Bad insurance story, be warned!

[nissaner]

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[Southo]

YO880,

Liability insurance generally deals with issues relating to loss or damage, to property or persons whilst in the Insured's care, or as a result of work performed....

like the examples above - if the Workshop Owner is negligent in his care for your car and it gets damaged, or if they build a new intercooler and forget to clean it out and aluminium filings and dirt get sucked into your engine etc.

If they fabricate a lot of their own parts, they may need product liability in case one of those products fails and causes damage etc. - Ie, if a company sells you a faulty set of lowered coil springs and one falls out while cornering and you crash as a direct result, the spring manufacturer's product liability should pay for the damages.

They can also get cover that covers them for comments / advise that they make - eg, if they tell you that your standard GTS25t will take 55psi of boost without any damage and you follow their instructions and do happen to be stupid enough to try.... well if you can prove that it was their negligence in telling you that - and not your stupidity , then you may have a case against them.

General Commercial insurance on say a mechanics workshop could cover a number of areas such as...

Fire

Flood

Storm

Theft

Fusion of Electrical motors

Electrical breakdown of Diagnostic equipment

Business Interuption / Loss of income as a result of one or more of the above events

Workers Compensation

Cash in transit (ie, on way to/from bank)

Cash on premises (ie, days or weeks takings)

Stock and trade

Transit cover - (their employees to drive your car for testing purposes) - this usually has a geographical limit - Ie, 50km radius of the workshop.

[YO880]

so in other words, if the smash repairer was fully insured, then he would be able to claim for the damage to my car?

[YO880]

or if you leave the car anywhere be it with someone or not, if it is broken into then it is your (and your insurance companies) problem?

if this is the case, i am sure a lot of people arn't aware of this!

[Southo]

Basically yes.

Negligence has to be proven before liability can be attributed.

Here is another example...

Say I have Third Party Property Damage Only (TPPD) on my Car

If my car is stolen, and the theif is not used to the sudden rush of power that 80kW at the rear wheels can offer :D and he loses control and hits your car and then does the runner. Even if you can prove it was my car that hit yours - (even if my car is abandoned at the scene and the theif escapes on foot). My Insurance will not cover the damage to your car. And you have no legal right to try and claim from me because I am not responsible or negligent in the accident.

Basically, with TPPD - your car is only covered for accidents and incidents whilst you, the owner, or someone one with your permission, is in control of the car. As the car was stolen, the policy does not cover the damge as a result.

So, if the vehicle that is damaged by my stolen car is not insured, then you had better try and catch the theif - otherwise you have little chance of recovery thru the stolen vehicle's owner or insurer.

It sounds slack, but as I said -

Negligence has to be proven before liability can be attributed.

[Blitz]

Southo: very true.

I had a 200sx before my skyline and on my 3rd day of ownership 4 guys in a stolen commodore wagon ran a stop sign at whale beach and hit me doing $11K damage. The car owners insurance wouldnt pay cos the "Owner" wasnt driving.... and unless the theives were caught and charged there is nobody to hold accountable - we chased the theives but lost them .

My insurance company told me that had the theives been caught and convicted, they would have paid my claim and persued the thieves for reimbursment via the legal system....

understandable.... but it still sucks when you have to fork out for something that was always out of your control.

:hellpisse

[YO880]

yeah it does,

I am still getting differing stories from my insurance company though that think that they would win the battle... i just have to weight up if it is worth loosing the excess and no claim bonus over or wether it will just be cheaper to get it fixed myself.

I just want others to be warned as i know even a lot of shops think that they are protected against things like this when it seems now they are not..

[Southo]

YO880,

If your insurance company is prepared to fight it for you - don't stop them.. who knows, if they are successful, you hopefully should get your NCB and Excess back if they penalised you

[Guest turbogtst]

You dont need an insurance company, just sue the repairer he is liable and its his problem where he gets the money from, talk to a solicitor or your local chamber magistrate and take action yourself! Your car is his responsability as it was in his care.

[Guest LINEMUP]

Damnnn, my car's due in at the panel shop this Monday morning and it's staying there for a week..

