Raceing Classes

[R TUNE]

hi guys

with me about to start my build on a 3L R32 GTS 25 4DR 1991 build.

i had a quick look on cams but cant find the info im after.

would you guys and girls be able to give guidence on classes for raceing. iv heard alot about 3d class please exspalain.

im going to to build the car up for time attack, duttons, hill climbs, motakanas track raceing.

any help would be apreceated.

and any one know of a way around entering a non regersted vehcile (cant even reg mine due to RB25DE eng) in dutton.

regards brentt

[Duncan]

yeah 3D is the only realistic option for a turbo car under cams regs.

You have 3 options for a skyline:

3e - production cars. basically no mods allowed except suspension, ecu, oil coolers, exhaust. must run standard boost. I've got one of these

3j - improved production. very nasty set of rules for a skyline. more open than production cars but you need to run either 1x36mm or 2x27mm intake restrictors. While a GTR (build by BSM) has won NSW and National IP champs, it took a lot of work and money.

3d - sports sedans. very open rules, but the fastest cars in this class are very fast (space frame chasis with 6l chev motor generally). I'm building one of these atm, check the motorsport section. I am aware of 2 other 3D gtrs in NSW, and one from QLD (giant's R32)

The CAMS rulebook is here: http://www.camsmanual.com.au/3category.asp read it carefully before you start otherwise you can end up with a car that can race no-where.

Also, AASA are much more relaxed with rules, I think they run events at calder and winton down your way. But they have far fewer events.

As for rego, in NSW they have Rally Rego which allows you to register an otherwise illegal car (ie not complying with ADRs) for the purpose of competing in rallies, my 3e car is registered under this. Not sure of the rules in Vic. In NSW a highly modified car (3D) would not be eligible. I think most people just keep original rego on their race car even though the car may be pretty highly modified and illegal.

[hrd-hr30]

yeah 3D is the only realistic option for a turbo car under cams regs.

2dr Skylines (R32 anyway, I can't definitely say R33 and R34 can) also have the option of running in 2nd Category Sports Car classes. doesn't apply to this guy, but just thought I'd point it out for others. Stuart Inwood runs his R32 GTR at National Championship level in Sports Cars.

[R TUNE]

ok cool

buy the way the car will not be turbo and is standed with a RB25DE series 1 eng

[Duncan]

very good point, I have seen 32 coupe in production sports (2) as well. their rules are pretty open as well.

sorry i assumed about the turbo. if non turbo the improved production is almost certainly where you want to run it. read the 3j rules.

[R TUNE]

ok just had a look at 3j rules regarding my 32 and this is what i found.

CAR:1991 R32 GTS25 4DR skyline (non turbo RB25DE)

is allowed to race in this class

3.4 Wheel arch flares: It is permitted to add wheelarch flares, provided that the increase in the total width of the coachwork is less than 100mm, as measured above the corresponding wheel centrelines. No part of the flare is permitted to extend further than 200mm from the original wheelarch opening. The operation of any door must not be affected.

DOES THIS MEAN I CAN FIT WIDE BODY GARDS SO LONG AS NO MORE THEN 100MM WIDER THEN STOCK.

3.6 Front spoilers/air dams: It is permitted to fit an airdam to the front of the car, subject to the following restrictions (see diagram 1).

DOES THIS MEAN I CAN CHANGE THE FRONT BUMBER FOR AN AFTER MARKET ONE?

3.8 Rear deck wing: Where the particular model of vehicle as sold in Australia was supplied as standard with a rear deck wing/aerofoil (as defined by CAMS Definitions - General), a rear deck spoiler as per article 3.7 may not be fitted.

CAUSE THE 32 COMES WITH A SPOILER (GTR STYLE) CAN I FIT A GT SPOILER OR NOT?

4.2 Block:

(i) The block must have the same number of cylinders/rotors and the same configuration as was standard or available as a manufacturers option for that particular model (eg, in line, horizontally opposed).

(ii) The block must be from the same manufacturer (eg, Ford, GMH, Nissan) as the original car.

