Wtf Is The Deal With Suspension Specalists ?

[Wacky Dee]

took it back to up the rears another 2 circlips (about 1.6cm) When I brought it in they were both 330mm. He apparently upped both sides another 2 circlips and now I come home and right hand side is 340mm and left side 348. Wtf ?!?

Is it possible the rhs settled 8mm or so on the drive back (about 40Kms) and the left hand side will settle the same a bit later on ?? Also even though I didn't notice it while driving, when I push on the boot and get the rear bouncing I can hear a loud squeaky noise. Could that be the new rear sway bar tightened too much ?? The new bushes were all greased up properly....

Oh well atleast they didn't charge me anything. I guess I'll measure again in a couple of weeks and see.

[Beer Baron]

I am not saying they are right or wrong. I am just saying its not always as clear cut.

I agree it seems expensive, but there may be more to the story. Check your invoice and see where all the hours go. By the sounds of it your Bilstein shocks wont give you the height you are after so will ahve to either get different springs, machine new seat or live with a compromise. Maybe they removed the shocks, tried different rate/length springs to acheive what you asked for and you got what they thought was the best compromise?!?!?!?!?

And i think you are lucky if you can get an $80 alignment that includes camber adjustment, castor adjustment and toe. Most wheel alignment places for $80 say "yep, castor and camber fine, i just tweaked the toe". Well that has been my experience.

Best to do all thsi stuff yourself. It pains me when you buy all these parts only to find it costs more to install the part then it was to buy it Do it yourself, its not that steep a learning curve

agree 100%. an $80 wheel alignment wont get you bugger all, they will print out the specs for you and adjust front and rear toe and that's it.

if you (like me) have front adustable upper control arms, front adjustable castor rods, rear adjustable upper control arms and rear adjustable traction rods along with of course front and rear toe and height adjustable coil-overs try getting someone to adjust all that for $80... that is more like a $200-$300 worth of alignment work. you would have to have rocks in your head to be willing to spend 2-3 hours aligning a car and charge $80.

anyway, wacky dee, can you please pm me the names of the 2 places involved. I'm keen to know.

[BASHO]

Scuse my ignorance , but what circlips ? I just changed a leaking rear PITA to change shocky and a blown front easy to change one on my R34GTT, both stock OEs and there were no circlips anywhere, I'm running Kingsprings lowers (F355/60 R350/355) the hights remained the same after changing .

Back on topic:- I have had shit luck with KingsSprings on both a WRX --going down--to frakin much and a Jeep Wrangler--going up--not a frakinough (at the rear only) also the spring rates were not what were quoted both harder than a witches tit, so one of the main problems may just be the spring manufacturer.

Kings will resize for $20 a spring but you're still up for double the in out labour and if you're not in a Kingsprings courier area I spose you'd add shipping and time on as well.

I have to agree though that many "suspension specialists" try turn what is a straightforward opperation on 95% of street cars into some mysterious black (wallet tickling) art.

Just for an idea on time I have never ever changed struts in my life on anything but I am OK on the tools though not a tradey, I had no workshop manual and the only technical support was from tutorials on good ole SAU and a sheet from the service manual with the torque tightening specs, I worked totaly alone. Car is an R34GTT.

One Front took me 2 hours Total R&R.

Rear frikin- take the friken back seat out- PITA stupid near concealed bolts- skin my freekin knuckles- sweat my nuts off, one only, took me 3 1/2 hours R&R- but 3/4 of an hour was spent having lunch and getting my temper under control.

I am now confident I could R&R (one) in the front in an hour and the rear an hour and a half, alone, using one floor jack amd two jack stands, which is all I have, now I know where everything is.

With a hoist and air tools no more than 4 hours the lot.

