Racepace Built R34 Gtr Nur Rb28 V-cam

[SS8_Gohan]

Driver Dynamics i think still has some spots for their January Sandown trackday. 10% discount for SAU Vic members and a very well run day. Perfect day to find your feet with the car as there are a bunch of great instructors on hand who can jump in with you whenever you want. Not a TIMED day, so you just get a bunch of laps, every hour (a lot of track time in the end) and just gradually get to figure the car out at speed, etc. Heaps, heaps of time to get comfortable

Who's doing the suspension work? I take it RacePace are more than sorted for that or are you going to Traction Tyres, etc?

[rtune]

What I find curious is the HKS advertising for their v-cam.

This PDF:

http://hkseurope.com/engine/vcam.pdf

take a look at the claimed dyno graph.

I'm converting tangomatts graph from KPH to RPM for this comparison and converting

japanese PS to KW.

for the HKS car (which is 2.6, not 2.8), and running just 1bar of boost, and 2530s

at 3000 rpm .. (hks claim 110kw) (this 2.8 100kw)

at 4000 rpm .. (hks claim 202kw) (this 2.8 150kw)

at 5000 rpm .. (hks claim 272kw) (this 2.8 275kw)

So even with 2.8 and 23psi of boost, the 2.6 hks demo with 14psi spools

faster and generates more mid range power only losing at the top due to 14psi vs 23psi.

HKS list the specs for their car... 264 degree exhaust cam on 2530s and vcam step 1

improved intake, hks cat and muffler, bigger intercooler fuel pump and injector

and f-con vpro ... No super special fat exhaust, no engine work.

Can anyone speculate as to the reason?

Edited November 6, 2009 by moneypit

[SimonR32]

im looking at a 3 page pdf with specs and no graph?!?

[SimonR32]

also i would imagine the HKS graph that you are looking at is flywheel ps, which does not translate to rwkw like you think

Edited November 6, 2009 by Cerbera

[dazmo]

If the HKS demo car you are refering to is the "performance driver" it is indeed a 2.8lt motor.

[tangomatt]

SS8_Gohan Posted Today, 02:42 PM

Driver Dynamics i think still has some spots for their January Sandown trackday. 10% discount for SAU Vic members and a very well run day. Perfect day to find your feet with the car as there are a bunch of great instructors on hand who can jump in with you whenever you want. Not a TIMED day, so you just get a bunch of laps, every hour (a lot of track time in the end) and just gradually get to figure the car out at speed, etc. Heaps, heaps of time to get comfortable

Who's doing the suspension work? I take it RacePace are more than sorted for that or are you going to Traction Tyres, etc?

I am going to book Driver dynamic as soon as I know what my work schedule will be in 2010 January. Thanks for advice.

As for the suspension, they will be revalved and resprung to Racepace track specs by Fulcrum in QLD, who is the authorised TEIN distributor.

moneypit Posted Today, 03:13 PM

What I find curious is the HKS advertising for their v-cam.

HKS list the specs for their car... 264 degree exhaust cam on 2530s and vcam step 1

improved intake, hks cat and muffler, bigger intercooler fuel pump and injector

and f-con vpro ... No super special fat exhaust, no engine work.

Can anyone speculate as to the reason?

I will ask Beno and he will enlighten us on the difference between the two dyno graphs. I know he often says that comparing raw power readings between dyno charts are frivolous as there are too many different variables that cannot be taken into account. The truth is in how the car actually drives on the road, and I can assure you that the RB28, V Cam and Garrett- 5s combo drives smooth and strong and delivers the power like a NA car. By 'smooth' I mean there is virtually no turbo lag and no sudden spike in power that can throw the car off balance mid to late corner acceleration.

But if it is true that the HKS demo car can generate 35% MORE power at 4000 rpms with 40% LESS boost than I am running, then I and certainly Beno ought to be IMPRESSED and ASHAMED at the same time!!!!!

A few questions that I have in my mind and you guys in the know can answer for me:

Aren't HKS 2530s essentially the same specs as the Garrett -5s?

Can 202 rwkw be really achievable on a RB26 or RB28 for that matter with only 14.5psi of boost?

Would a higher lift cam profile, say comparing 248 vs 264 on the inlet side, give better high end power and sacrifice low end power? If the 264 gives better high end power and sacrifice no low end power, then how would 272 compare??

This is getting interesting!

Cheers

Matt

[dazmo]

Hey mate once again an awsome result that you and Racepace have achieved. Just to answer you question the garret -5's are simular but they are definatly not the same as the HKS 2530. The HKS turbos have different housings a larger inducer and the wheel trim is slightly different as well. A lot of people refer to the Garrets and claim they are the same turbos but from my experiance and that of a few other people that have used both Garret and HKS the HKS turbos always seem to make a bit more power than the Garrets. I am sure Dirt Garage and Beer Barron will back up my comments on this.

I really think that 202 RWKW would be achieved reasonably easily with 14.5psi of boost on a RB28 as my R33GTR RB28-HKS2530 is making 450 AWKW on 21psi without the obvious advantage that the v cam system would give you.

