Mark And Duncans R32 Build

[haw001]

The hicas modification is easy and could easily be done in car on a hoist, or off the ground if you were not afraid to have weld spit up on you.

[Risking]

I think it will be dampners themselves that will be holding the suspension back.

I know they have not been tested properly as yet. It will be interesting to see how they go.

Duncan/Mark did you angle the cradle at all or set it level??

Im about to do the mounting position for my Chromolly cradle but not convinced about the angle I have been advised to mount it on.

[fatz]

looks like i might chekc the beast out as i have to drop around

memoriesssssssssssssssssssss

hear your joint has a fence now mark?

im excited

[Duncan]

do you mean to manage the angle of the diff or the lower control arms.

the cradle itself is in straight/neutral - the top of the subframe bolts direct to the floor. we'll give it a run like this before we stuff around with it's angle.

the front lower control arm mount is not in the normal position for R32. Nissan changed the geometery between R32/Z32/S14 to the later cradles by moving the front mount of the lower control arm down about 5cm. We've got the same change on this cradle.

BTW I agree with Mark....you would get 80% of the benefit of this rear end with the UAS allow bushes and a set of rose jointed arms. The cradle mods if you want the last 20% cost as much as the rest put together, I'm sure UAS can do them if you want to go all out.

I won't be going through this much trouble next time, mounting direct to the floor alone raises the cradle by almost 5cm.

[Duncan]

haha pete its actually got a fence and a gate now, you better call before you head over it gets the raceworx award for most creative use of pool fencing.

[fatz]

will be good tosee the beast in the flesh looks like you lads have put some seriouse work in

[Neil]

will be good tosee the beast in the flesh looks like you lads have put some seriouse work in

Nope that won't be happening big boy,,,Bubba and the security gates will argue big time,,,oh shit I forgot to mention the dog.

Too easy I'll pick it up and delivery to you somewhere in between.

Neil.

[fatz]

but im just up the small hill past penrith!

[Neil]

but im just up the small hill past penrith!

Half way is the best your getting honey,,,.Talk to ya monday. We better stop whoring in here or admin duncan will dish out warnings.

[Risking]

Yeah the actual angle of the Cradle Duncan. It does tilt slightly forward from the factory, not sure if its meant to or if the bushes are flogged out in my original one though.

I was hoping to make it shimmable but Im not using the original Studs to mount it from. The Plan now is to set and forget which im not 100% certain about.

Have you done any bump steer measurments (even rough ones with it like this??)

Im now considering doing away with the whole upper/lower/trailing arm and going to a simple upper/lower arm set-up like those used in RC cars.

I think it would be easier to fabricate with the cradle I have built, should help bump steer if done properly, and its the same as what im using in the Front.

[Duncan]

yeah well believe it or not I'm no race car chassis designer but my understanding is that uneven length double wishbones are the optimal setup for front or rear....the only real difference normally is the driveshafts in the rear but I guess you've already alllowed for them at the front. If you look at any proper race cars like Neils they just have the same or similar setup at both ends.

I guess one thing to think about though is the difference in arm length top and bottom. if you aren't using standard lengths the dynamic camber gain must be different - and assuming your new top arms are longer you will get less gain (=more static camber required = braking and stability impacts)

Re the bump steer - the current setting is about where the hicas rod sits, so it will not be right (the control arms have moved up but the steering arm hasn't). Since it is easy enough to move the inner end (and we use standard outer end), we can just measure it up once everything else is finshed.

BTW looking forward to those windows if you haven't got the materials yet can you grab 3mm for ours. I'm hoping that will be enough once the window frames are in.

[Risking]

Thanks dude,,,got it today. I'm happy now.

Neil.

Excellent.

yeah well believe it or not I'm no race car chassis designer but my understanding is that uneven length double wishbones are the optimal setup for front or rear....the only real difference normally is the driveshafts in the rear but I guess you've already alllowed for them at the front. If you look at any proper race cars like Neils they just have the same or similar setup at both ends.

I guess one thing to think about though is the difference in arm length top and bottom. if you aren't using standard lengths the dynamic camber gain must be different - and assuming your new top arms are longer you will get less gain (=more static camber required = braking and stability impacts)

Re the bump steer - the current setting is about where the hicas rod sits, so it will not be right (the control arms have moved up but the steering arm hasn't). Since it is easy enough to move the inner end (and we use standard outer end), we can just measure it up once everything else is finshed.

BTW looking forward to those windows if you haven't got the materials yet can you grab 3mm for ours. I'm hoping that will be enough once the window frames are in.

Thats what I have aimed for to get the same or as close to the same as possible front and rear.

I will be doing those windows this weekend time permiting.

Jay had his first steer of the GTR on saturday. First time out he managed an 8 flat around wakefield.

Cars got some serious 4wd issues (broken shafts and stripped splines) so its currently 2wd and the mastercylinders are causing really poor bias to the front.

Hopefully be sorted for oran park this saturday.

[Neil]

Not a lot of actual work was done today. Duncan sorted out the water/oil/fuel fittings.

Mark and I did front suspension stuff on his Roady out in the burning sun,,,.

I have a nice cut on my right shin if anybody wants to see it.

[fatz]

Not a lot of actual work was done today. Duncan sorted out the water/oil/fuel fittings.

Mark and I did front suspension stuff on his Roady out in the burning sun,,,.

I have a nice cut on my right shin if anybody wants to see it.

get you axe cut out!

[Risking]

Duncan have you installed the coilovers as yet??

Curious to know what spring rates you have gone with to start out?

Or just the ones that came with them

[Duncan]

Hey Brad just the springs that came with it, they are way too soft but will be good enough to get us rolling while we get it all tested and working OK. I need to give you a call tomorrow, if you got that perspex I better grab it from you (cut or not) we need to put the windows in over the next 2 weekends Love the look of your new cage btw.

