Epa Exhaust Decibel Test

[Rav]

I had a EPA on my stock Vl for my exhaust being to loud what a joke.

I still had to pay for the test. Bull Sh*t if you ask me you can just dop in people you don't like. .

[Johnny]

I had a EPA on my stock Vl for my exhaust being to loud what a joke.

I still had to pay for the test. Bull Sh*t if you ask me you can just dop in people you don't like. .

You know how people are like today but then again wouldnt you be tempted to dob in those fart in a cannon boxes lolz. Although you hate em, you still wouldnt try n make trouble for someone.

They are the same people who key a car because of jealousy ect.

keep it real!

[R31Nismoid]

Any old person cannot just report you.

Only Police can, or the same car called up about a number of times, and the people must advise where/when, thier license # and stuff so it cannot be a fake report to annoy someone.

UPDATE

just bought a dB meter of my own which i should get in 2-3 days.

anyone can feel free to come to my place and do a test if you get a letter in the mail or just wanna make sure your cars legal.

oh and to make sure the exhaust shop dosent try to lie to you; its accurate 2dB +/- at 134dB

2 dB +/- is quite a big inaccuracy in terms of the fact its two times louder @ 92dB than 90dB

The exhausts shops dB meter is substantially more expensive and accurate than some $100 special you'll buy over the internet or from Jaycar.

I'd like to see you argue with the guy that hit dB meter is wrong and your net special is right.

[Johnny]

Hmm come to think of it, i remmember police following me once but didnt pull me over, i was in high gears most the time so wasnt loud......possibly happend then.

anyways just thought id keep a dB meter handy to see how far/close i am to the limit; if im at 87dB then i wont have to grab a stocker.

[krzysiu]

Do you know how quiet 89DB is? If you got a 3 inch catback exhaust you will fail without any extra mufflers.

[akeenan]

heres some decibel comparisons http://www.gcaudio.com/resources/howtos/loudness.html . 89 decibels is very quiet for a car exhaust and there is no way you could be under with any free flowing aftermarket exhaust on a gtr

[Johnny]

Do you know how quiet 89DB is? If you got a 3 inch catback exhaust you will fail without any extra mufflers.

Hmmm i see, never really estimated; i have 2 turbos which will act sorta like 2 mufflers, stock cat, mid muffler and a very chunky end muffler.

I find it very quiet on cruising, only when the gates open up it becomes a screamer

heres some decibel comparisons http://www.gcaudio.com/resources/howtos/loudness.html . 89 decibels is very quiet for a car exhaust and there is no way you could be under with any free flowing aftermarket exhaust on a gtr

Thanks for the link

[R31Nismoid]

heres some decibel comparisons http://www.gcaudio.com/resources/howtos/loudness.html . 89 decibels is very quiet for a car exhaust and there is no way you could be under with any free flowing aftermarket exhaust on a gtr

i was 92 dB with 3.5"

and we ended up getting it to pass with some modification after that

it can be done

[(OO)SKYLINE(OO)]

From memory if your car is older than 1990 you have to be under 90 dB and I think if your car is 90 model and newer, you can get away with a louder exhaust...

I suggest you find a stock R34 GTR exhaust, install a shitty compliance cat converter in and if you want to be safe, get a resinator put in the stock exhaust.

Pass the test then free it up again but keep your stock exhaust system.

[krzysiu]

From memory if your car is older than 1990 you have to be under 90 dB and I think if your car is 90 model and newer, you can get away with a louder exhaust...

I suggest you find a stock R34 GTR exhaust, install a shitty compliance cat converter in and if you want to be safe, get a resinator put in the stock exhaust.

Pass the test then free it up again but keep your stock exhaust system.

Wrong way around Jamie, If your car is older, being louder is permittable. Newer car must be under 90db.

[Johnny]

From memory if your car is older than 1990 you have to be under 90 dB and I think if your car is 90 model and newer, you can get away with a louder exhaust...

I suggest you find a stock R34 GTR exhaust, install a shitty compliance cat converter in and if you want to be safe, get a resinator put in the stock exhaust.

