Hypergear Turbochargers and High flow Services Development thread

[Rolls]

I bet the atr43g3 is making almost 540nm by 3400rpm anyway so no.

[hypergear]

i dont mean to be a great turbo expert but looking back at post #1980 and comparing that to the new graphs

atr43g3 made peak torque of 843nm @ 4100rpm and 291kw atw peak @ 5500rpm 21psi

ss1 pu made peak torque of 540nm @ 3400rpm -4500rpm?? and 290kw atw peak @ 5500rpm 20psi?

is it worth a little better spool compared to the higher torque?

Different dyno read differently.

[Harey]

To me the G1 is an RB20 suited turbo.

I wouldn't bother using one on a 2.5L I would go up one size for the extra headroom as there is little to pick between the power delivery of the SS1.

You do realise the point right? Using a turbo of this size would mean no Z32 air flow meter or larger injectors would be required. Huge $$ saving. Its great to have all different options to give the customer choice.

[Harey]

yeah this second turbo is great i was not a fan of the ss1 as it was too responsive and rolled off way to much, this has the perfect balance and is doing it with easy, no trickery in the housing re boost control etc... exhaust manifold pressure was nice and low.... THIS WOULD BE MY CHOICE as a bolt on for rb25... it literally is making 260 as easy as pie.... would be a nice 22psi turbo for E85 on a stocker 300+ with killer response.

Yup point taken regarding the SS1 falling away. My only point is that the SS1 still has an extra 400rpm of response. My SS1 has 20psi by 3200rpm whereas this needs over 3600rpm to get to 15 or 20psi (both 9 sec ramp rates).

I do think its a great overall turbo though but you do loose response for the gain in top end. I do like the sound of lower exhaust manifold pressures though. Whats the deal with the boost falling away on both boost settings? Tao's setup doesnt normally do that.

Other point is the way it hits torque looks very sudden and like it might be hard to get the power down to the road.

BTW Trent I am ready for a tune, sent you guys an sms. I know your going to WTAC but keen to book in for next week if possible

[wolverine]

You do realise you could run the SS1 to the limit of the stock injectors/afm and get pretty much the same result.

To me that is the point.

[hypergear]

Yup point taken regarding the SS1 falling away. My only point is that the SS1 still has an extra 400rpm of response. My SS1 has 20psi by 3200rpm whereas this needs over 3600rpm to get to 15 or 20psi (both 9 sec ramp rates).

I do think its a great overall turbo though but you do loose response for the gain in top end. I do like the sound of lower exhaust manifold pressures though. Whats the deal with the boost falling away on both boost settings? Tao's setup doesnt normally do that.

I think Trent got mixed up with the models, I believe he was referring to the G1 or the original SS1PU with small housing. Also you need to refer to the yellow boost line, the red one opened too earliy without boost controller. This one's making 20psi by 3350 which is about the same to the SS1's response on my original read out.

Its drives like SS1 that makes more power and torque. This one didn't have wastegate controller in the design, I sort wanted it to bleed down as it loses heat that way.

[STATUS]

Yup point taken regarding the SS1 falling away. My only point is that the SS1 still has an extra 400rpm of response. My SS1 has 20psi by 3200rpm whereas this needs over 3600rpm to get to 15 or 20psi (both 9 sec ramp rates).

I do think its a great overall turbo though but you do loose response for the gain in top end. I do like the sound of lower exhaust manifold pressures though. Whats the deal with the boost falling away on both boost settings? Tao's setup doesnt normally do that.

Other point is the way it hits torque looks very sudden and like it might be hard to get the power down to the road.

BTW Trent I am ready for a tune, sent you guys an sms. I know your going to WTAC but keen to book in for next week if possible

yup but the G1 (not ss1 sorry) made 20 psi @ 3000rpm something but made negligible more power and torque down there compare to the new turbo on less boost... no point having response if the power and torque cant really be felt, after driving both i would take the latest incarnation over the preceding turbos it fells MUCH stronger rowing through the gears and will take a thrashing without the inherent heat issues caused by too much exhaust pressure which is prevalent on the smaller versions.

If you got some one to drive both who was after 250rwkw or 260rwkw i can guarantee everyone would choose the later based on its drive-ability.

