Anyone done a mid to low 9 second 1/4 with totally stock internals, can it be done??

[RIPS]

We did use a 60hp of gas for the 10.5. I havn't got any recent dyno prinouts but last time out it made just on 400rwkw @ 5000rpm and about 680ft lbs of torque at the engine with 60hp of gas. We had a singe T4 on a stock exhaust manifold, 3 inch pipe, 45mm progate. Gotta get this thing a diet....BAD

[RIPS]

Sorry , that was 680nm at the engine......doh

[Steve]

Matt, says in an earlier post it is totally stock bottom with 300,000kms and rings and bearing only.

[Hiroshima Screamer]

RIPS , Got any pics of this beast ?

[whatsisname]

Out of interest exactly what type of piston are you using & what (if anything) has been done to them to cope with the power level you have to run 10's?

[whatsisname]

Steve,

Oops missed that bit! Thanks for pointing that out. I take it stock RB30E pistons are pretty damn good then!?

[EVOIV]

Interesting post, although I do find it very difficult to believe that such a car can run so fast with stock internals and weighing so much. How much boost are you using RIPS? I have never heard any car in Japan running so fast with stock internals...and I thought the Japanese would be up there with the best? Then again, Japan doesn't use NOS either.

[hippy]

how much weight has been taken off the car?

[Sydneykid]

Hi RIPS, this is a good thread. Let me see if I have got it right....

A 10.5 at 127 mph would need a 1.6/1.7 for 60’, that’s a lot of traction. To do a 9.5 we are talking a 1.4/1.5 for 60’ and 150 mph.

Keep these numbers in mind.

It's a standard RB30E bottom end (say $400)

It has the 4wd adaptors on it to fit the 4wd sump and front diff and drive shaft, so the block is a little more rigid than standard (say $1000)

It has a standard RB25DE top end on it (say $1200)

Standard head gasket (RB25 or RB30?) but may have o'ringed head and or block (say $300)

So the compression ratio is probably around 8 to 1

Don't know what sort of studs/ bolts used, could be fully ARP studded top and bottom (say $1,500)

Balance all the up & down and round & round bits (say $300)

Runs a T4 (E, S, R ?) at unknown boost (but could be really high as the compression ratio is low enough to run 2 bar easy) (say $3,000)

Unspecified inlet manifold, could be Greddy (say $1,400)

Unspecified injectors, around 850 cc’s needed (say ($1,200)

Unspecified fuel pump, Bosch 044 maybe (say $400)

Unspecified engine management, could be Motec M8000 (say $4,000)

Unspecified tyres (could be MT's, TA's, 32R’s, 540’s, FR’s or 555's, they are DOT approved) (Say $2,000)

Unspecified flywheel and clutch, could be a triple plate 5.5” Tilton (say $3,000)

Unspecified suspension, could be HKS drag spec (say $3,000)

Labour cost to assemble and fit (say $800)

Tuning (say $500)

That’s $23K ‘ish,

Me, I’d spend another $1,200 and stick some H or I beam rods in it and $1,100 for a set of forged pistons. Seems cheap compared to the $23K already spent.

Past experience tells me that at 1,250 kgs (putting the GTS4 on a diet looses say 200 kgs) a 4wd will need around 550 rwkw to crack a 9.5 with sticky road legal tyres.

At that sort of power and traction loads, say goodbye to the gearbox (3rd gear will die the first day out). Diff’s are going to be an issue, particularly the rear one. Driveshafts are certainly suspect at anything over 450 rwkw. Plus it will need some form of torque split control, otherwise it will be very dangerous to drive.

Let’s add $14,000 for a Hollinger with bellhousing, shifter and tailshaft, $2,000 for a rear diff, $600 for an ATTESA controller, $400 each for the upgraded drive shafts, sub 10’s needs a cage, seat and a parachute say $4,000, I don’t think a T04 is gunna get 500 rwkw, so a cheap turbo is gunna be needed, say a T88-34D at $4,000, and it will need a manifold $2000.

What are we up to ………. $50K plus the cost of the car to start with, yep that sounds about right. Makes the $2,300 for the security of forged internals seem cheap, maybe that why nobody else has bothered.

But hey RIPS go for it, it may never be equalled.

[BU5TER]

And when you say DOT tyre is that a radial treaded tyre or a Mickey Thompson street, dot tyre?

[GTR-Ben]

Sydney kid... i think you will find the car dosn't have half the things you listed.

Runs a Link ECU.

He makes his own intkae manifolds.

Tyres can be seen in the pic.

Funny thread. Us kiwis just know better :shake:

[BU5TER]

hahaha yeah you know how to leave out details like NOS and non radial tyres are used hahahaha

[GTR-Ben]

Originally posted by Buster

hahaha yeah you know how to leave out details like NOS and non radial tyres are used hahahaha

:bahaha:

Plastic windows too, but apart from that isn't much done to it.

Those pics are from the Performance car web site.. some info on the car was wrong there so im not sure what it was actually using when it did the 10. Rips will inform you im sure.

[Steve]

I dont understand why so many people get all sinical.

