up ?

[JimX]

I personally don't think the T04 is laggy, but it's all subjective I guess. The car came with it so I can't compare to the original ceramic turbo. It seems to start spooling early (2000-2500rpm) but doesn't hit full boost until around 4500-5000. That could partly be the old damaged wastegate's fault though, once the new fuel pump is in tonight I'll take it for a decent spin and let you know if full boost hits any earlier.

Looking at the turbo while it was out I saw a tiny bit ground off the engine side of the compressor housing, because it touches the engine when mounted. This still didn't give it enough clearance, so rather than grind more off (thank god) they put a spacer in the mounting point on the exhaust housing. It now clears the engine by about 5mm.

That spacer seems to be the only modification made, but as I didn't have the factory turbo to begin with I don't know if the coolant and oil lines are in different locations. Nissky told me where the underside coolant and oil lines were on the factory turbo and they seemed to be in the same spots on mine, but I don't know if they are the factory lines or not.

[TokyoTaxi]

JimX,

Cool. I'm sure your lines would be different from the standard pipes with banjo fittings but the spacer thing is interesting.

How is Nissky going ? He got that new R34 GT-T turbo off me and the last I heard he was having a ball with it.

[Steve]

JimX,

The point of my post was to compare performance of Garrett BB turbos to HKS BB turbos

HKS turbos are not cheap, but with the fall in the aussie dollar, even direct importing and paying full duty and gst (if you are unlucky) they are not much more than a garrett turbo. Check out the greenline website.

As for replacing the cartridge, once again direct from japan about 1.4K (price actually paid by a mate who rebuilt his HKS GT2530)BUT you have a new turbo.

If you compare a garrett ball bearing turbo to a HKS turbo, then things start to look very similar - alot more affordable than people seem to think.

As I posted it boils down to choices, I chose to pay a bit extra and get the extra and I dont mind waiting a bit longer for it. Even second hand you can get a 2530 for under 2K in excellent conditon (rebuilt) - cheaper than a new garrett BB turbo. Choices. Not that I am saying there is anything wrong with going a different path.

[TokyoTaxi]

Well,

I think I'm going to have to keep my eyes open for one of these "Genuine" HKS GT2530's or even better GT2535.

I agree with paying a bit more to get a bit more but I HATE WAITING !!!

[EVOIV]

I agree, it's all to personal preference. But nowadays a new Garrett is around the same price as a good second hand HKS turbo. And from what I've heard, the HKS turbos rarely break down unless the engine detonates and scrapnel causes the turbine wheel to be damaged - just like my turbo. In most cases, it's the engine that's gonna blow before the turbo does.

[JimX]

You can't compare new prices to second hand ones though. Sure it's only $2k for a second hand rebuilt HKS turbo, but it's only $1k for a second hand rebuilt Garrett turbo.

Don't get me wrong, I would love a HKS turbo if I had the money. But even $1k was stretching the budget for me when I thought my turbo was dead. Lucky it was just the wastegate and only $140. Like I said, I'm a poor bastard.

[Steve]

JimX, have you actually seen a rebuild BB Garrett turbo for 1K? I was looking for the right turbo for months, saw none at that price.

I ended up getting one new from Japan as it saved me over 3K on the price from australia.

If you have a look here: http://www.greenline.jp/catalogue/bblist.p...rand=HKS#engine

they have bolt on (T3) HKS 2530 for $2226 AUD (79Yen:1AUD), add 12.5% duty ($279) = $2504, plus 10% GST ($251) = $2756 then you would of course have to pay postage. this is worse case scenario of you get hit by customs - I didnt.

Compare GCG who sell a 380hp garrett GT25 BB turbo for $2750, that is with a gt25 flange not a T3.

Or if you want to high flow, they will charge you around 2.2 - 2.4K exchange - so add another 300-450 for what you could sell a stock turbo for.

I know that when things go and you need to replace in a hurry and are limited by funds you are sort of stuck - I had the same problem with a clutch, ended up costing me more 6 months down the track though when I needed to upgrade to what I would have originally bought given the time/funds to source it.

And by the way I have seen HKS 2530 for 1.2K in excellent conditon second hand shame you couldnt have held off for a bit, because they can be had in good condition very cheap if you search around and do some digging. A bit of luck helps too.

