Discussion On Slander, Forums And Censorship

[Abo Bob]

If anyone mentions or even hints at a workshop name there will be warnings and/or bannings handed out.

As for the whole concept of slander and the like. Go for it.

[Abo Bob]

i understand how the admin's dont want company's slandered, however what about the poor customer's who time after time get ripped off by these pesent's... arent we a comunity based on tryin to improve thing's?

[Swiper the Fox]

Why do you (admins/mods) allow threads such as HKS vs Garrett (example only) where people can voice their opinions and experiences.

But when it involves peoples experiences shopping for a product that involves people they get all weak.

we are allowed to say in our opinion that a product is crap, but not a product supplier. Whats the difference??

i.e. The ***** Motorsport thread

seems a little bit of a double standard. Id be more interested/worried in a large multi-national company sueing me than a con man that rips people off!!

Also if only the truth is stated and you have reliable witness accounts of what happened then whats the problem?

Edited April 14, 2008 by DiRTgarage

[smasha]

Also if only the truth is stated and you have reliable witness accounts of what happened then whats the problem?

IMO it's Very difficult to tick this box on an internet forum.

[JeeTeeEss25Tee]

Not taking sides or anything but I can tell you guys that I've had my car worked on at Hills about 3-4 years ago and although the workmanship wasn't outstanding or anything (in fact was slow) I found the works needed was done and that's all I cared about.

Now I've also been to the workshops that are "highly recommended" by members here and although majority of experiences were ok I've had disappointing/negative experiences as well. Why I didn't go and named those workshops? Firstly other than being agaisnt the forum's rules I know I will not get any supports from the same people who have been praising those workshops and in the end telling those stories won't do me any good and probably won't deter other members from visiting those workshops.

The point of this? Although it's good idea to learn from other people's experiences there are things that you just have to learn yourself as everyone has different opinions. If my engine blew (god forbids) by one of those highly recommended workshops I've got noone else to blame but by myself as I took advises from the people on here.

My 2 c

[Sl!m]

not a definite answer to the question but still a good read

article on the whirlpool lawsuit not too long ago..

http://apcmag.com/whirlpools_off_the_hook_...re_you_next.htm

Do you really want SAU to be the next forum on the chopping block?? It's best to just leave negative comments towards individuals or companies away from the public's eye and off our communities forum.

Now I agree that it would be nice to do a quick search and get responses from happy and unhappy customers for whatever product/service/company; though as it has already been mentioned there is no way to know if these comments are justified or true. Even positive feedback for a company should be taken with a grain of salt, how do you know that these comments aren't be left by people who work for the company or are involved some how ie. on the payroll.

Prank owns this forum he has stated the rules to protect himself and the community so I think they should be respected.

[lingeringsoul]

At the end of the day, this forum is privately owned and we go about discussing things in accordance to what the owner allows. I think the moderators are there just to enforce these rules, they don't make up the rules. If it is double standard then so be it.

[Merli]

Also if only the truth is stated and you have reliable witness accounts of what happened then whats the problem?

Paul,

It's hard (read: absolutely impossible) for anyone other than the poster to know whether a comment is truthful or not.

e.g. If I were to completely rip into a workshop and relate stories about being ripped off and dodgy work performed, none of the admins or moderators would have any idea if I were making it up, or telling the truth.

Then there is the matter of "point of view". To Workshop A, 4-6 weeks lead time for services is normal. For Customer A, that is excessive. Customer A gets on SAU and tells everyone that Workshop A is "slow"..... Well, "slow" is a subjective term. How do you deal with that?

But the kicker is, it doesn't MATTER whether the truth and truth alone is spoken on these boards. Prank is still open to lawsuits filed for libel, and he has to goto court to defend what was posted on this forum, and call up those "reliable witnesses" to provide testimony... I don't want him to have to go through the trouble of a lawsuit to prove YOU right........ Do you?

At the end of the day, different people have good and bad opinions and experiences with different workshops. Is it too much to ask people to PM negative experiences to people who ask?

Cheers,

Andrew.

[MattD]

I would like to tell you a story...

I live in Massachusetts with my wife, Camilllllllllllle.

:bunny:

[D_I_F]

In a comment related to this topic.

It is clear why you can't publicly slander workshops and companies on this forum.

If you have had a bad experence and some one is asking the opinions of that certain company. Pm them. It's seriously not that hard.

I would like to tell you a story...

I live in Massachusetts with my wife, Camilllllllllllle.

:bunny:

And by that do you mean your wife Abo bob?

[Swiper the Fox]

ive been censored and it was nice...thanks

[mesmerized]

In a comment related to this topic.