Edited September 8, 2009 by BASHO

[Wacky Dee]

I'm not using stock shocks ..if you read above I think I mentioned it more than once, they're Bilstein shocks with extra circlips on them so the height is adjustable up/down in .8cm intervals

[BASHO]

I'm not using stock shocks ..if you read above I think I mentioned it more than once, they're Bilstein shocks with extra circlips on them so the height is adjustable up/down in .8cm intervals

Mate do you have a part No for these? I phoned Bilstein in Melb last week and they told me that there were none for the R34GTT.

[Wacky Dee]

I got them through SydneyKid via the now-defunct groupbuy... These were valved a bit differently (harder) from memory.

Honestly .. I wouldn't bother, just get yourself a nice set of adjustable coilovers and be done with it. Tein SS (oz spec) or HSD ones seem to be popular. Easier to install and adjust ..and probably just as good in terms of handling and ride comfort as the Bilsteins.

[nisskid]

agree 100%. an $80 wheel alignment wont get you bugger all, they will print out the specs for you and adjust front and rear toe and that's it.

if you (like me) have front adustable upper control arms, front adjustable castor rods, rear adjustable upper control arms and rear adjustable traction rods along with of course front and rear toe and height adjustable coil-overs try getting someone to adjust all that for $80... that is more like a $200-$300 worth of alignment work. you would have to have rocks in your head to be willing to spend 2-3 hours aligning a car and charge $80.

anyway, wacky dee, can you please pm me the names of the 2 places involved. I'm keen to know.

you guys are getting ripped off haha

height adjustment is not part of an alignment, u dont need an aligner to adjust height, u need a tape measurer.

i get my alignment done every month or so and ive given them the worst of the worst alignments, like 30mm toe, -6 camber, traction rods completely in etc etc, it's never taken them more than half hour to get it within my specs.

that's F&R toe, caster, rear camber, traction rods (not done with a bump steer meter, done of relative length).

if ur getting it done with a bumpsteer gauge then even $300 is very optimistic, but we arent talking about that here.

[nisskid]

I got them through SydneyKid via the now-defunct groupbuy... These were valved a bit differently (harder) from memory.

Honestly .. I wouldn't bother, just get yourself a nice set of adjustable coilovers and be done with it. Tein SS (oz spec) or HSD ones seem to be popular. Easier to install and adjust ..and probably just as good in terms of handling and ride comfort as the Bilsteins.

adjustable seats are about $150pr by memory.

[paulR32gtr]

Man you can also buy a mansion in semaphore on the esplanade in adelaide 25 minutes from the CBD for around $1 million! The same house in melbourne would be upwards of $2-3m, and sydney $5-6m. Cost of living in mel and sydney is huge, we all charge huge amounts for the work we do, and we all get charged huge amounts for work we have done.

In saying that I completely agree about doing it yourself IF you have the time cos your not too busy charging huge amounts for the work you do - suspension is easy, driveline is generally pretty easy as well.

[nisskid]

how much do ur workshops charge an hour on average? id say ours would be somewhere around the $80 mark give or take

[paulR32gtr]

Melbourne same for random servicing shops - I paid $75 / hour to get diff oil changed at a random shop two years ago before I had a garage. Specialist / performance shops would be $100 - $180+ / hour depending on which "guru" is working on your car / dyno being used etc...

I recently had a specialist suspension shop go right through my car not sure if you remember the thread - while the result is good it was expensive and for the prices I was expecting some higher end parts to be used. Looking back I would have researched and bought the specific parts I wanted - and fitted them myself once I had time save an alignment - was aprehensive about pulling the rear cradle without a lifter and all the other gear. Just pulled the rear diff over the weekend and it was pretty easy - cradle wouldnt be too much more of a stretch.

Dropping back past the same workshop a week or so later it was empty, so I guess they are making as much off anyone coming through as they can to keep their businesses alive at the moment while people are cutting back.