Pass the test then free it up again but keep your stock exhaust system.

Thanks man, anybet im gonna have to find a stocker; wonder if they are rare? I have the compliance cat.

ill pop a thread in the WTB section

Wrong way around Jamie, If your car is older, being louder is permittable. Newer car must be under 90db.

90dB ay? well mine is only a 3inch and has JASMA printed on it, i think that means its Japanese EPA certified for noise and clearance etc.

Hope i get my dB meter asap; im having my cat fitted and test done on wed; have until december something-ish

[krzysiu]

I got a Fujitsubo JASMA approved exhaust. It is not that loud but still would not pass an Australian noise test.

[Johnny]

UPDATE

Well i had the stock compliance cat fitted back in and my god does it drain the power; response is completely halved and the engine just dosent want to rev like it used to.

Definitely at least a 10% drop in power but the good news is, the car is very quiet and i had the mechanic use a dB meter and it comes in at 88dB @ 4900-5050rpm so hopefully the EPA approved testers will get the same reading.

As soon as i pass, im having a custom made second mid muffler with flanges welded in so it will look like a cat, flow like my race pipe and hopefully prevent anymore hassle from those chicken-hawks.

[hp8510]

There was a cop who dobbed me in. But an hour later I drove in the opposite direction right past a "noise level test station" on the side of the road operated by the Police in exactly the same spot. I was never sighted for excessive noise level by the test station, only by the copper who wrote my registration down. It seems that the EPA is prepared to accept Police ears over calibrated test equipment.

This was clearly a mistaken identification. Sent a letter of appeal with photos of a completely standard exhaust system with absolutely no leaks or rusted components to:

Mr Greg Howarth

Project Manager – Motor Vehicles

EPA

PO Box 4395QQ

MELBOURNE VIC 3001.

He sent a rubbish reply saying that Police reports are considered as "prima facie" evidence. This would be why the EPA prefers "calibrated ears" than "calibrated test equipment" in the first instance. It creates a "grey area" that gives them (and not the vehicle) the benefit of the doubt.

The test was done and subsequently past by 6dB(A). It wasted $37.50 of my hard earned money and my valuable afternoon.

But there are a number of things about the whole process that are very dubious...

a) The "Vehicle Test Notice" only provides information on what penalties or liabilities apply if no action is taken. It doesn't actually explain what rights of appeal that are available and whether it is defendable in a court of law. I believe that this is referred to being "denied due process" in legal speak.

b) The EPA appears to be administering the "Environment Protection Act 1970 - Section 55AC" as if it is literally above every law in the country. I was under the impression that Common Law always took precedence and within that is the presumption of innocence until proven otherwise. It would seem that vehicle owners are being treated as guilty until proven innocent at their own cost. This contravenes the fundamental rights of law-abiding citizens which we all are even if we allegedly have a noisy exhaust system. It has to be proven that way first and then you are guilty.

The above could be a basis for a class action against the EPA in every state of Australia to recover costs and expenses for the illegitimate enforcement of a vehicle test.

Is there a law firm out there with any balls to have a go at this???? Just imagine how much they would make out of it! The tester admitted that they do 50 tests per month average. And that is just one of the 26 approved testers in Victoria alone. That is a potential of 15,600 contestable notices every year in Victoria (until they fix the information on the notice), an equivalent of $585,000 recovery just in the notices. And of course, everyone needs compensation for the time off work to get the test done as well, so there are quite a few bucks there too. At a good guess, there are probably 40,000 to 50,000 notices issued Australia wide every year.

Study the Vehicle Test Notice and have a look at the 1970 ACT.

Send me your comments. I am particularly interested to hear from the legal profession (including law students eager to make a name for themselves). With the right support I could start a campaign and dedicated web site that could provide some pressure to turn the tables on the EPA and make things fairer. Really, the EPA should pay for the test if it passes. That would make them think twice before issuing these damn notices, particularly when it is marginal or just because some Police Officer thinks your car is hot and must be loud!

[Johnny]

^^^ Amazing response and insight.