[rev210]

I think the old Garrett Vs HKS is a silly argument.They are both garrett, one is the company that makes the parts the other is a company that tries to select the best combination for your engine

The HKS turbos are built with garret bits and as we know there are plenty of parts to be matched to build the right turbo combination.

The HKS units have had some development work done on each vehicle so it takes the stress out of selecting the right trims and things to get a nice responsive turbine.

Having said that, there are many top level motorsport teams using garrett GT development cores of thier own design that are specially matched to their vehicles. HKS do not feature in the worlds most competitive regions becasue turbine development can be done 'in house'.

On the one hand you have HKS which will offer an out of the box solution that will work but, still may not be the perfect combination of garrett parts for your particular application. On the other hand you have the choice of garret turbos and parts which to get setup better than the HKS will require expertise perhaps time and considerable cost or pure luck.

[EVOIV]

Yes, I'm pretty sure that Garrett do make the HKS turbos...but from what I've heard, you can not buy HKS turbo parts from Garrett. Example: HKS specific compressor trims are only for HKS and if you asked a Garrett dealer to sell you an HKS specific trim, they can't/won't. So, the only way to get an HKS compressor trim is to buy an HKS turbo. Nothing "HKS" can be gained from Garrett. Garrett make their own trims to match their own turbos.

I think the bottom line is: Garrett make HKS turbos. HKS do their own research and development and ask Garrett to make the specific trims...etc which HKS then sell as their own turbos. Garrett have their own turbo line up and specs. You can't ask Garrett to make you an HKS turbo, because they are probably legally not able to.

[Cubes]

FAT32... Apparently a genuine GT2530 on a RB20 hits full boost from 3700rpm - 4000rpm.

[DoughBoy]

Ok, got my car dyno'd today. Having some boost issues with it - apparently it hits 1.4 bar then dwindles down to .7 bar at 7,000rpm.

Going to have to get someone to drive my car tomorrow at EC, or to play with the EVC... Volunteers anyone?

[Ahh32]

my 2 cents, make sure your BOV isn't loose and leaking under full boost, could also have been surging prob.

[RB GUN]

Fat32 i got a T3/T4 and it doesnt work for me properly coz the guys installed it for my shut down his shop !?!? but the turbo he gave me was good but i think by looking at my exhaust pipe it is not as straigh coz wat he did was buggy as, he cut my old one welded the new "CUSTOM" dump pipe and the neck of it is a bit narow:( and so my boos will go up to 11 then drop down to 9 PSI. i dunno wat the hell is wrong?? Rigoli said i need new computer chip coz my car runs lean. with 9 Psi i had 180 RWHP and with 12 or 14 Psi i had 205 RWHP and that was @ 5900 RPM, he didnt rev more coz of the LEAN.

[Merli]

Originally posted by -Joel-

FAT32... Apparently a genuine GT2530 on a RB20 hits full boost from 3700rpm - 4000rpm.

Uh huh............ Right.............

And what would "full boost" be? 1.0 bar? 1.2 bar? 1.6 bar?

Not aimed at you in the slightest but to everyone in general, "full boost" is the dumbest term EVER. Everyone runs different boost with the same turbos, so that term is completely and utterly redundant and useless.

[JimX]

Originally posted by Merli

Uh huh............ Right.............

And what would "full boost" be? 1.0 bar? 1.2 bar? 1.6 bar?

Not aimed at you in the slightest but to everyone in general, "full boost" is the dumbest term EVER. Everyone runs different boost with the same turbos, so that term is completely and utterly redundant and useless.

I'm glad you said that. I'd never really thought about it much before, but I used to think that if you set the boost to higher than factory, it would get there faster. But after pulling my turbo off and having a look inside, it seems that the waste gate stays completely shut until the set boost is reached, and then it opens.

That would mean it gets to a certain pressure level at the exact same time no matter what you set it to. It would just not go higher than the boost controller allows.

This would explain why I don't hit "full boost" until 4500-5000rpm. I've got the turbo set to 1 bar, so I don't think it's as bad as I first though. If it were set to factory pressures, it would probably get to "full boost" at around 3500.