The HKS Vcam system comes in step 1, step2 and Step3(PRO). Step 1 I believe is 248-264 step 2 is 248-272 and step3 is 248-280 The whole concept behind the Vcam is to give the advantage and extra top end of the larger cams without sacrificing bottom end power.

Lets not all forget that the power that your car currently makes is not on the final tune and there will definatly be more in your set up with the final tune optimised. The figures quoted by HKS will definatly be with the tune and every other aspect of the car optimised to be running to its maximum potential.

As you also stated and Ben has said to compare cars on 2 different dynos in different conditions if fairly pointless exersize. I can also say with confidence that nearly all japanese dynos are on the happy side and over inflate power levels. I was in japan with Mark Berry and the Hi Octane boys when they took their R32GTR to japan for the rev speed super battle at tsukuba and their car was putting out 700ps on a japanese dyno wich is between 10-20% more than what the car was actually making on a aussie dyno.

Dont get caught up in dyno figures mate as they tell only a fraction of the story the most powerfull car is not always the quickest car the seat of the pants is the best way to judge how good a particular set up is all i can say mate is just enjoy the awsome set up that you have built and dont worry about the figures on a sheet of paper.

By the way the quickest time attack GTR's in japan are nearly all running an RB28 with Vcam.

Edited November 6, 2009 by dazmo

[tangomatt]

What rpm would the engine be running say in 4th gear at:

104 kph

121kph

138 kph

155 kph

172 kph ?

And what if its in 5th gear at the same speed increments?

I think my dyno was recorded in 4th gear.

[tangomatt]

Dazmo:

You wouldn't happen to have a dyno graph of your RB28 HKS 2530s beast? Would you care to post it up for comparison? It would be interesting to see how the VCam affect the shape of the power curve.

Cheers

Matt

[jonn]

I'm not trying to compare my poor little 32 with yours Matt but here is my dyno sheet. HKS RB28, 2530's, 272 cams. Still a bit more tuning in it though.

Also attached Gav's dyno for comparison. I believe it's a little out of date now and they have done more tuning with peak hp back up around the 570-ish but you get the idea.

Edited November 7, 2009 by jonn

[tangomatt]

Thanks Jonn.

It would be good to see a few more dynos of RB28 with different turbos and cam profile for comparison.

[TALBO]

Wonderful build, you should be proud. All I can really say is WOW WTfkn...... WOW

[picks up jaw on the way out]

[astrotristan]

i finally finished reading up to here,

and just throwing it out there - you are a mad dude,

this 34 is the secks

[SLED]

Not really a tough choice, r35 or an r34 of this calibre.

R34 wins, hands down.

Matt you should be very proud of what you've built

Well I've just lost an evening of my life going thru this entire thread but must say it was well worth the read.

I have just recently sold my 34 V-Spec and would have to agree with N1GTR whole heartedly.

I think we're all still in awe of the R35 at the moment Matt, but give it another year or two when we get used to seeing them on the road a bit more and I'm sure your finished work of art will turn heads more than it's newer cousin......at least you can say you've got the last Skyline ever made

Congrats on the build.

[dazmo]

Hey Matt there is a dyno sheet in my build thread from the initial tune with the RPM limited to 7200rpm. I dont have a print out from the the current tune finalized mate. Next time the car is on the dyno i will get a current dyno sheet. V cam would definatley be a welcome addition to my car though and something I would love to run but to be honest due to the expense there are better ways for me to spend my cash as my car has been built with a more track orientated focus suspension and brakes would be a far better investment and would net better gains per dollar spent as far as achieving a better lap time.

Dazmo:

You wouldn't happen to have a dyno graph of your RB28 HKS 2530s beast? Would you care to post it up for comparison? It would be interesting to see how the VCam affect the shape of the power curve.

Cheers

Matt

[tangomatt]

THANKS GUYS (Sled, Talbo, astrotristan2) for kind words!

Hi Dazmo,

I feel a bit inadequate now since checking out the power otuput of your RB28 and HKS 2530s. Hmmm... Maybe another upgrade o 2530s. I hope another tune after running in 1000kms would yield more mid range response, maybe wick up the boost to 25psi?

Cheers

Matt

[tangomatt]

Pro Photos have been processed. However, due to 'copyright' agreement, I cannot post any large format photos. All pictures are watermarked with 'Joel Strickland'. I apologise, but you all know about copyright laws blah, blah, blah....

Here's a sample for my favourites:

Just expressing my courtesy and respect for Joel, here's the link to Joel's website: (Note I have no financial interest in his work)

Joel Strickland Photographics Website

[Huy]

F@#k. Too hot. Doesn't get much better than that.

Well done, Matt.

[Halle]

WWHHHAAAATTTTT!!!! LOL

I'M SPEECHLESS........

WELL DONE MATT AND GOOD LUCK TO YA!

WHAT A QUALITY WORKSHOP HUH!(FLOORS CLEAN ENOUGH TO EAT OFF) LOL.

MATT PLEASE COME TO THE SHOW N SHINE.

.......

[NothingSuss]

So much win, photos turned out great