Im shocked after reading that, i read the letter and they dont even tell you how they do the test; like what distance the instrument is held at, is the car enclosed in a factory or out on the street in the open....oh and how many rpm they use, what happens if they over step to 5200rpm ect????

No such bargaining for court, then again i wouldnt go as ive been so many times for 'non-car matters' lolz

Money making 101 from the communist handbook............apparently that makes me and every other sportscar driver a capitalistic pig.

PS whats with harleys passing us at 120dB and ferraris with 100dB (jst guessing the levels)

We will never understand law, ethics and just plain human compassion.

[hp8510]

There is a document out there that seems to be a very comprehensive coverage of the test procedure.

It seems to be Victorian focused but its a start. Here is the link http://www.ntc.gov.au/filemedia/Reports/Na...austNoiseTe.doc to get a copy.

Haven't gone through all of the detail yet, but it looks like it caters for everything including circumstances when the tester can't get an ideal set of results. That includes ambient noise contribution, different RPM and microphone height above ground.

I got this from here http://www.rurallaw.org.au/ which might help out with a few legal aspects of the 1970 ACT. The specific web page on the subject of noise pollution is here http://www.rurallaw.org.au/handbook/xml/ch03s13s07.php

I am beginning to accumulate this type of info but I don't think that the problem is in the testing. The problem is implementation of the ACT itself and the information provided to recipients of Vehicle Test Notices.

So everyone, if you have any comments then give me something to work with! Do some research and give me some ideas.

[R31Nismoid]

Only thing i would question is your numbers. 15k contestable?

I doubt it.

Of those 50 cars, i would imagine almost ALL of them would have been over. I say would, because some might not be when they went for the test.

This is due to them swapping over to the stock exhaust, and doing this is actually cheating the test.

So maybe you would be closer to say... 2 or 3 of those 50 per month were actually legal.

Just driving around each day i could probably pick 30-50 cars that have louder exhausts than mine, meaning they will fail as mine just passes.

Also, once the EPA note down (if you get done by a testing station) that you have a large exhaust, but keep appearing with the stock or smaller one, i do believe there are substantial fines involved. This is why on the local tester form, they note down the makeup/size of the exhaust you arrive with for the test.

Problem with a case like this is so many will jump on, but so many have wrongfully swapped back to the stock exhaust just for the test

If what you say is true, only those who truely were legal, and were unfortunately reported... would be justified.

All it would take would be one car to be busted with a larger exhaust for it to be suspect to the case id imagine... and im sure that would be quite easy.

I would be willing to join, because i know my exhaust is legal, but the majority of people out there i think would fail to be in that category

[hp8510]

Hi R31Nismoid.

The point is not whether the exhaust system is actually compliant or not, it is whether the Vehicle Test Notice issued is legitimate within the law. Recipients are being denied "due process". So the problem isn't whether car owners are chopping and changing exhaust systems prior to, or following noise tests, it is whether the Vehicle Test Notice is valid in the first place.

This means that every Vehicle Test Notice should be contestable!

It's like having a speeding fine thrown out of court on a technicality.

But on an individual basis nobody is going to do it to save $37.50, however, a class action with $millions behind it might just do the trick!

[R31Nismoid]

I believe the test notice is just that, a test to ensure you meet. Much the same as a test for your license.

No-one says you cannot drive, but the law states it must be tested and verified.

Now as too how frequency etc etc, could go anywhere with that.

Its not saying you are over noise, but rather observed to possibly/might be.

I think you really need to talk to a lawyer first before you go spruking about forums and stirring up the hen house.

Like i said, id be willing to jump on board so I'm not having a go, just trying to think from all sides at one time.

Ive had a fair involvement with the EPA of the years, cost me quite a penny 'getting legal'... more than most

[Johnny]

Hey, Finally got my test done today and passed at 87dB

Quick rant: the mf at the exhaust shop tested my car 5times because he didnt believe the reading! he said it should be louder........now i was pissed at the fact that he held my car at 5100rpm for quite a while and 5 times.........he probably wanted to make more money out of me.

Anyways the only thing i changed was the catalytic converter back to the compliance one, still have my 3.5inch s/s system on etc.