I Saw A Suicide Today

[shire72]

3 x tips for those worried about this being 2 years ago:

1. unless you were there it is a bit rich to make comment on the scene. As I was there I think I have an edge on you. The initial post on here is BS. The guy did not jump in front of train, he laid down on track and train ran over him. He had no chance of surviving as he put his head on the rail. There was no use for any rail staff or passengers or emergency personnel doing anything to try and save him as he was dead from word go.

2. investigations are always open on this until coronial enquiry is held, which has not been held yet. If you have info report it. I put my statement in.

3. I don't trawl the internet looking for suicide stories on posts about Skylines so sorry I didn't see this until now.

For those who think they know all about running over someone and killing them. Give it a try in your Skyline

[hamiltonau]

i hit a pigeon the other day in bondi, thought the bugger would fly up at the last minute like they always do but 'thump' and a cloud of feathers.

Gf was pretty pissed at me.

does that count?

[WARLORD]

i see three to four every year at my work and its not a good feeling,then there is the close calls everyday,

sometimes people just don't see that there is always a better way of dealing with things.

some help lines

http://www.suicideline.org.au/

http://www.kidshelp.com.au/teens/get-help/who-else-can-help/helpful-links/suicide.php

[hamiltonau]

er whats ur work?

[WARLORD]

acute psychiatry

what i have seen people do is something i hope most will never see

Edited February 24, 2011 by WARLORD

[hamiltonau]

your in psychiatry and you only have a GTSt like me? your doing it wrong...

lol kidding, you probably own a coupla places anyway. um yeah point. topic. on.

i have seen some stuff online and in real life i wish i could unsee but you never can unfortunately, also have had family members with mental illness go into care and back again. Quite a lot of scary stuff goes down in those places but from what i hear the staff are doing the best they can with limited resources.

props to you Warlord for dealing with it on a daily basis, it must be a thankless task sometimes but im sure society is a lot better off with people like you on the frontline.

stay frosty

[WARLORD]

a small glimps of my last two weeks.

last monday got into a bit of a jam with a paitient needed to restrain him one of the stuff f%$# up and i hurt my knee.took some days off to get better and returned on tuesday this week.

tuesday a ice bunny off his face with ice who has antisocial behaviour (homicidal psychopath) punchred me in the throat after stopping him from fighting a other paitient,it got messy again with me having to put him down and hurting my knee again work mate got kneed in the head and punched twice and a female got her neck all twisted up.

i had to take time off but i'll be back monday again for my next round of shit.lol

that's with out going into the self harmer with the razor in her mouth and the overdose.

here a short look at my reality,

i had someone do this kinda stuff for 6 weeks

http://www.google.com.au/images?hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=sb&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&q=self+harmer&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&sa=X&ei=9C5nTaqAOY68vQO0j4jkAg&ved=0CEMQsAQ&biw=1680&bih=864

[sinistaGTR]

hmm interesting stuff RB thanks for the info.

figured the police culture would be a little more robust re post trauma recovery, sounds a lot like the army. Did reserves for a while and the chaplain thing sounds familiar, always freaked me out how friendly and open they were compared to any of the corporals/officers etc.

from what i have seen of that show 'recruits' goulburn looks a bit like boot camp 'lite' too, im guessing everyone comes out of it changed somewhat?

anyway on the railways our post incident stuff is of course outsourced like everything else in Railcorp, a psychologist gives us a ring and tries to schedule an interview where we can 'vent' etc, and usually its a badge of honour to see how many days/weeks we can finangle out of them before we have to go back to work. The new longest time off sets a benchmark and then everyone aims to get the same the next chance we get.

thats about as team spirity as we get

oh and re the clenched fist of triumph everytime we take someone out?

off the record? um probably but you didnt hear that from me :*

ps

i wasnt sure where i came up with the word finangle so googled it with surprising results. I stand by my use of the term nevertheless..

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Finangle

You cant talk the army as a whole there mate, reserves and full time is very very different. One is just tuesday nights and weekend where people get to think there tough by wearing a uniform then getting to yell at people....its nothing like the real thing.