You guys are starting to freak me out. :confused:

[ricknismo]

I rang JUST CARS out of pure curiousity as you all recommend them.I got a suprise alright.29,rating 1,comprehensive--$1480 with an insured value of $18500.Excess works to around $1200.

Now fair enough they let you modify it but your premium goes up and your value doesn't. I am currnetly insured with suncorp for $430 a year and valued at $27500. I'll stay where I am.

[Majanal]

Wow... what a corker.

What southo says is true, for someone to pay then there needs to be someone who is negligent. Now the people ( I'll keep it clean even though thereis another word in my head that starts with p) that cause the damage cannot be located to foot the bill.

So, if I understand it correctly, and correct me if I'm wrong, the blame falls on the next MOST negligent party, which, seeing as you had left your car in the care of the pannel shop would be them. If the car was parked in your garage at home then it would be you.

Speak with your insurance company... tell them everything. They ARE there to fight for you, you don't only pay a preimium just incase you muck up... but also to have some punch against others that might stuff up.

Good luck man... I feel for you.

[Guest Stocker]

This is an easy one. Get a solicitor, and take the person you handed the keys to to a civil court. They assumed responsibility for your car as soon as they took custody of it. The panel shop failed to provide reasonable security for your property while in their care.

Forget insurance companies, go after people, you'll be a lot better off....it will make them do all the work to find out who covered them...why should you have to do anything?!

Sorry to hear about all the aggro though!

Regards, Andrew.

[Duncan]

Hey Jason,

Since you've offered to be insurance guru in this thread, how about this one.

My 200sx was stolen, I was paid out. I paid the excess and have paid the higher premium for 2 years until my NCB came back.

So, now they've caught the scum who did it, am I able to recover that excess, or the subsequent higher premuims?

(On another matter, I need to talk to you about a certain in car camera for the next round at the end of the month- I'll give you a call this week)

[Southo]

Originally posted by Stocker

They assumed responsibility for your car as soon as they took custody of it. The panel shop failed to provide reasonable security for your property while in their care.

Regards, Andrew.

Sometimes I wonder why I bother......

Can you PROVE that they failed to provide REASONABLE security ?? - if you can't - you can not hold them responsible. - and neither will the Law.

Look up the word "reasonable" in the dictionary.

The panel shop IS NOT liable if they took all reasonable care to protect your car. By your comments - this means that if a plane falls out of the sky and crushes the building, that the workshop is responsible because they didn't house the car in a nuclear fallout shelter 30M below ground ???

Hey Duncan,

Yes, you can do this one of two ways.

Depending on your policy wording - if it says you have Faultless Excess and Faultless NCB - (ie, you don't pay if you can identify the guilty party) then the first option is to have your insurance company reimburse you the excess and re-instate your NCB (and increased premiums) as you now fulfilled their criteria for naming the at fault / negligent or responsible party (see a trend here with liability and recovery here guys). I can see them probaly agreeing to the Excess, but probably not the premium increases as those periods of insurance are over - but you might be lucky.

the 2nd option is to take civil action against the charged individual/s if the recovery of excess and premiums is outside the policy wording of your company.

give me a call if you need to discuss in greater detail - otherwise see you at Wakefield

[Southo]

Majanal,

yes, in some instances there can be a proportion of blame - or "contributory negligence" -

once again, even Contributory Negligence must be proven in a court of law for blame to be proportioned.

Originally posted by Majanal

Wow... what a corker.

What southo says is true, for someone to pay then there needs to be someone who is negligent. Now the people ( I'll keep it clean even though thereis another word in my head that starts with p) that cause the damage cannot be located to foot the bill.

So, if I understand it correctly, and correct me if I'm wrong, the blame falls on the next MOST negligent party, which, seeing as you had left your car in the care of the pannel shop would be them. If the car was parked in your garage at home then it would be you.

Speak with your insurance company... tell them everything. They ARE there to fight for you, you don't only pay a preimium just incase you muck up... but also to have some punch against others that might stuff up.

Good luck man... I feel for you.

[dAVE]

contributory negligence can never be 100% tho. It is up to the defendant to prove the contributory negligence, then the court will decide a %. Basically if they decided you were 20% to blame, instead of winning $100 in damages, it would be reduced to $80..