Wolf 3D V4 vs PowerFC

[Bl4cK32]

the wolf is laptop programmable.....

[N I B]

You can use any valve from the importers for an average cost of $20.

[Kinks]

Originally posted by GTS-t VSPEC

Joel, Yeah it really good, we have set mine up to chase a higher boost at low rpm, then taper off to a safe boost level at higher rpm, provides much better mid-range response that way:D

This is what my bleed valve does, and 11psi @ redline means the ceramic turbo's shaft speed will never get really high. However, it would be nice to have 1 bar at redline too

[GTS-t VSPEC]

Kinks, I doubt your bleeder can chase a target boost pressure:D

The Wolf Laptop software is amongst the best I've seen, very easy to use and has a decent Windows interface.

[Cubes]

I think he was playing around a little stating how the boost drop actually is what he wants and is good for the motor..

Its similiar to my old bleeder which I had set at around 16 and at one stage 17psi until around 5000rpm where it would taper off to 12.5psi.

I then slapped on the EBC and it felt slower as it was making less boost in the mid range so the kick that used to turn the rear wheels in second dissapeared

[Ustasa]

Fella’s just be careful with pumping too much boost in the mid range. With most street engines that’s where the cylinder pressure is the highest ie. 3000-4500rpm. I can understand the theory behind it if you have a turbo you don’t want to over speed, but what the optimum setting would be is to slightly increase boost as the volumetric efficiency of the engine declines. That way you keep ramming air into the engine even when the stock heads/cams give up the ghost. You also keep the ignition timing down and make more power by pumping in more boost. Of course trying to shove 20psi into a stock rb25det won’t do it much good and there are octane/detonation considerations but you can understand the approach.

[Roy]

Also if you have enough power to warrant aftermarket management then its fair to asssume then on an Rb20/25 you may perhaps need a bigger Z32/Q45 AFM... so by using Wolf's MAP sensor you safve yourself some $$$.

A question for those using the Wolf, does the air temp on the handset read accurate?

[Cubes]

According to the software you can calibrate all of the sensors.

So say for example at 18 degrees the air temp sensor reads right there is no correction in the calibration table then at 40degree's the air temp sensor is out say 2 degree's you simply slap -+2 degree's in the 40degree column.

Should check out the software it is really easy to use.

I would have no idea how to fiddle with ignition and fuel maps yet but it looks pretty straight forward.

[N I B]

It is easy to use so as more shops get some time with them their will be good results all over the country.

[dojobi]

The LS1 boys get more power when they go for MAFless tunes (ie MAP). This could be the case for us too. Any pioneers want to try it out?

[GTS-t VSPEC]

I run MAP, but it's always hard to quantify the benefit. I think any removal of air-flow restriction is good, plus I didn't need to buy a Z32 AFM:D

[ed]

too bad they don't make one for the 34's

[GTS-t VSPEC]

Ed, I'm sure that one will be coming out, but there releasing them on the popularity of the car, unfortunately there aren't many R34's around yet. It is possible to wire a Wolf to an R34, but it's not plug'n'play, as you have to re-wire a new connector to the R34 loom.

[ed]

i know...i'd rather plug'n'play...

or if they made an adaptor loom for the 34 to use the 33 wolf plug'n'play unit

[GTS-t VSPEC]

Drop them an email, you get a repsonse on when they plan on releasing one:D

[Cubes]

Its not the case Mic33R.

It will be because they have had a tune. Not because they got rid of the MAF.

There is a RB25/RB20 dyno compare that has Gregpin's R33 running a MAF and a powerfc with around 200rwkw and also freebagins which is also making around 200rwkw. The Rb20 is making 190rwkw.. besides the point Gregpins power curve is a lot smoother where as freebagins is a little lumpy.

Do a search.

[Sydneykid]

Hi guys so many posts on new thread while I was attending to some Bathurst business. Let me try and catch up...

Firstly, the Apexi V-Max with over 1,000 bhp ran a 8.75 using a Power FC and AFM's. So I doubt that running AFM's is going to be a limiting factor (ie; any restriction) for people on this forum.

Moving on to technical deficiencies, I have found a few in the Wolf 's I have tried previously...

1. The ignition mapping has 16 load points (instead of 20)

2. The injection mapping has 16 load points (instead of 20)

3. 4 ignition outputs (this means you have to fire 2 plugs at once on a 6 cylinder). This means there is 50% less time for the coils to recharge, at high RPM this can create misfire problems. Also firing twice as often they run hotter eg; I had to remove the plug cover on an engine I tried with a Wolf.

4. 4 injector outputs (this means you have to fire 2 injectors at once on a 6 cylinder). This means the fuel economy simply can not be as good as a full 6 cylinder sequential firing ECU.

5. Engine water temp compensation is every 2 degrees (not 1 degree) for both fuel and ignition.

6. Engine inlet air temp compensation is every 2 degrees (not 1 degree) for both fuel and ignition.

7. Ignition increments every 0.35 degree, not every 0.1 degree.

8. Base map, I had trouble getting the car to run well enough on the supplied base map to get it through traffic to the dyno. Plus, in my humble opinion, the ignition and fuel maps where too close to the limit for driving any length of time. I have never had either of these problems with a Power FC (maybe I have just been lucky).

9. A couple of times I have also encountered errors on the TPS circuit, which occurred when we ran the remote 3 bar MAP sensor. Yes, we used the supplied wiring harness. I cured the problem by running insulated wiring, but it took a few hours of testing to isolate the problem. We never experienced anything like this with a Power FC.

10. The Wolf processor is 16 bit at 16 mhz, not 32 bit at 33 mhz. This makes it 412.5% slower in processing.

11. We haven’t found anyway to get the dashboard warning system to function as it does when the standard ECU (or Power FC) is used.

12. The Power FC has idle compensation/speed up for air con, power steer and electrical load whilst the Wolf only has air con.

There are other examples, but I think my point is made.

Now I know I am setting myself up here for Steve-SST to jump on me and say that the spec of Wolf ECU he is now using is different/updated. Or that my knowledge is deficient and he knows of ways to get around these things. But I can only go on our experiences and I am not a Wolf dealer, so maybe I don’t get all the latest and greatest. But I am not a Power FC dealer either and I don’t have these issues with them.

To sum up, I can’t see anyway that an equivalent Wolf (with all the Power FC features) costs less than a Power FC installed and ready to tune. Plus there are risks, which simply aren’t there with a Power FC.

Hope that adds to the discussion.

[JimX]

Thanks for that info Gary. It's the small stuff like you listed above that sets different ECU's apart - You could have a "perfect" ECU with infinite resolution, but it would start to become less useful due to something small but significant like having a processor operating at half the speed of its competitor with less resolution, or not fully compensating for all loads at idle.

It would be interesting to see if the current Wolf has addressed all the above, so I guess we just sit and wait for Steve-SST's reply

Whatever the case, I'm sure the Wolf will eventually get all the above resolved if it hasn't done so already. It's just a question of when.

Btw, I read a review of the PowerFC recently and they were unable to find any menus with temperature compensation for air or water. Was it just that they didn't know where to find it, or can you not do it with the hand controller?

[ed]

Hey Gary,

What are the risks you speak of with a Wolf3D that "simply aren't there with a PFC?"

Ed

[JimX]

Ed, are you serious?! He listed at least 5 - Bad base map, no dash light warning system, potential overheating of coils, errors on the TPS circuit, and incomplete idle compensation.

At least one of those is definitely still there, that being the lack of dash board warning light (no knock sensor). The rest may have been fixed by now or may be soon, we don't know yet until someone replies here.