Just sounds like you had a bunch of f#*kwits with your army reserve experience then. Officers and esp your corporals should be more than approachable when it comes to circumstances when you need to speak to someone, yes they may seem more robust as they have a job to command a team at the end of the day but diggers should never feel they cant approach them if there is issues. The chaplains are extremely approachable but thats what they are there for and they do a stunning job.

Another thing to remember is some of these people need to be robust, when your leading a section or platoon into a warzone and getting shot at...you need to be robust.

Glad to hear railcorp has sorted out some counselling etc for you and your team

Edited February 25, 2011 by sinistagtst

[hamiltonau]

"sounds like you had a bunch of f#*kwits with your army reserve experience"

dont get me started, a Waaahmbulance may need to be called seriously on the one hand i want to harp on about what outrageous bastards one or two of my corporals were but then on the other hand part of me just wants to take a teaspoon of harden the F$# up as we were told to do in training.

Your sort of right about the tuesday nights, pretty soft with the drills, map reading and pizza nights hence i was absolutely unprepared for boot camp.

From buzz cut as soon as we got off the bus to boots in the ass on the 10k hike 3 weeks in it was non stop in your face bullying and intimidation. Closest i ever came to letting myself just drop fully loaded down a staircase, didnt do it but admitting i wanted to was the only thing that got me out early and gave me some kind of insight into how the people warlord deal with get that way.

Cant imagine the horror of growing up in a household half as psychologically draining as BUNA platoon 32, im sure it was not a completely typical experience but the conditions are there for the wrong people to exploit and in hindsight thats what happened in my case. To give it some perspective out of the 42 recruits who started the course only 29 were still in when i left and apparently more went after that. Highest drop out rate ever according to the psych who interviewed me on the way out.

anyhoo, sure do appreciate life on the outside a little more now..

[blk180]

LoL being a train guard you cant say shit about running people over in a Train, its all about the noise the a Train driver hears as a persons bones pop or when they look into your eyes as they jump.

There are a number of Ex train drivers cos the stress of a fatality was to much for them to take.

Can also come down to age of the person you hit, if you have kids that age can mess you up.

Also there is no truth to the at least one week off, you can come back to work the next day if you like.

[hamiltonau]

er thanks BLK180, insightful stuff.

i would hazard i can say 'shit' about running over people with a train as we are the first responder, sure the driver cops the hit but then we have to go up and deal with the victim/remains, the inevitable crowd control issues and liason with emergency services when they turn up. As for the week or two off, i never said it was mandatory, just that we are offered full rostered pay for a fortnight or more. who wouldnt take it?

[GTR-N1]

Another angle:-

When people take Pot, the 'weed' stimulates a slight spike in Noradrenaline and Serotonin (brain chemical messengers or hormones).

When 'the session' is over, and hours pass, the Noradrenaline and Serotonin (and in the case of Hydro-pot, Dopamine) levels drops to a teeny-weeny level below what one produced before 'the session'.

Over time, propensity to suicide gets greater.

If the person didn't produce enough Serotonin and Noradrenaline in the first place (through genetics), even after a couple of 'sessions' the risk of episodic suicide is great.

In the case of stimulants like Speed or Cocaine, the Serotonin and Dopamine levels can dip quite harshly after a hit/snort.

In the case of narcotics like Heroin, the Serotonin levels can dip quite badly after a hit.

In the case of hallucinogens like Pot, Trips (LSD) or Ecs, it's mostly Noradrenaline, but Serotonin levels can vary quite a bit.

What sh!ts me further, is that I see children of former 'users' these days (in this following generation) whose brain neurotransmitters have probably been altered because of their parents' drug-taking. It's all one big giant cock-up!

There is no blood, urine or hair test to detect levels of Serotonin, Noradrenaline (aka Norepinephrine), Dopamine, Phenylethylamine, Acetylcholine, GABA etc.

I have to administer a HOD Test (Uni Saskatchewan), Moods Questionnaie (Computer-scored), MMPI-IV (Uni Minnesota) via questions to assess levels of the above.

