What's A "better" Turbo Upgrade For A Greddy T67?

[9krpm]

Sorry to asked this question here but most s2k rev heads have not stroked the f20c engine to this capacity yet or use Greddy turbo.

I figured that you guys would be the best people to ask, since you would have a lot more experience with the Greddy turbo on the RB25.

Anyway, I've been tinkering with both RB and F20C for a while now. Both engines fascinate me

So don't tease me with this ricer engine okie lol

The T67 on my built 2L s2k made 312 kw at 18psi.

The engine has been stroked to 2.47L and still has the T67 turbo.

We spent a bit of time on the dyno yesterday. Will do a bit more at a later stage to get more midrange.

The setup would not produce any more power after 15psi or above 7.5krpm despite what we tried.

Currently, on pump 98 fuel, it makes

-7psi of boost at 3krpm

-200rwkw at 4-4.5krpm

-peak torque @ ~5.7krpm

-320rwkw at 7.5krpm

My tuner told me that the turbo is out of puff and I know that he is correct (but was giving him a hard time when he suggested switch to ball bearing turbo lol)

Has anyone got any dyno result of T67 turbo on a RB25?

When does the T67 runs out of puff and at what power?

I am looking for a bit more midrange and may be a bit more top end.

In your experience, is there any turbo out there that can give me both?

Car is used for street and tight circuit.

Thanks

[STATUS]

what rear you using? i reckon looking at your power its an 8, the 10cm has bugger all more lag on the rb25 yet supports another 30-40rwkw easy.

[XRATED]

Dude... you've got all the cool toys!!!

How the hell are you getting 300kw to the ground??? I've been in a few lightly boosted ( one was wide body ) S2K's in Florida... Whith reasonable tread, it was just wheel spin city!!! Ha ha ha love it.

Speaking of ball bearings, billet turbochargers can re-core you T67 with they're "special" ball bearing core... a TD turbo was around 1300bucks, so I imagine a T67 would be similar.

Cheers

Justin

Sorry to asked this question here but most s2k rev heads have not stroked the f20c engine to this capacity yet or use Greddy turbo.

I figured that you guys would be the best people to ask, since you would have a lot more experience with the Greddy turbo on the RB25.

Anyway, I've been tinkering with both RB and F20C for a while now. Both engines fascinate me

So don't tease me with this ricer engine okie lol

The T67 on my built 2L s2k made 312 kw at 18psi.

The engine has been stroked to 2.47L and still has the T67 turbo.

We spent a bit of time on the dyno yesterday. Will do a bit more at a later stage to get more midrange.

The setup would not produce any more power after 15psi or above 7.5krpm despite what we tried.

Currently, on pump 98 fuel, it makes

-7psi of boost at 3krpm

-200rwkw at 4-4.5krpm

-peak torque @ ~5.7krpm

-320rwkw at 7.5krpm

My tuner told me that the turbo is out of puff and I know that he is correct (but was giving him a hard time when he suggested switch to ball bearing turbo lol)

Has anyone got any dyno result of T67 turbo on a RB25?

When does the T67 runs out of puff and at what power?

I am looking for a bit more midrange and may be a bit more top end.

In your experience, is there any turbo out there that can give me both?

Car is used for street and tight circuit.

Thanks

[dazmo]

I would not personally use a billit turbo as I am suspect on there longevity. I do believe myself that there is a reason none of the worlds largest turbo manufactures go down this route and they do spend millions in R&D so there has to be a reason for it !!. I personally fail to see that the manufacturers of these turbos wich work out of a small shed in their back yard with an extremely limited budget to conduct any R&D know something that some of the worlds leading turbo manufacturers do not. I would suspect myself that the thermal loading that the core is subject to would no doubt cause the alluminium biilit to become brittle and fatauge long before the cast iron cores used for every other turbo charger and by every other manufaturer in the world.

[9krpm]

what rear you using? i reckon looking at your power its an 8, the 10cm has bugger all more lag on the rb25 yet supports another 30-40rwkw easy.

It's a 10 but I did not double check when I got it back from the turbo rebuilder.

I will double check today. The tune was very conservative with, from memory, about 14 degree top end

If it's a 10, what is my next option Trent?

How the hell are you getting 300kw to the ground??? I've been in a few lightly boosted ( one was wide body ) S2K's in Florida... Whith reasonable tread, it was just wheel spin city!!! Ha ha ha love it.

Speaking of ball bearings, billet turbochargers can re-core you T67 with they're "special" ball bearing core... a TD turbo was around 1300bucks, so I imagine a T67 would be similar.

I think that's the benefit of these Greddy turbo where the boost ramp rate is early enough but not as rapid.

No problem with traction in 3rd with the RB25 gearbox ratio on the 245 treads used for dyno. First and second is not too bad until ~6krpm.

Yes I can understand traction problem with the shorter gear ratio in oem box, non mechanical diff, and garret turbo.

Yes I recall Buschur had some good success with recoring the ?TD06 but don't they also change the compressor wheel on these turbo.

