Eoi: R34 Gt-t Brake Upgrade (324mm Rotors)

[SS8_Gohan]

Hi guys,

just trying to guage some interest in a brake upgrade kit i've been talking about with John @ UAS (and with some major help from other very knowledgeable Skyline enthusiasts).

Basically, UAS sell a brake upgrade kit for R33 calipers. It's a caliper adpater to run 324mm rotors (standard is 296mm or there-abouts) and packaged together with some DBA 4000's or DBA 5000's.

http://nismo.com.au/pricelists/pricelist_skylinebrakes.htm

Unfortunately these adapters don't fit/work with R34 calipers and new ones would be need to be made, this is where you guys come in...

Is anyone keen on getting a package together (probably need minimum 10 people) for R34 caliper adapters to run 324mm discs?

Personally i'm leaning towards a R34 upgrade adapter with DBA 5000 series 324mm rotors.

Most people do the basic stuff, like brake cylinder stopper, good fluid, good pads, etc... That's the easier, cheaper stuff, but a combo of...

-Good fluid

-Brake cylinder stopper

-good pads

-Braided Lines

-324mm rotors

should be a damn good package IMO, and doesn't require having to go with expensive Brembo upgrades or change to a G4 caliper but restricted with pad choices. We still keep our stock calipers so still have great pad prices/options.

I take it this would suit some Stagea owners as well, as i'd imagine quite a few would be running GT-T brakes.

So yeah, keen to know your thoughts

cheers,

daniel

Edited August 27, 2009 by SS8_Gohan

[KiwiRS4T]

Yes a good package. Just after I bought my GTT brakes I saw a near new big brake kit consisting of the adapters to move the calipers out, high tensile bolts and 324mm DBA4000 rotors (slotted and heat treated) for $400 (cost the guy $800 new). A good deal as now I don't have to skim and slot the front GTT rotors. Just need a spare weekend to fit them!

In NZ they have to be (but can be) certed so when I have finished this current lot of mods I will get the lot certified.

[fergo308]

Is it worth the hassle for a 14mm increase in diameter? R34 GT-T front discs are 310x30mm. R33 GTS-t are 296x30mm. it's worthwhile for R33 owners,but not for an R34.

If you went up to a 350mm disc (such as for F50 brembos) it'd be worthwhile.

Justin...

Edited August 27, 2009 by fergo308

[SS8_Gohan]

John was saying if you go too big, there are issues when it comes to track/motorsport applications. So you can't go too far.

Yes it's not a huge increase, but if you want to change to better rotors anyway, why not go up where the vast majority of braking is done on the Skylines... the front.

I can see if it's a possibility to go bigger, but the 324mm size gives a nice choice of rotors, being the stock GTR size

[Roy]

STD R34 GTT is 310mm, seriously i think you need to really question what you do with the car and what you expect to get from running a rotor 14mm bigger?

Sure throw an adaptor on, but why not a Brembo/Stoptech/Alcon 332mm rotor, or a B-Spec (CSC) 343mm rotor?

I think this mod to R32 GTSt and S13s is a great mod, but you are going frm a 280mm rotor to a 324mm . 310 to 324mm rotot, i question if its worth the agro and also look at the brackets you posted, The first pic is the 280-324mm bracket. Big diam change an chunky-sturdy bracket. The secons is 296-324mm. You can see the bracket isnt as robust as there isnt as much metal in the bracket. Now imagine how dainty and little metal would be in a bracket for going from 310 to 324mm? Its only a radial change of 7mm. Factor in the bolt hole diam and you will need to clock the caliper forward so that the thing will work

[Wacky Dee]

excuse my ignorance .. but what would be the point of bigger discs if you keep the stock calipers/pads ? Wouldn't the stock calipers/pads braking surface still be the same .. ie. you'd just have an extra unusued part on the new discs, The braking is achieved with the pads being applied to disc surface .. so if the pads are the same (stock) size, what's the point ?!?

[SS8_Gohan]

i was posting pics as a reference, didn't know exactly what i was posting just to give people an idea...

ok, so what if an adapter could be made for 332mm rotors? worth it then?

[Roy]

Best advice i can offer is look for a cheap and readily available supply of larger rotors and go for that. I think John now stocks Stoptech stuff, you can buy it direct from US if you want to play that game. Or you can get 343 gear locally in Melb liek those used on Danes 180SX setup. It may be worthwhile on a larger rotor if the caliper will accept it, which i suspect it may.

Also, braking performance is about two things, heat control and braking torque (assuming tyre grip is the same) Pad area does nothing for braking torque, but does help with heat control. The bigger rotor helps with braking torque and heat control. Going to a larger rotor and retaining the same caliper is often a good value upgrade

[Beer Baron]

yeah I'm with troy. waste of time for 14mm more rotor and as he pointed out as it's only 7mm radius you cannot even space the caliper straight up, you need to clock it to one side with offset brackets. I would say find a cheap rotor, 343mm is a good size and get a packge made of the caliper adapters and hats to suit that rotor, or get them done to suit a 1 piece rotor and just sell brackets and rotor.

like troy said sure it's a good upgrade to go from 280mm to 324mm. but even from the 32 GTR sized and 33 GTST sized 296mm rotors it's marginal as to whether or not it's worth it. but going from 310mm to a 343 will be good and should still fit under most 17inch wheels.

