Aug Deca - Wrap Up

[Russman]

Inch or mile Dane... Inch or mile.......

[phunky_monkey]

Next time gadget...next time

[Belsil80]

Well done Chris! Smashed it by a pretty big margin! Lot's of 50's there!

Thanks Ryan for letting me win RWD! One day I'll beat you for real haha.

It doesn't matter if you win by and inch or a mile....... blah blah blah....

there was no letting you win?! Plus, you cant deny 3rd outright.

Well done to the winners in each class but especially Chris Stacey for taking it outright. You still one it with a WD!

Standout times: Antony with a 36 on the pan & Shane Janssen with a 25 on the mini wang. There are a lot of new names taking it to the lead cars...

and there will be no more running streets. they are fun to not care about but shit to go fast on.

Next time gadget...next time

what are you talking about? you beat me

Oh and Coronas and winning deca... big call.. care to make a wager?

[phunky_monkey]

Haha I thought of you as I typed it, but it was just too fitting

[evade]

hey dane your 180 still not finished??

[phunky_monkey]

Yep Aaron, it's back in my hands and pretty much finished. Just neds to the tune completed (has a base tune in it at the moment), and a few little bits and pieces sorted like a sticking clutch etc. I wanted to do give the Rex a run though, and the 180 is getting sorted next week so will be at HH

[R32_GODZILLA]

Congrats Russ, great work! Way to represent the rb20! Inspiration to pump more money in my car I'm pretty happy with 14th on my first outing, few top 10 times, one 44pointer - I'll be back in November to pull off some better times and rattle some cages!

[phunky_monkey]

Your car looked great out there mate, very nice indeed.

I took a few in/on car vids of my car if anyone's interested:

[Ant97GTR]

Congrats to the winners and grinners

Good work Chris

[achoo]

Congrats Russ, great work! Way to represent the rb20! Inspiration to pump more money in my car I'm pretty happy with 14th on my first outing, few top 10 times, one 44pointer - I'll be back in November to pull off some better times and rattle some cages!

15th...

[KamikazeNinja34]

So.

DECA.

It needs more GTR.

Now i just gotta learn how to drive skidpan, and get stockies and a cams by November...

[Birds]

BIRDS have a look at this

Tell me what this man should have done from about the 24-30 second mark. If you think it would be quicker to change to second and then back to first then you're dreaming. If you put the clutch in you start to slow down, if you back off early you lose time. Please explain.

The other thing is that in a sub 30 second run of a motorkhana, the extra bit of heat you get in your tyres from a bit of wheel spin early may well be worth more time in grip than you lose initially. I don't know that it is but I bet you don't know that it isn't.

I think you've made some good points but perhaps you are basing too much of your theory on circuit racing. But even in circuit racing you have those moments where you just nudge your rev limiter a moment before your braking point where it is not worth going to the next gear. How do you handle these situations?

Without knowing the course he was trying to complete, I can't accurately explain what he should have done better but I'll try. If he wasn't supposed to go around the right of that middle cone, the one he went to the left of at 21 seconds, then he should have given himself a wider apex to the left of the 3rd cone. Instead he hairpinned the thing, costing him time and causing himself to lose traction and continue losing traction after straightening up, which in turn helped him to hit the limiter in 1st so quickly and cover about the same distance an Hyundai Excel would in the same time. With a wider line he also could have grabbed 2nd and taken that 3rd cone corner with a bit of clutch work in 2nd, setting himself up for more straight line speed after exiting. 1st gear may feel faster in this kind of situation but it's not, it's way too short and jerky to ensure a smooth run, particularly if he's running the standard RB20 gearbox. I doubt he would have been off boost in 2nd gear...these courses are too spaced apart for that to happen and he would need a large turbo. I would want my car to be very unresponsive/laggy to justify staying in 1st for most of that skidpan course. His launch was pretty good IMO, not a huge amount of wheelspin.

I'm not going to debate the heat thing because there's too many variables in that one (and I don't hold a degree in physics). You could well be right here, but I will suggest that, whilst heating the tyres might help with a short 30 second motorkhana course, this is also short enough for wheelspin to bother your overall time like in a drag race.

I definitely agree there are occasions where it's more beneficial to stay in a gear than change up. I don't think there's anything wrong with touching the limiter, particularly if it's by accident and you're more focused on the track than changing gears...but my original statement was "And people sitting on the limiter on the skidpan". Keyword being sitting! Now I never claimed to be a good driver, you only have to look at the DECA results to see that (though in my defence, my car is a stock R33 with 50% tread on el cheapo 205 tyres and I really don't want to break my daily driver), but I do know a bit. And you cannot say 'don't tell us how we can improve our lap times because we've done more DECAs than you'. I'd take advice from a 5 year old if he/she had the logic to back it up. And ffs everyone, this started off as a two liner opinion that was very quickly blown out to be something more than passing comment on what I thought was overall a fantastic fun filled day. I'm considering putting "DECA IS ABOUT THE FUN" in my signature so people can stop misperceiving that I want to nazi this event into strict motor racing. Cheers for posting the results Ryan.

[TTCorona]

FYI Birds - that video was the same map as the second battle we did on the weekend

[Birds]

I don't remember the maps from the weekend man...my dicey memory was having trouble storing them just before driving them. Hope I wasn't the only one sitting in queue with the piece of paper thinking 'fark fark which way do I go?'!

They were terrific layouts btw organisers, lots of fun.

[phunky_monkey]

Hope I wasn't the only one sitting in queue with the piece of paper thinking 'fark fark which way do I go?'!