And when drug users are doing any test, they're probably thinking that my professional fee could have been used on their next 'hit'

Motivation to get off drugs is usually very poor unless they've reach 'rock-bottom' or that a friend/relative has taken over control (-again, after reaching rock-bottom).

[hamiltonau]

interesting post Terry, had heard a few similar things about those drugs and as a 'rehabilitated' eccy user (lived in Holland for a few years..oddly pot not huge with locals over there but pills..wow, very popular at least in the early naughties).

has there been any studies dont on long term effects? i remember reading something about short term memory loss but that mainly there was a lack of research in the field. Apparently your natural serotonin levels do drop with frequent use but after abstaining for years it should climb back up to previous normal levels?

[GTR-N1]

Yes, Serotonin levels can go back up with abstension from THC and so long as the liver's production of precursor l-Tryptophan and Vitamin B3 is not damaged.

It can be damaged momentarily through alcohol and simple sugars too.

Or it can be damaged permanently through the use of LSD (aka Trips) or Crack-Cocaine and some other 'designers'.

LIVER >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> BRAIN STEM (Circle of Willis) >>>>>>>>>>> AMYGDALA >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PINEAL

l-Tryptophan, Vit B3, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SEROTONIN >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> MELATONIN

l-Tryptophan >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> DOPAMINE & NORADRENALINE

Sorry for the crude table ^ ^ ^

Lack of Acetylcholine &/or Serotonin can lead to loss of short-term memory. And also for Bipolar people, lack of Folic Acid, Vit B12 &/or allergy/sensitivity to Gluten

* Lack of Serotonin > either Shyness/Withdrawal or Paranoia/Aggression

* Lack of Dopamine > Psychosis/Lack of sense of time

* Lack of Noradrenaline > Major Depression (introversion type)

* Lack of B12/Folic Acid and Gluten sensitivity > Bipolar (manic depression) of the more common type

* Alcohol or drugs can lead to episodes of suicide attempts usually within 18 hrs.

[blk180]

Meh if it was me there are much less painful ways to die, when i was a train guard i saw what was left of a couple of jumpers and i would say they had a very painful last 3-4mins before they died.

Most Guards i know would chose not to check after a jumper go's under the train. But i dont really care i for one would only bother going off if it was the weekend.

[Marsss]

Meh if it was me there are much less painful ways to die, when i was a train guard i saw what was left of a couple of jumpers and i would say they had a very painful last 3-4mins before they died.

Most Guards i know would chose not to check after a jumper go's under the train. But i dont really care i for one would only bother going off if it was the weekend.

LOL you weren't hugged much as a child were you?

At least you're perfect for the job

[hamiltonau]

@ terry, but do E's damage you permanently?

@ blk, you were a central guard? for how long? how many fatalities did you have? what kind of public servant are you if your not accepting paid leave when its offered?

i dont mind the work but i im not in love with it enough to turn up when they will give me the same money to chill out home for a bit, are you one of those guards who would go up to the assigner when your on standby and ask for work? lol, buff.

[GTR-N1]

@ terry, but do E's damage you permanently?

MDMA probably won't do permanent damage so long as the person doesn't already have a genetic deficiency.

If the person does, then I'm afraid risk of permanent damage is quite high.

The thing I feel is super-tragic:- the person can pass the damage down to his/her offspring.

[blk180]

@ blk, you were a central guard? for how long? how many fatalities did you have? what kind of public servant are you if your not accepting paid leave when its offered?

i dont mind the work but i im not in love with it enough to turn up when they will give me the same money to chill out home for a bit, are you one of those guards who would go up to the assigner when your on standby and ask for work? lol, buff.

Nope im a lazy Driver these days, i dont work in central so i never see an assigner much better, then again dont get many standbys anymore ethier frist few years where best one job a fortnight lol

[hamiltonau]

ah no wonder you put in for drivers copping it worse, i cant argue with that re suicides but we guards can still be exposed to a bit of grief if its a messy one.

We also get a lot more stuff thrown/spat at us

and terry, how do you know if your DNA is susceptible to mdma? how large is that risk? what kind of damage do the offspring have? just bad memory retention or possible psychosis? thats all my kid needs with the relatives he has..