This guy is pushing stock internals - well hey its good news for a lot of people that perhaps were thinking of pushing their car a bit further, but were holding off because they didnt have the internals done?

No 10 second car is going to be cheap, but in this case RIPS is using a GTS4 to showcase how a well built RB30 can push alot further than many believe - Good on you RIPS, I like reading about examples like yours, pushing the envelope.

Then again, the kiwis have been miles ahead of aust for some time when it comes to highpo cars, plus they cost half the price over there. Bloody import duty.

RIPS, werent you selling full RB30 long motor built with RB26head and manifold and plenum for like 3.5k or something? I doubt anywhere in aust would be able to offer that.

[DoughBoy]

There's an old thread of this motor over on SDU here. As well as a ton of other threads on this car + it's performance. Going by the dyno graph it was on ~1.5bar. Pretty good times though, reminds me of the Pac Performance guys ages ago when they would boost a stock motor and get some good times.... for a run or two.

Would be interesting to see what sort of lifespan the driveline would have on a circuit day, of course the power output would be considerably lower considering NOS couldn't be used.

[Oyabun]

Interesting posts ..

My R32 GTSt running a RB26dett has stock pistons and stock bottom end (however larger sump and head work)

The block I would have expected to buckle after about 400rwkw's, and interesting to hear the standard head and gasket is holding the pressure .. good one!

Damn good time and very effective setup .. to be commended, nos and slicks included.

cheers,

Oyabun.

[RIPS]

Hey, thanks for the positive comments.

Sydney kid, I wish I had 1/2 the stuff on your list.

To clarify a couple.

Started with a totally stock, unmodified GTS4 done 150,000km, weight 1450kg.

Have done NO suspension work.

Have done NO wheel alignment, just what it had, probably not even close to ideal for drags.

Have No torque split controler, just stock set up

Grabbed a 300,000km RB30e shortblock, did NOT balance it, did NOT crack test anything, just cleaned it, put new rings and bearings ONLY, NO mods to pistons or rods, NO shot peening etc.

Got a 120,000 RB25de engine, pulled the head off, did NOT touch it, just prepared the head gasket face, NO o-ringing on block or head, bolted it all up with the stock s/hand bolts and a stock RB25 head gasket. C/R 8.3

Added a R.I.P.S 4wd adapter and put on the stock RB20det 4wd sump/diff assm.

Used a R.I.P.S steel flywheel and a s/hand tilton tripple plate clutch kit.

Totally stock gearbox/driveshafts/diffs/cv's etc

Runs a GTR plenim adapted to the RB25de manifold and a VH45 throttle body.

Runs a single fogger nozzle with 60hp jets

Only weight reduction was the passengers door and the passengers seat and rear seats. NO other weight reduction, still has A/C, stereo, carpets, full dash, heater, console etc

Runs a stock RB20det exhaust manifold with a t4 running 1.5 bar with a 45mm progate.

Runs a stock GTR fuel pump and a small external pump for the NOS. runs 6 X 550cc injectors only.

Runs quick time 8.5 inch tyres on the rear only, 235-45-18's on the front, problem is keeping the front wheels on the ground so don't need front quick times yet right? ran a 1.508 60 ft time.

I just got sick of all the "so called experts" who just happen to run big retail shops, telling everyone that you can't do this and you can't do that, even had 1 real well known shop tell a friend that he needed a $20k engine package to do a high 12 in a GTS4! They just wanted to tick boxes in a cataloge, take your money and do no development at all.

I thought 12's on stock bits would be easy enough, then we went for 11's, now we're doing mid 10's and we have NO issues with the engine being reliable or undrivable, in fact it is so strong in the mid range on the road it's not funny.

I'm sure we can get a 9 out of the same motor with out touching it, and our new car will run the same engine with stock internals and that WILL run low 9's, high 8's...........TRUE P.S. wind up your bits, if they pop, it's not going to break the bank....My 2c

[Steve]

Can I ask what redline you are running? Also, where is peak torque and what sort of power band do you have?

Even better still, do you have a dynograph?

Lastly, how does it behave on the street?

Cheers

Steve

[damslo]

thats the way boy keep those internals until they break and then put another one in for next to nothing and still go skidding.Oh yes and ask rips how cool it is to be able to drive to the strip do drags all day long and then drive the ferk on home again. NIIIIIICE .!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[RIPS]

Steve, 7200rpm, Peak torque is all in by 3200rpm and it just flat lines all the way accross the graph. It is unreal on the road. Nail it in 4th at 3000rpm and it just snots away HARD. If you go to near the top of the page you see a link to an old dyno graph where we made 342rwkw @ 5000rpm and then the clutch let go, now we go over 400rwkw by 5500rpm with more low down torque than a good V8, it really is any gear, any speed, just pulls....

Thanks for flying the flag DAMSLO, your 2 year old stock internaled RB25det race engine will be due for a freshen up soon, just keep it under that 8000rpm limit I put on it and it should be due maybe in another 2 seasons??? What did you end up winding out of that?? 330rwkw ????.......Rob