Neil....c'mon, lets see what's left of your finger

Progress has slowed (yes from barely moving to barely barely moving). Inlet side of the motor is pretty much done and we are going to pick up all of the missing externals next week hopefully. still need to sort out the wiring.

Mark is rigging up 32 standard front brakes onto the rears (oops need a hydraulic handbrake now I guess), and making custom front upper arms (we are looking for much narrower arms where they bolt to chassis to postpone the major chassis mods like Brad has done. Also some frankenstein changes being looked at for the front lower arms (rose joint conversion...stay tuned for more).

Been a fair bit of work on the gas guzzling roady R32 (ready to start), and Mark is going pretty well on the cage for the new race car. We are looking pretty tight for the moving out deadline though. I was just thinking back we have done 4 engine builds, a sports sedan and a gas conversion on the driveway in the last 6 months.

[haw001]

And mostly only on Sundays, with a few extra days thrown in here and there.

Cage should be finished tomorrow. More or less the same as the RWB car, with a few less bars due to the regs it's running in. It's got the extra protection of a bar added to the rear strut towers. An extra safety only modification that is permitted under the rules

Brake modifications are underway. I'll post instructions on success. Definitively not a bolt on option, but I would say worthwhile for anyone doing a front brake upgrade and having brakes and rotors left over with nothing to do with them. You do need a press and someone with a bit of machining skills, but if everything goes to plan from here, and we all know that it always does, then it's not too bad.

Worst thing about it is that the DBA 4000 rotors that only just this weekend made their way on to my road car will have to come back off and the old ones back on again. Somehow I don't think the factory rotors would hold up all that well on the RWB car, have a look at Duncan's avatar if theirs any doubt.

[Neil]

Up-Date,,,Duncan is getting very very good,,,he spent the morning machining the inlet manifold to match the head,,,very nice job that got Mark's and My seal of approval. We were both very impressed.

Mark and I played on his lpg roady (don't do it Mark) and again I suffered another mad cut. No pic avail this time,,,it would make you sick. Thanks Mrs Hawkins for looking after me,,,.

Bugger,,,you 2 beat me to posting.

[Risking]

Hey Brad just the springs that came with it, they are way too soft but will be good enough to get us rolling while we get it all tested and working OK. I need to give you a call tomorrow, if you got that perspex I better grab it from you (cut or not) we need to put the windows in over the next 2 weekends Love the look of your new cage btw.

Neil....c'mon, lets see what's left of your finger

Progress has slowed (yes from barely moving to barely barely moving). Inlet side of the motor is pretty much done and we are going to pick up all of the missing externals next week hopefully. still need to sort out the wiring.

Mark is rigging up 32 standard front brakes onto the rears (oops need a hydraulic handbrake now I guess), and making custom front upper arms (we are looking for much narrower arms where they bolt to chassis to postpone the major chassis mods like Brad has done. Also some frankenstein changes being looked at for the front lower arms (rose joint conversion...stay tuned for more).

Been a fair bit of work on the gas guzzling roady R32 (ready to start), and Mark is going pretty well on the cage for the new race car. We are looking pretty tight for the moving out deadline though. I was just thinking back we have done 4 engine builds, a sports sedan and a gas conversion on the driveway in the last 6 months.

No problem mate. I have one set all cut up here and I think enough material to do another set.

Thanks, Alot of work has gone into it. I couldnt think of anything more it needed and the base is very very strong now.

Its almost completed now, need to throw a box in and tidy up the Dry sump gear before finally firing it up.

Then ill be re-doing the front to suit a single nut stub axle set-up that ive come across.

Hoping to catch up with Boz at oran park in January to get it all up and sorted.

Rose joint conversion is a good idea for the lower arms. It can be the easiest way to make decent roll center adjustments.

I was considering it but the ammount of work required was about the same as a wishbone lower arm.

You could do a lower wishbone and do away with the castor rod and keep the upright/ upper arm the way it is for now.

The mounts for the lower arm is fairly simple to do, its only hard part is getting the front to rear offset right.

[haw001]

Not quite finished with the brake conversion as the R32 rotor is too small and I can't seem to find a 33 rotor at the moment, but here's a mini howto on the conversion

1. Start by taking the hub off, you won't be able to do this on the car.

2. Remove all the handbrake stuff, it won't fit anymore and you'll need a hydraulic setup.

3. Turn it over and remove the big nut which frees the spring pin holder (talk about over engineered!)

4. Loosen the 4 hub bolts but don't remove them completely. Hit them gently with a hammer and the hub assembly will split into 3 parts.

5. Discard the dust plate, or use it as a hood ornament, you won't need it and it just gets in the way.

6. The next step involves the hub, but it may not be necessary. In order to fit a 32 front rotor I had to mill off a little from the lugs at each stud. I did this on the belt linisher, but any grinder will do. Depending on your rotor, you may not need to do this. I also removed the big chunk of metal that is used to hold the hand-brake pivot we removed, but this is also not necessary as it doesn't get in the way.

7. Because of a quirk in the design, the factory position for the rear brakes is higher than necessary for the front brakes to fit. It also happens to be just about centered over a 32 rotor and presumably a 33 rotor. This mean that you don't need a dog bone and actually need to move the mounting points closer to the hub.

To do this, I mounted the plate in the milling machine and milled the mounting posts at the same height as original, just closer in to the hub.

8. The last step is to drill out new mounting points and re-assemble everything. Hopefully, all you will need is a few washers as spacers to make sure it all lines up.

I'll post more photos when it's all finished (once I find the R33 rotors)