Honda's And Their Vtecs

[Lithium]

I thought that was a V8 thing... they tend to call anyone who deoesn't have a turck sized V8 under the hood by that title.

I tend to feel that someone who gets up on their high horse when someone else is happy with their equipment can't be too happy with their own...

Edited October 8, 2008 by Lithium

[sanjuu-ni]

It was designed to be firm riding and noisy. It doesnt come with sound deadening from the factory. And has track adequate suspention. Lets not forget it only weighs 1080kg in stock form. Its aimed at particular markets, as is every model of car.

I found that my R33 was nearly as firm riding with stock suspention too.

And you'l find that if you drive it properly, then it doesnt drop out of VTEC. Again, it is designed not to if you know how to drive it. I personally never had a problem overtaking in mine. You just need to learn how it works.

Nearly every car you need to accelerate up behind the car infront before you pull out. Including VTEC! Not every car has immediate power to just pull out and go. Its common sence.

I dont know why you'd want to drive around at 7000rpm in the city anyway.. when the speed limits 50k and you can go 20k over in 1st gear? I think your pulling excuses to knock one of the best FWD cars ever produced. You just cant compare this type of car with Skylines.

Im not getting shitty at you, as each to their own, as my dream car is a GTR and always has been. But i in no way think that because a Honda isnt a Skyline that it is shit.

Actually, it wasn't designed to be firm and noisy. Surely the design objectives were to make it handle well and perform well on just 1.8 litres. Stiffening the suspension so much and removing the sound deadening turned it into a tiresome road car even though it was good when you occasionally went to the track.

What Honda didn't achieve with the Type R Civics and Integras was a decent ride/handling compromise, even though they had shown they could do it.

And the concept of V-tec remains fundamentally flawed. I definitely don't want to be driving around the city using 7000+rpm, but what acceleration do you get for lane changing when the thing is doing 3000rpm in third? Or when you turn into a side street at say, 20kmh and it wont pull up an incline in 2nd? The Mazda RX8 has the same kind of drivability issues. Driving in the real world requires low down flexibility and plenty of instant torque. Well developed 6s, V8s and turbos meet these requirements in a way the screaming V-tec fours never have.

Don't think I'm knocking V-tec Hondas either: I actually own one at the moment. And even though I own a GT-R, I'm quite capable of identifying its flaws.

[Lithium]

And the concept of V-tec remains fundamentally flawed. I definitely don't want to be driving around the city using 7000+rpm, but what acceleration do you get for lane changing when the thing is doing 3000rpm in third? Or when you turn into a side street at say, 20kmh and it wont pull up an incline in 2nd? The Mazda RX8 has the same kind of drivability issues. Driving in the real world requires low down flexibility and plenty of instant torque. Well developed 6s, V8s and turbos meet these requirements in a way the screaming V-tec fours never have.

Thats nothing to do with VTEC, thats to do with engine size - VTEC doesn't make it a bigger engine, or like a bigger engine.... it allows something to be a tractable reliable economical race motor. A 1.8litre VTEC motor for example will be no worse than a standard 1.8l 4cyl NA motor in driveability if not a little torquier/responsive due to compression head design and engine balance but also angry up in the revs. It doesn't compromise torque at all, it just means that its torque doesn't match that of a typical turbo or bigger displacement motor with the same power. Bolt a turbo onto a VTEC motor and you start making other turbo motors look average....

[GTRsean]

I had an old 1985 civic with a 1.6DOHC ZC JDM engine implant. No power steer, aircon, stereo, electric mirrors etc. Cost me $600 and I used to smile more driving that more than the GTR, due to the fact you didn't have to worry about anyone/thing. It reved to 7500 and wasn't even VTECH lol. Made 100hp at the wheels in a 890kg car. Ran it down WSID and got a 15.5 stock, no mods to engine, with roof racks lol!

Lots of fun and use bugger all fuel, it handled good too, for a FWD. Don't bag em till you try em I say.

[Lithium]

I had an old 1985 civic with a 1.6DOHC ZC JDM engine implant. No power steer, aircon, stereo, electric mirrors etc. Cost me $600 and I used to smile more driving that more than the GTR, due to the fact you didn't have to worry about anyone/thing. It reved to 7500 and wasn't even VTECH lol. Made 100hp at the wheels in a 890kg car. Ran it down WSID and got a 15.5 stock, no mods to engine, with roof racks lol!

Lots of fun and use bugger all fuel, it handled good too, for a FWD. Don't bag em till you try em I say.

Haha yeah those things are awesome, very hoonable and light as so don't need much. There is a guy with one of those and a tinkered with B18C which has done mid/high 12s as a street car - no reliability issues again.

[full house]

You don't need to doubt if its Honda. Honda cars are really great.

[Mohsen]

i got nothing against them.

my uncle let me drive his prelude. its like a gokart lol...

[MaFi0s02]

I was with my cousin the other day driving (my daily is an Astina). And I dont have any pride in my Astina whatsoever, but infront of me was this yellow SP20 which was polished, had an exhuast and possibly rims and I said to my cousin, why?

And he explained to me that some people need to make do with what they can afford, people in Porsches, Ferraris and Lambos etc probly look at our cars and think the exact same things we think when we see a riced up econobox(be it whatever car).

Edited October 9, 2008 by MaFi0s02

[OzCarImports]

I use to have an early 's Integra Vtec I hammered the hell out of it was about 19 at the time, thought I was an F1 driver in my race car, then I got my first turbo, that was the end of that.

Great engine though very impressed and still love the sound of a Vtec kicking in.

[EKSMUD]

i've been in an NSX,S2000,eg6 vtir,type r DC5 and even Prelude.... only NSX puts smile on my face. but a mate who owns it is a tool but skylines especially the GTR really owns it.....

having said that ///M FTMFW....

