Got Over 400kw Atw?

[Nee-san]

Yes, both gervaise and I had our box's cryo treated at Dans insistence.

both car make over 400 kw's and both get dragged and circuit driven and have done for 3 years with zero gearbox issues.

Does it work, How do you prove it. You can only disprove it by breaking the box and that has not happenned to date so I'm going with a resounding yes! It does work.

Hey Noel,

Those two cars are the "For" argument that I have heard, what did it cost and what state does the box have to be in for the process ?

[FineLine]

Cryo treatment is relatively inexpensive Mitch, somewhere around the 300 dllar mark for the complete internals from memory.

The expensive bit is obviously stripping and rebuilding the box along with new bearings and sychros as common sense would dictate.

[Piggaz]

That's with the OEM gears Noel?

[ezy_09s]

Anyone know of cryo treatment places in sydney they would recommend ?

[FineLine]

That's with the OEM gears Noel?

certainly is Paul.

[XKLABA]

That's with the OEM gears Noel?

you can have ant gearset done not just oem and it would help strengthen

ezy_09s, there is a place at Silverdale I was recommended for my excavator teeth, try google a see if they come up

[NXTIME]

I had some stuff done at a place in Yennora a while back.

[ezy_09s]

Cheers XKLABA & NXTIME, I take it this would be them ..btw how were they for price and service ?

Company

Ace Cryogenic

Address

Barrington Road

Silverdale NSW 2752

Phone

02 4774 0256

Edited March 31, 2012 by ezy_09s

[Roy]

Small thing, but I don't think cryo increases strength (technically). It works by improving the weak points by ensuring more uniform grain structures. Well at least that was my memory of it from 10yrs ago when I once read about it

[The Dan]

Small thing, but I don't think cryo increases strength (technically). It works by improving the weak points by ensuring more uniform grain structures. Well at least that was my memory of it from 10yrs ago when I once read about it

I'm not a metallurgist, but according to the experts at the company that perform the treatment, it strengthens the metal by 300-400%.

The only reason why a metal like this is potentially weak is because of the grain. Improving that grain structure of the metal at a base level certainly does make it stronger.

Standard gear RB20 gearbox - 640hp at the wheels

Standard gear RB20 gearbox - 380hp at the wheels in a drift car thrashed every week for 4 years and still going

R33 GTST, GTR gearboxes all making over 500hp at the wheels, 9k rpm launches on semi slicks, flat shifting, clutch dumping/kicking and general abuse

Have never broken a single one....ever

[Daz]

OK I have finally made it to the 400 kw thread.

Car running rb26 block and -5's

Car made on 19psi 420rwks - I'm wrapped

Massive thanks to Trent & Cat from Chequered tuning who tuned the car over the weekend (wouldn't go anywhere else)

Trent tuned a felxi fuel set up on my Autronic

Also a huge thanks to Tas (Power Glide GTR) for getting the car to where it is - car has turned out mint mate

[Marko R1]

Is cryogenics recognised or practiced by the Japanese?

I remember when I first joined this forum and reading up on this when paul diemar was using cryogenics as well as crd...it obviously is tried and proven, however, it also seems to be a thing of the past OR ppl simply dont discuss it these days.

I've always been interested in this subject and TBH if I built another engine or box, I would use this method

[The Dan]

Is cryogenics recognised or practiced by the Japanese?

I remember when I first joined this forum and reading up on this when paul diemar was using cryogenics as well as crd...it obviously is tried and proven, however, it also seems to be a thing of the past OR ppl simply dont discuss it these days.

I've always been interested in this subject and TBH if I built another engine or box, I would use this method

I have had the luxury of back to back testing

R32 GTR making 600hp at the wheels

Blew 3rd gear

rebuilt without cryo

Blew 3rd gear

rebuilt with cryo

still going 12 months later, same abuse

[Nee-san]

Small thing, but I don't think cryo increases strength (technically). It works by improving the weak points by ensuring more uniform grain structures. Well at least that was my memory of it from 10yrs ago when I once read about it

Technically it's hardness roy, which can come at the expense of strength or "toughness" also there is the question of penetration and how deep you can reach into the grain structure.

That's sort of my concern.

[ezy_09s]

I have had the luxury of back to back testing

R32 GTR making 600hp at the wheels

Blew 3rd gear

rebuilt without cryo

Blew 3rd gear

rebuilt with cryo

still going 12 months later, same abuse

Wow, those results are quite something ..im assuming thats just using the factory gearsets in all these boxes ?

Technically it's hardness roy, which can come at the expense of strength or "toughness" also there is the question of penetration and how deep you can reach into the grain structure.

That's sort of my concern.

Ah apparently not .

Its just a more uniform & consistent hardness across the part.

http://www.nitrofreeze.com/cryogenic_treatment_for_motorsports.html

[Nee-san]

Wow, those results are quite something ..im assuming thats just using the factory gearsets in all these boxes ?

Ah apparently not .

Its just a more uniform & consistent hardness across the part.

http://www.nitrofree...otorsports.html

That article doesn't make any reference to the depth of penetration of the process, which was my main concern.

Further, while it is true that it can relieve internal stresses and reduce voids and dislocation in the grain structure.

All of the effects such as increased wear resistance, point to more carbon being brought to the surface and the formation of a harder outer case (Case hardening) which I would have though would come at the dentriment of toughness when you're talking about the gearset globally ?

Not against the idea at all just need to know that it will work the way I need to to.

TL;DR basically. Lol.

[Missileman]

One of my mates just started a new job with a company that does this cryo stuff. Since I plan to do my brakes soon, I'll ask him how much to do the rotors. Might make that skim job last a bit longer, after that they are for the dust bin,

[Trozzle]

OK I have finally made it to the 400 kw thread.

Car running rb26 block and -5's

Car made on 19psi 420rwks - I'm wrapped

Massive thanks to Trent & Cat from Chequered tuning who tuned the car over the weekend (wouldn't go anywhere else)

Trent tuned a felxi fuel set up on my Autronic

Also a huge thanks to Tas (Power Glide GTR) for getting the car to where it is - car has turned out mint mate

Can you confirm that boost figure please.

[Nee-san]

Can you confirm that boost figure please.

Actually yes, and supporting mods, that's a great result, well done mate.

[Roy]

I'm not a metallurgist, but according to the experts at the company that perform the treatment, it strengthens the metal by 300-400%.

The only reason why a metal like this is potentially weak is because of the grain. Improving that grain structure of the metal at a base level certainly does make it stronger.

Proof is in the pudding. But still dubious of the 300-400% claim. Can someone point me in the direction of a good article on this?

My understanding from the old Iron Carbon diagram has always been strength-Ductility-toughness vs hardness is greatly dependent on the rates of heating and cooling etc and grain size and type. With cryo freezing you are not changing the grain structure type/composition, rather just refining the grain structure by making it slightly smaller and more uniform. So you are not increasing the UTS etc of the component, but stress relieving it so that it wont fail at its weakest point.