(iii) The cylinder block must either be:

(iv) (a) derived from an eligible car as detailed in Regulation 1.1. OR

(b) derived from the same family of engines as an eligible car using identical internal dimensions (with differences only in transmission mounting pattern, minor external casting differences etc). The block type must be clearly identifiable, ie, Nissan SR20DE, SR20DET, Holden Family II, Toyota 4AG series etc. The derived block must be identifiable as being from a mass produced vehicle, not exclusively developed for sporting evolution models produced for homologation purposes in small numbers for competition use only. CAMS will be the final arbiter in determining the eligibility of a block.

(v) CAMS reserves the right to add any engine block at its discretion. Engine blocks included in this definition are: Nissan FJ20.

SO WITH REGARDS TO THIS I CAN USE THE RB30E BLOCK WITH THE RB25DE HEAD?

11.1 Wheels: Wheels are free subject to the following restrictions.

T

he maximum rim width is 8” for each Late Model automobile with an effective capacity up to and including 3000cc, and is 7” for each other automobile with an effective capacity up to and including 3000cc. The maximum rim width is 9” for each Late Model automobile with an effective capacity greater than 3000cc, and 8” for each other automobile with an effective capacity greater than 3000cc.

O

ther than for Late Model Automobiles, the maximum wheel diameter for an automobile fitted with a piston engine of 6 or more cylinders is 16”; and the maximum wheel diameter for automobiles fitted with any other type of engine is 15”.

SO WHAT SIZE WHEEL CAN I FIT TO THE 32 IT HAS 16X7 AMG ATM.

[Duncan]

I've never built a 3j car so I'm not totally familiar with how they interpret these regs. If you are serious about this contact the Vic IPRA and ask them.

But broadly:

When they talk about model they mean series. so yours is r32 skyline. when its a 2 door that include gtr parts, I'm not sure if that is the same for 4dr.

Yes you can run front splitter and rear spoiler within the dimensions in the rules

Yes you can run wide guards, but when you look at wheel sizes I don't think you will need to.

Yes you can run any 6cyl nissan block, and any head. So presumably the best mix would be rb30 bottom end with rb25de head. but any other option is ok in the rules like rb26 head, rd28 block etc etc. but not aftermarket stuff like an os giken 3l block it has to be nissan

For wheels since you can go to 9" with > 3l, you should consider going longer stroke or boring the block (or both) to get to 3.1l You can then run 9" wide wheels (265tyres). I think rim diameter is standard you need to check that too. so you might be stuf with 16x9, or 16x8 if you go under 3l.

The main thing to remember is your power will be pretty limited, and the car is pretty heavy. You will be racing against bridge port series 1-3 rx7s which are about 800kg and make about 200rwkw. PYou are probably better to start with a 32 gtst with an rb30/26 since the cost of the car is nothing compared to what it will cost to get race ready.

[R TUNE]

cool thanks mate.

well i brought the r32 for $2000 so not much out lay on the car and part are readyerly avalerble from what im seeing.

i find out if i can run 17" as i found a nice set of LMGT4 in 17x8 and 17x9 (235/40 r17 and 255/40 r17)

[R TUNE]

can some one define splitter

is it the same as a aftermarket bumber i.e bomex bumber

[Risking]

The main thing to remember is your power will be pretty limited, and the car is pretty heavy. You will be racing against bridge port series 1-3 rx7s which are about 800kg and make about 200rwkw. PYou are probably better to start with a 32 gtst with an rb30/26 since the cost of the car is nothing compared to what it will cost to get race ready.

Duncan is spot on with that comment.

Your going to spend alot of dollars building a car that will get left for dead. And you can't do an forced induction conversion latter on and still fit into the category with that vehicle.

You'd be much better off selling the car for more than you paid and buying a GTS-t to begin with.

[m3gtr]

+1

Get rid of the 4 door.

[t01-100]

Forget IP, build it as you want and send it Tassie and compete in the seven round Targa Catagory... common sense rules that are import and fun friendly, just make sure you fit R tyres and run in the series many jurnos have called 'Gran Tourismo For Real'

Where else do you see 911 Turbo, GT3, GT2, 968, 944, Nissan GTR and GTSt (31/32/33/34), Nissan 200SX, Subaru WRX, Mitsubishi Evo, Mazda RX7, MX5, Toyota Celica, BMW M3, FPV, HSV and many others mixing it up!

Edited September 14, 2008 by t01-100

[Roy]

What are the costs of entry. SAU-Vic were looking at doing a road trip to Tas for some fun, and i realise its not that expensive to get the car there compared to driving to NSW

Is there anywhere a full calender is posted? How door to door is the racing?