Edited October 9, 2008 by EKSMUD

[Johnny]

Which sounds better; VTEC fart cannons or an rb26dett on full noise 8000rpm.

I respect the NSX and s2000 but to those 'gangstas' in the US who believe its the 'be all and end all' of performance must be the load their mothers were meant to swallow.

[Levi_]

I had a B16A2 (1.6L VTEC) in my 94 EG Civic. And it's an awesome little car with an awesome little engine. But VTEC is nothing to get excited over, especially on a small engine. THe more agressive valve timings don't do much when your only running a 1.6 or 1.8.

So, I gave my Civic to my girlfriend and bought my R33, which also has variable valve timing but with a turbo!

VTEC never made me spin the wheels when it came on. Turbos are a different matter.

But I am a fanboy because for my job, a Mac works WAY better than any PC ever will. And yes I have worked on both platforms. PCs suck for graphic design work.

I'm a designer and at work I run Vista on a Mac Pro, because OSX is too slow, buggy and in no way has any benefits over Windows for design. Please, tell me one way a Mac will help me get more done, or make me a better designer!

[JI34GT]

www.ozhonda.com

INTER-FORUM WAR!!!

lol

[Lithium]

Which sounds better; VTEC fart cannons or an rb26dett on full noise 8000rpm.

No one ever said the Hondas are better than the Nissans - especially an RB26DETT. That comment means nothing - what sounds better, an RB20DE with a fart cannon or an RB26DETT? Hell even the VTEC sounds 10,000,000 times better than an NA RB.

VTEC is nothing to get excited over, especially on a small engine. THe more agressive valve timings don't do much when your only running a 1.6 or 1.8.

So, I gave my Civic to my girlfriend and bought my R33, which also has variable valve timing but with a turbo!

VTEC never made me spin the wheels when it came on. Turbos are a different matter.

R33s just adjust the cam timing, Hondas have two stages of lift as well which is what makes the real difference. A base model VTEC Integra with a turbo on the side of it running 8psi of boost will make power comparable to your typical RB25DET using only a 1.8litre engine, take into account that its in a light car it makes for a seriously fast little car for not a huge amount of money.

[gotRICE?]

i've been in an NSX,S2000,eg6 vtir,type r DC5 and even Prelude.... only NSX puts smile on my face. but a mate who owns it is a tool but skylines especially the GTR really owns it.....

having said that ///M FTMFW....

You need to go in an NSX-R then.

Quicker around a track, and from a standing 1/4 than an R34 GTR.

[burkill]

Its very clear that many Skyline drivers still have tiny penises.

I for one am a big Honda fan, it seems a lot of you seem to assume because someone is enthusiastic about their car means they think its better than everything or more than it is - you have to take it as all relative. Hondas are awesome fun to drive, I have actually just bought a Japanese import Honda Prelude (my 2nd 2.2VTEC one, my 5th Honda) and for day to day use it actually puts more of a grin on my face than my 280kw @ wheel RWD Skyline.

These people raving on about these things having no torque, it would kill my Skyline from low revs and makes my Skyline feel more like a "need to rev" type car - albeit the Skyline would kick 7 shades of shit out of the Prelude once it gets a bit of boost on but again, I own the two cars for different reasons. The Prelude is something I can thrash around without worrying about it breaking (whoever said fast NA Hondas need regular rebuilds have been around too many bad tuners/engine builders), someone bumping into it, or going too fast to quickly.

People may think that VTEC Hondas don't have any acceleration, but to be blatently honest after running around for a couple of years with a turbo Skyline with reasonable power I can still get a kick out of when the Honda winds up and goes when I need it to - there are no big risks or planning sessions required to work out how to overtake people, and more grins than frustration when thrashing it. Sure it doesn't blow me away with mighty acceleration, but its got enough that its not a waste of time revving it out and because its not a Skyline/Mitsi/whatever I can rev it past redline day in day out and can stay confident the rods will stay where they should be. Its exactly the same as when I go in a majority of other turbo Skylines out there, they have enough of a push in the back to tell you that its going but it doesn't blow me away - its still fun though.

I don't take the piss out of people who have got their first GTSt with cat back exhaust and are rapt with it because my own car will shit on it from a great height, I don't see why people should do the same to someone who has got themselves a car which gives them the same jollies but they have the added bonus of not getting raped at the service station, not worries of ceramic exhaust wheels smashing, ring lands breaking, coils breaking down, etc etc.

i said they need rebuild's, i didn't mean stock h22a's. i mean't the spoon and mugen motors, or any other engine, not just honda, that can rev to double digits. the poor internals must be going through hell.

however,

i'll probly try a prelude, integra, or civic before i go to a GTR.

[gotRICE?]

i said they need rebuild's, i didn't mean stock h22a's. i mean't the spoon and mugen motors, or any other engine, not just honda, that can rev to double digits. the poor internals must be going through hell.

however,

i'll probly try a prelude, integra, or civic before i go to a GTR.

You cant really compare a Built Spoon motor to a standard or bolt ons + boost RB tho can you?

Oh and just for reference, the Spoon engines are a STOCK B18CR, that is blueprinted and balanced to perfection and possibly a Spoon headgasket and oil cap. Thats it.

Pretty sure Lith is saying that in comparison, a Honda engine with bolt ons will take 100x more abuse than an RB with bolt ons, especially at constant high rpm.

[burkill]

i'd be happy with either one.

this thread was mean't to lol at hondas i think.

now it's pretty much praising them haha,

thread fail.

[5hu7o]

honda is a failboat for me FF<FR.

[nizmo_freek]

Another "vs" thread YAY!!

Edited October 10, 2008 by nizmo_freek