You are right - most places here fluff their invoices - if you hang around and wait for work to be done its ready quick, and the price is right - and if it isn't you can get them to explain - but leave the car there for a couple of days and their supposed hourly rate doesnt mean much anymore - fat gets added everywhere. Overheads need to get paid - running a business isn't cheap with work safe and all that shite going on these days - once they get the money home to pay the 4-500k mortgage in Reservoir their ain't much left.

[nisskid]

the problem is, to change coilovers u dont need a specialist, anyone who's worked on a car with coilovers (majority of cars on the road) will know the basic procedure, nuts that hold it to the top, nuts that hold it to the bottom, multi-link suspension being even easier.

undo bolts, swap over, tighten bolts, done. it really isnt much of a science. as far as springs go and getting them right, look u may have to pull apart the coilover, but even then its a matter of undoing a nut and pulling the top off.

honestly this stuff is as basic as it gets, to be charging that much is ridiculous.

[BASHO]

I got them through SydneyKid via the now-defunct groupbuy... These were valved a bit differently (harder) from memory.

Honestly .. I wouldn't bother, just get yourself a nice set of adjustable coilovers and be done with it. Tein SS (oz spec) or HSD ones seem to be popular. Easier to install and adjust ..and probably just as good in terms of handling and ride comfort as the Bilsteins.

Right, It's just that the car came with KingSprings and the hight is good (255/260 & 250/255) and the ride not to awfull so I didn't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater as it were, however, if the new dampers I've put in blow that'll be the best way to go for sure, I'm not a fan of KingSprings so it wont't be a hard decision, thanks for the HSD tip .

Edited September 8, 2009 by BASHO

[bigmikespec]

you guys are getting ripped off haha

height adjustment is not part of an alignment, u dont need an aligner to adjust height, u need a tape measurer.

i get my alignment done every month or so and ive given them the worst of the worst alignments, like 30mm toe, -6 camber, traction rods completely in etc etc, it's never taken them more than half hour to get it within my specs.

that's F&R toe, caster, rear camber, traction rods (not done with a bump steer meter, done of relative length).

if ur getting it done with a bumpsteer gauge then even $300 is very optimistic, but we arent talking about that here.

nisskid, who does you alignment setting camber, caster... etc in Adelaide?

PM if you like

Mike

[nisskid]

nisskid, who does you alignment setting camber, caster... etc in Adelaide?

PM if you like

Mike

Tyrepower Adelaide, they look after a lot of the drifters and import scene here.

[GamblerZ]

I can understand that people on occasion do not have the spare time available to them to get routine maintenance or installation work done on their cars. However, the OP was positively raped. He probably could have had it all done cheaper at an authorized Nissan dealership, btw who SPECIALIZE in Skylines and GT-Rs, and had it all done right the first time. I often use Nissan's service/parts pricing as a benchmark in the event I have to have anything done that I cannot, or do not have the time to do myself.

[paulR32gtr]

Unfortunately Nissan Australia is a bit of a joke when it comes to the Skyline. Because most of the Skylines in Australia are grey imports direct from Japan - Nissan Australia developed official policy to actively block local support & parts for them.

This has changed a bit over time with regards to parts (still extremely expensive), but generally the service centres provide poor customer service, charge an arm and a leg - and the mechanics have very little knowledge of the platforms. Plus side of this is we have a number of excellent performance workshops that specialise in the cars.

I guess Nissan US have that customer service culture that is so good over in the states?

[nisskid]

i wouldnt touch nissan australia with a 10ft pole, unless i had 22 kidneys.

[GamblerZ]

Wow! I am startled at this revelation. I was unaware that there was so little support there.

Meanwhile, my particular dealership is drooling at the opportunity to work on and showcase my R32. I have purchased a number of cars from them in the past and pushed a LOT of business their way. We have a very good relationship. That might have something to do with it.

[nisskid]

could also be that we have a bigger aftermarket here for skylines, tonnes of workshops here specialise in skylines and other grey imports, so we dont have to go to the dealer.

im sure if there werent better options we'd be using nissan dealers here too.