Every single time

[Birds]

Someone had a great idea earlier, which was to put some sort of marker or number on the cones so people can remember. But I guess half the fun of it is the wrong directions. I remember unnecessarily going all the way around a cone at the back of the track when I didn't need to go near the thing at all. Nice videos phunky...where did you get the camera from? And where was it mounted inside the car?

[phunky_monkey]

It's a Vio POV1 camera. I bought it from the 'states but racerecall.com sell them here. It's a great little camera which I'm still learning to use.

The in car shot was on the back passenger window. The front window is better but couldn't do it with people jumping in and out.

[TTCorona]

Without knowing the course he was trying to complete, I can't accurately explain what he should have done better but I'll try. If he wasn't supposed to go around the right of that middle cone, the one he went to the left of at 21 seconds, then he should have given himself a wider apex to the left of the 3rd cone. Instead he hairpinned the thing, costing him time and causing himself to lose traction and continue losing traction after straightening up, which in turn helped him to hit the limiter in 1st so quickly and cover about the same distance an Hyundai Excel would in the same time. With a wider line he also could have grabbed 2nd and taken that 3rd cone corner with a bit of clutch work in 2nd, setting himself up for more straight line speed after exiting. 1st gear may feel faster in this kind of situation but it's not, it's way too short and jerky to ensure a smooth run, particularly if he's running the standard RB20 gearbox. I doubt he would have been off boost in 2nd gear...these courses are too spaced apart for that to happen and he would need a large turbo. I would want my car to be very unresponsive/laggy to justify staying in 1st for most of that skidpan course. His launch was pretty good IMO, not a huge amount of wheelspin.

I'm not going to debate the heat thing because there's too many variables in that one (and I don't hold a degree in physics). You could well be right here, but I will suggest that, whilst heating the tyres might help with a short 30 second motorkhana course, this is also short enough for wheelspin to bother your overall time like in a drag race.

I definitely agree there are occasions where it's more beneficial to stay in a gear than change up. I don't think there's anything wrong with touching the limiter, particularly if it's by accident and you're more focused on the track than changing gears...but my original statement was "And people sitting on the limiter on the skidpan". Keyword being sitting! Now I never claimed to be a good driver, you only have to look at the DECA results to see that (though in my defence, my car is a stock R33 with 50% tread on el cheapo 205 tyres and I really don't want to break my daily driver), but I do know a bit. And you cannot say 'don't tell us how we can improve our lap times because we've done more DECAs than you'. I'd take advice from a 5 year old if he/she had the logic to back it up. And ffs everyone, this started off as a two liner opinion that was very quickly blown out to be something more than passing comment on what I thought was overall a fantastic fun filled day. I'm considering putting "DECA IS ABOUT THE FUN" in my signature so people can stop misperceiving that I want to nazi this event into strict motor racing. Cheers for posting the results Ryan.

You missed my point about the experience of the people at DECA.

Someone who has experience in something and has the results shows that they know what they are doing...

It doesn't matter what your logic is, nor does it have anything to do with the physics of it...

As a mechanical engineer myself I think I can say, you are thinking way to much like an engineer...

You are looking into the theory and dynamics of it way to much...

Hence my comment about the experience playing a part...

Motorsport all comes down to just doing it, trying different things and working out what works best...

Even in a motorsport as precise as Formula 1, there are no two Teams/Drivers that attack a certain circuit or even a particular corner in the same way...

Like you say, you are more than welcome to have your opinion. No one is taking that away from you..

I simply admire the confidence you have in your opinion to be able to come on here and tell people how they should be driving.

Considering that the people I was talking about who have competed in DECA for so long have gone on to win things like the Australian Tarmac Challenge and Targa Tasmania events.

And also the same people who hold some of the quickest club level sprint times in the state (and possibly country)

[Birds]

It was indeed an opinion and advice, if people don't want to take it they don't have to and I won't begrudge them for it, but if they question/challenge it on here then I will most certainly defend it until I feel I've been proven incorrect...or I get sick of arguing it...

But like I said, these aren't just my words. These come from someone with experience in it. Not that it matters anyway - as I said before, just because I can't put my advice into my driving behaviour doesn't mean I'm wrong in my advice. And to deny the importance of physics and calculations in motorsport is just ridiculous. This kind of comment spits on everything that goes into Formula 1 racing. If all you do in motorsport is trial and error it until you find out what works, then you are limiting yourself to your own experience and ignoring knowledge that could help you out.

[Belsil80]

edit: this is in response to posts way above. it froze but still posted later??

Birds, you have a very specific answer to what is going on in that vid considering you didnt recognise it as the map we just ran. Its all good and well to talk the talk but for people to take what you are saying on you need to show us also. i like hearing peoples ideas and opinions, thats how you get quicker but mostly i will see who goes quicker and try work out what they did to achieve that. Considering SAU as a club has had the most success at Duttons and ATC (which are large scale 3 day deca/track events) there is a lot you can learn from watching and learning at our Deca Days.

As for the maps, we knew there would be a lot of new people at this event so we chose simple maps. and there was also 1 less map to remember. To help with memorising the maps we post up the event schedual early. The trick is to memorise them on paper and if you are still not sure then watch 1 or 2 runs.

If you had to look around at cones for numbers to work out where you are going you are already going to slow, it needs to be a smooth run and you need to know what is 2 turns ahead.

edit2

after reading your above post you are obviously on another page. now i can be bothered cos i wouldnt know where to start. if i didnt know better id start calling you sputnik. also, what is the names of these race car drivers you work for?