It is clear why you can't publicly slander workshops and companies on this forum.

If you have had a bad experence and some one is asking the opinions of that certain company. Pm them. It's seriously not that hard.

so, by that do you mean also that say, if someone were to create a thread re: a bad exp with a workshop, without actually mentioning the workshops name in the thread (offering to PM people wanting to know), is that still against the rules?

eg. 'i had a negative exp with workshop A, this, this and this happened, PM me if you want the workshops name'

[-FIGJAM-]

Whatever happened to freedom of speech? i can go on TV and say that the PM is a dickhead and nothing will happen to me, however i say something about a company on a forum when im asked for my opinion and i get wanned or banned? Is there actually a law saying you cant tell your experience to a person or over the internet?

I understand where the owner/opperator of the forum is comming from, im guessing its less of a hassel, but seriously if someone gets ripped of by a well known dodgy car dealer on say Paramatta road, and there are other such incidents involving the same place, i think its safe to say tat one is not lieing.

I guess the point im making is that Australia is a free country and i seriously dont think that if they were going to sue it would go far.... Ninemsn asks for people's opinions all the time on things, even there opinions on people's careers...

[DRD-00F]

We don't actually have freedom of speech in this country... it is covered by the UN only in this country...

The Australian Constitution does not have any express provision relating to freedom of speech. In theory, therefore, the Commonwealth Parliament may restrict or censor speech through censorship legislation or other laws, as long as they are otherwise within constitutional power.

Source

[Basti]

so, by that do you mean also that say, if someone were to create a thread re: a bad exp with a workshop, without actually mentioning the workshops name in the thread (offering to PM people wanting to know), is that still against the rules?

eg. 'i had a negative exp with workshop A, this, this and this happened, PM me if you want the workshops name'

that would be fine. happens on here a fair bit. and no one has any problem with it

[jenkies]

I would like to tell you a story...

I live in Massachusetts with my wife, Camilllllllllllle.

:) :bunny:

in addition,

NOW! we have five children, 1-2-3-4-5, five children

the youngest one innes, he looks just like me and he walks up and he goes "pop i need some money for a TICKET!

NOW! i do not handle the ticket money, Camilllllllle handles the TICKET money.

that asside can we say good things about a company or just not mention any company /workshop FULL STOP????

[Basti]

good reviews are fine, cos no one is gonna sue Prank for saying good stuff bout their buisness. bad stuff however needs to be kept out of the public eye. if they wanna know, they need to sign up and ask for a pm.

edit: @ cosby

[DECIM8]

In my mind, The right to say what we believe should be allowed on the forum. If you take a look at Music, Novels and so on every Author or music maker has the right to say what they wish without any problem.

I dont see how a forum is any different to this.

Oh an that said, I understand the forum rules etc I just feel Prank should not have to put up with people who whine about crap.

Perhaps we should start Ratethemechanic.com.au like rate the tradie.

Edited April 14, 2008 by DECIM8

[Merli]

Whatever happened to freedom of speech? i can go on TV and say that the PM is a dickhead and nothing will happen to me

No you can't. If you want "freedom of speech", move to America. We don't have this notion in Australian Constitutional Law.

Is there actually a law saying you cant tell your experience to a person or over the internet?

Is there a law saying that you can't "tell you experience to a person or over the internet"? No.

Is there a law against expressing or publishing false and malicious comments against any person? YES.

It's called defamation. This can either constitute a published defamation (television broadcast, radio, newspaper, internet forum) which is known as "libel" or oral defamation (stories spoken out loud at parties, meetings, gatherings) which is also known as "slander"...

And then there is the law against "spreading of defamation", that comes into play if you distribute/sell a book containing defamatory material, or operate an internet forum that allows defamatory statements to be made. <cue Prank>

As I have said before, the problem isn't the statement itself. For all we know, what everyone says is true. The problem is, EVEN IF WHAT WAS POSTED IS TRUE, a lawsuit can still be served at Prank asking him to either defend the lawsuit in court and prove that the statements weren't defamatory (who the hell wants to go through that? Seriously?) or settle the matter out of court.

We're not asking a lot. Post all you like, simply do NOT mention business names, or elaborate through PM.

[Merli]

In my mind, The right to say what we believe should be allowed on the forum.

In my mind, you have no rights whatsoever on this, or any other forum (unless you develop and host your own forum )

If you take a look at Music, Novels and so on every Author or music maker has the right to say what they wish without any problem.

How naive of you. You have NO IDEA how many lawsuits Eminem has had to settle from the COUNTLESS lawsuits leveled against him.

Seriously. No clue.