[STATUS]

i dont mean to be a great turbo expert but looking back at post #1980 and comparing that to the new graphs

atr43g3 made peak torque of 843nm @ 4100rpm and 291kw atw peak @ 5500rpm 21psi

ss1 pu made peak torque of 540nm @ 3400rpm -4500rpm?? and 290kw atw peak @ 5500rpm 20psi?

is it worth a little better spool compared to the higher torque?

no rb will make 843nm unless its making over 800hp

[blah_blah]

Sorry to be a noob,

But can someone explain to me in lamens terms 9 sec ramp v 12 sec ramp and why one is used and sometimes the other? And how do you tell from a dyno graph which ramp rate is used?

Just want to compare the SS1 Prototype to say Harey's SS-1 dyno graph and my own stock turbo dyno graph from Trent's dyno.

[hypergear]

^^

They are in page 73 cheers

[Harey]

You do realise you could run the SS1 to the limit of the stock injectors/afm and get pretty much the same result.

To me that is the point.

So run an SS1 at ~14psi with 3-400rpm worse response, sounds like a great option...

I would much rather run a smaller turbo at ~18psi to make the same peak power but with better response.

[Harey]

yup but the G1 (not ss1 sorry) made 20 psi @ 3000rpm something but made negligible more power and torque down there compare to the new turbo on less boost... no point having response if the power and torque cant really be felt, after driving both i would take the latest incarnation over the preceding turbos it fells MUCH stronger rowing through the gears and will take a thrashing without the inherent heat issues caused by too much exhaust pressure which is prevalent on the smaller versions.

If you got some one to drive both who was after 250rwkw or 260rwkw i can guarantee everyone would choose the later based on its drive-ability.

Bit confused why you would even compare the G1 turbo to the SS1.5?? The G1 is designed to max out at 230rwkw so you can use the factory injectors and afm. The G1 will not make 250-260rwkw. On the other hand the SS1.5 is designed to make 280rwkw with larger injectors and a Z32 afm etc. I am sure the SS1.5 does feel much stronger

[blah_blah]

Hrmm expected pricing and completion of the SS1 Prototype Stao?

You can PM me if you wish.

[wolverine]

So run an SS1 at ~14psi with 3-400rpm worse response, sounds like a great option...

I would much rather run a smaller turbo at ~18psi to make the same peak power but with better response.

Forget the boost graph and look at how much power it is making with the airflow provided by each turbo.

[dynafit]

Whats your price for the SS1-PU Prototype with 14psi actuator? I'm keen as!

PM if you want

[Harey]

Just noticed the SS1 PU Prototype goes from 265-530Nm of Torque from 3200-3800rpm!! That must be a serious hit but would be hard to get traction. Just noticed it hit 25psi!

The SS2 definitely looses a few rpm of response to this SS1.5 but the SS2 holds boost steady high in the rev range whereas this SS1.5 drops off boost. The SS2 was not run as hard as this and made ~315rwkw with the same intercooler and no overheating issues. Keen to see some more SS2 results.

Between the G1, SS1, SS1.5, SS2 you pretty much have the whole bolt on range covered. Well done!

[rondofj]

why are people running these turbos at 17-18psi and not 22psi?? Whats the go with the dude above asking for a 14psi actuator, why not a 22psi one?? confused...

[dynafit]

why are people running these turbos at 17-18psi and not 22psi?? Whats the go with the dude above asking for a 14psi actuator, why not a 22psi one?? confused...

22psi actuator means you cannot go below 22psi. I intend on having a low and hi boost setting, one for driving around as daily the other for playing with. Having a 14psi actuator means im allowed a minimum boost of 14psi while having a maximum boost of whatever i want (probably will be around 21psi).

[Rolls]

Yeah if you are making under 300kw I don't see any reason to limit the boost providing you don't run into bad heat soak issues from running it pasts its efficiency. Tune it rich and conservative so its safe and everyone is happy.

Recommend just one boost setting, just use less throttle if you wan't less torque.

Edited August 3, 2011 by Rolls

[Harey]

why are people running these turbos at 17-18psi and not 22psi?? Whats the go with the dude above asking for a 14psi actuator, why not a 22psi one?? confused...

Have a look at the boost curves, the only turbo to hold a flat 22psi would be the SS2 or the ATR43G3 or larger. You can see Tao is trying to run 25psi on the SS1 PU Prototype but it drops down to under 20psi by redline anyway.