[SS8_Gohan]

i'm all up for supporting local companies if this CSC mob make good stuff. Having issues trying to find contact details for CSC or B-Spec??

i'll ask John about thoughts on a 343mm adapter, because i know he doesn't recommend going that high for track applications when starting from 296mm

thanks for all the input everyone

so what rough price would we be looking at for a set of 333 or 343mm rotors?

[KiwiRS4T]

I know that some kits have angled brackets but these are my (straight)brackets:

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=234663359

In my case I am going from stock Stagea brakes to 4pot 324mm so a definite upgrade. For people with GTT brakes it would be a logical upgrade from stock when their old stock rotors are worn to new heat treated slotted rotors. I was happy to biff the stock rotors that came with the calipers as by the time I had got them skimmed it would have been marginal to get them slotted as well. Upgrade is only worthwhile for track use though in my opinion.

[Roy]

Daniel, your car is mint.. i love it. But are you sure you need to be messing with the brakes? Its a lot of money for not much gain...and based on how immaculate your car is i cant see you regularly jamming it down the inside of people into turn 1 at Sandown or PI where you need $2000 and up brakes!>!?!?!?!

But hey, i love brakes and if you want a nice brake setup let me know dollars and i will do my best to come up with a shopping list...i love spending other peoples money

[SS8_Gohan]

Cheers for the comments

I guess i just like to do things properly. I didn't go crazy on power until i had proper suspension, and now i have some OK power, i feel i need to sort out the brakes a bit more. It's 285rwkw at the moment, and will most likely be 300rwkw very shortly. I think it would be remiss of me not to take a look at a brake upgrade, and it seems the 'caliper adapter' is the best way of doing that without going over-the-top.

Talking to someone with the 324 DBA 5000's upgrade on a 33 GTS-T with supporting hardware (braided lines, good pads, etc) advised it's a VERY capable kit and a good value upgrade. And for me, i think this is probably the way to go, just perhaps go a little bigger than the originally planned 324mm.

I guess i was thinking anywhere from $750-$1000 would be what i was looking at (just judging from the UAS R33 upgrade kits).

I was trying to hunt down CSC, but they seem to have disappeared off the face of the earth, along with Hypertech. So wouldn't know where to get that gear now. I heard AVO use to sell it so i called them...

Spoke to Lee, nice on the phone and said he could look at making something up as well and can speak to him on Monday. Mentioned to him something around the 332mm, 343mm sized rotor.

But hey Roy, if you're able to put something together in terms of adapters/rotors package, you're welcome too and obviously put a bit ontop for yourself as well. Can you use my car as a guinea pig if you want

Well what are 34 owners thoughts on a BIGGER upgrade now, to say 332mm or 343mm??

[Roy]

Well basic math tells me that 324-280=44. Or 22m mon top of the rotor radius. You have 310mm, so throw 44mm on top of that and you have 354mm, which is terribly close to a cery common rotor diameter of 355.

So the first place to start is grab a 355mm rotor and see how well your std R34GTT caliper saddles it. If it looks ok then i hope you have 18" wheels and you can either use the same mount/bracket i have laying around the house to trial clearances or at least confirm the dimensional requirements for the bracket you need.

You will then have a common sized rotor, a meaty rotor so that if you ever want to upgrade to a better, stiffer caliper with better pad surface area etc then you can smply throw that at the 355mm rotor which is enough brake for just about any car.

What pads and fluid are you running now? Throw some Motul RBF600 or Castrol SRF in there and i can lend you some Endless CCX pads (i think the R32 GSTt pads fit R34 GTT...you will need to confim that) I suspect a good quality pad and fluid will ahve you going "wow, my brakes are awesome" Thats until you track it and that 285rwkws has gotten you up to 240km/h and you need to stop the thing repeatedly in quick succession

The biggest concern is that the GTT caliper is designed for a 30mm thk rotor. The bigegr diameter rotors are commonly 32mm or thicker. So if the caliper cannot clear the thickness you have to run a 30mm rotor which puts you back at the 324mm which i dont think is justified, especially in light of how "delicate" te petite little bracker woudl need to be. I had trouble with an R32 gTSt caliper clearing a 32mm thick caliper though i recently read here on SAU another person did not have that issue so perhaps the later model calipers have more internal clearance

[SS8_Gohan]

the one for the R33 was 296 - 324mm - some SAU members are running this (with good supporting hardware) and have advised of very good braking capabilities

the 296 - 343?mm kit the UAS has, they didn't advise that for use in track/motorsport applications. They said it might have some vibration issues

So would a 310-355mm perhaps be stretching the laws of physics a bit??

I am running 18's (R34 GTR rims) so i think clearance should be ok.

QFM A1RM pads and the Motul RBF600 fluid. Last piece is some Nismo braided lines, either from Nengun or seeing if Autobarn can do a good deal. I also have brake cylinder stopper.

The CCX pads are ultra $$ aren't they?

[wisey18]

I'd be keen for a brake upgrade to mine. I've already done the basics. Good pads, fluid, braided lines, mcs bracket.