[Duncan]

yeah good point stuart. is our nugget welcome next year

[hrd-hr30]

ok just had a look at 3j rules regarding my 32 and this is what i found.

CAR:1991 R32 GTS25 4DR skyline (non turbo RB25DE)

is allowed to race in this class

3.4 Wheel arch flares: It is permitted to add wheelarch flares, provided that the increase in the total width of the coachwork is less than 100mm, as measured above the corresponding wheel centrelines. No part of the flare is permitted to extend further than 200mm from the original wheelarch opening. The operation of any door must not be affected.

DOES THIS MEAN I CAN FIT WIDE BODY GARDS SO LONG AS NO MORE THEN 100MM WIDER THEN STOCK.

no. read the late model section - there's a bunch of the normal rules that don't apply to late model cars, on of which is 3.4, and some extra freedoms as well.

3.6 Front spoilers/air dams: It is permitted to fit an airdam to the front of the car, subject to the following restrictions (see diagram 1).

DOES THIS MEAN I CAN CHANGE THE FRONT BUMBER FOR AN AFTER MARKET ONE?

yes, you can replace the front bumper cover as long as it meets the dimension requirements of that rule - in particular that when veiwed from above, no part of the lower spoiler may extend beyond a perpendicular line down from the extremities of the bumper. This pretty much rules out canards too.

3.8 Rear deck wing: Where the particular model of vehicle as sold in Australia was supplied as standard with a rear deck wing/aerofoil (as defined by CAMS Definitions - General), a rear deck spoiler as per article 3.7 may not be fitted.

CAUSE THE 32 COMES WITH A SPOILER (GTR STYLE) CAN I FIT A GT SPOILER OR NOT?

you can fit a WING (air flow over 2 sides of the wing element) as per the dimensions in the Late Model section of the rules. Late model cars cannot run rear SPOILERS (air flow over 1 side of the spoiler which is attached to the bodywork all the way along the base like an old Torana.

So you can use a GTR wing IF its fits within those dimension rules. I don't think it does. A GTR can keep its original wing, because it is the "particular model" that came with it. You can't fit it the a 4door if it doesn't meet the dimension criteria.

4.2 Block:

(i) The block must have the same number of cylinders/rotors and the same configuration as was standard or available as a manufacturers option for that particular model (eg, in line, horizontally opposed).

(ii) The block must be from the same manufacturer (eg, Ford, GMH, Nissan) as the original car.

(iii) The cylinder block must either be:

(iv) (a) derived from an eligible car as detailed in Regulation 1.1. OR

(b) derived from the same family of engines as an eligible car using identical internal dimensions (with differences only in transmission mounting pattern, minor external casting differences etc). The block type must be clearly identifiable, ie, Nissan SR20DE, SR20DET, Holden Family II, Toyota 4AG series etc. The derived block must be identifiable as being from a mass produced vehicle, not exclusively developed for sporting evolution models produced for homologation purposes in small numbers for competition use only. CAMS will be the final arbiter in determining the eligibility of a block.

(v) CAMS reserves the right to add any engine block at its discretion. Engine blocks included in this definition are: Nissan FJ20.

SO WITH REGARDS TO THIS I CAN USE THE RB30E BLOCK WITH THE RB25DE HEAD?

Yes, but you would then be subject to minimum weight requirements. Keep the original block and head and you are exempt from minimum weight.

11.1 Wheels: Wheels are free subject to the following restrictions.

The maximum rim width is 8” for each Late Model automobile with an effective capacity up to and including 3000cc, and is 7” for each other automobile with an effective capacity up to and including 3000cc. The maximum rim width is 9” for each Late Model automobile with an effective capacity greater than 3000cc, and 8” for each other automobile with an effective capacity greater than 3000cc.

O

ther than for Late Model Automobiles, the maximum wheel diameter for an automobile fitted with a piston engine of 6 or more cylinders is 16”; and the maximum wheel diameter for automobiles fitted with any other type of engine is 15”.

SO WHAT SIZE WHEEL CAN I FIT TO THE 32 IT HAS 16X7 AMG ATM.

if you're under 3000cc you can run maximum 8", over 3000cc maximum 9"

Edited September 15, 2008 by hrd-hr30