Do you have any proven results with just recoring the turbo?

Thanks Dazmo.

Edited October 14, 2009 by 9krpm

[bradsm87]

Def not worth re-coring the turbo IMO. The wheels and housings make all the difference. If ball bearings made that much difference, Trust would've changed to ball bearings years ago.

Thought about something like a Garrett GT3582R?

[9krpm]

I had a chance to look at the tune and talked to the tuner this morning.

Engine is basically sucking the turbo out of it's efficiency by around 7500rpm.

Extra timing and boost (on the controller) were given but we did not see anything more than 15-16psi.

Midrange timing is extremely conservative so, there MAY be a bit more top end power gain once this get tuned.

Yes the GT35R or GT37R will be nice for this setup but it will involves a lot of fabrication work and 400rwkw will not be usable on the street for this car.

How much laggier is the TD07 compare to the T67?

[juggernaut1]

Not an RB25 and not a T67, but on an RB26 Brockas switched from twin 2835's to a single GT35 and picked up substantially more mid with a tad more power earlier.

From memory he used a GT35 with a T4 turbine housing which he got through GCG turbo's. He posted up a thread here in SAU not so long ago.....here's a link to the dyno on Antilag....scroll down to his dyno nearly half way down the page - he was making 165rwhp at 4000, 275rwhp at 4500 and 557rwhp at 6500. Also search on SAU for his thread for more info. Notice how the torque peaks at 5000 and holds fairly flat to 7500 which is the sign of a good turbo match.

http://antilag.com/forums/showthread.php?t=749&page=54

Edited October 15, 2009 by juggernaut1

[Roy]

TD07 are T4 flanges so will still need to mod the manifold, So garrets are again an option. The TD06SH-25G for whatever reason seems to make more power then T67, even though they are similar turbos (i have read they are the same????)

[phunky_monkey]

Troy, according to these charts the 25G is bigger than either of the two T67's which would be why it's more power productive.

[Roy]

9krpm, i have a TD06SH-25G at home that i am waiting to try on my car. I mainly grabbed it for the exhaust housing size which i am 50:50 about being able to be switche over to my TD06-20G turbo. I know the T67 housings can be swapped with my TD06-20G, but not sure about the TD06SH-25G.

Because, i thought the T67 ran the same exhaust wheel as the TD06SH, but according to that graph of yours Dane thats not the case, which means i dont think i can swap the 10cm housing for the 8cm housing between the TD06S-20G and TD06SH-25G

But point is, its on the shelf and whilst not for sale, provided you are nice and careful when installing with regards to priming with oil etc i dont mind if you try it to see if the power it to your liking before you run off and buy one

[9krpm]

Roy and Phunky monkey, you guys are awesome.

Much appreciate for the offer Roy. You are too kind. I'll drop you a private message after work today. Thanks mate.

[STATUS]

It's a 10 but I did not double check when I got it back from the turbo rebuilder.

I will double check today. The tune was very conservative with, from memory, about 14 degree top end

If it's a 10, what is my next option Trent?

TD06SH-25g 10cm will do the trick, bolt on too .

I just finished a R34 with a td06-25g (not the SH) 10cm which was nearly the same as the 8cm T67 in power and response, which was quite interesting (peak @4000rpm). In cars ive seen here the TD06SH-25g 10cm has a lot more top end at least 30-40rwkw than the T67 8cm.

If budget and fab was'nt an issue i would say the K5-660 or k5-700r, we just finished tuning the race car with the K5-660R and it is quite something... we did back to backs with a GT35R and it was more responsivee than the GT35R (20 pound by 4200) and still makes 400rwkw @ 20psi.

Edited October 15, 2009 by URAS

[dazmo]

Not an RB25 and not a T67, but on an RB26 Brockas switched from twin 2835's to a single GT35 and picked up substantially more mid with a tad more power earlier.

From memory he used a GT35 with a T4 turbine housing which he got through GCG turbo's. He posted up a thread here in SAU not so long ago.....here's a link to the dyno on Antilag....scroll down to his dyno nearly half way down the page - he was making 165rwhp at 4000, 275rwhp at 4500 and 557rwhp at 6500. Also search on SAU for his thread for more info. Notice how the torque peaks at 5000 and holds fairly flat to 7500 which is the sign of a good turbo match.

http://antilag.com/forums/showthread.php?t=749&page=54

No offence intended but those power figures quoted would make me think that that would be a pretty terrible combo to drive to go from 165rwhp @4000 to 557rwhp @ 6500 to me it would just suggest that it would be fairly difficult to put the power to the ground and unless he is useing mega revs would end up with a fairly narrow power band.

I personally just dont understand why people would go for this sort of combo especcially when the peak power output quoted would be achieved with ease with a pair of low mounts and would be making at least 100 - 150 rwhp more at 4k and the same sort of top end power figure and that would without a shadow of a doubt be a much quicker car and a much nicer combo to drive than the above combo based on the figures quoted. just my 2c .

[9krpm]

TD06SH-25g 10cm will do the trick, bolt on too .

I just finished a R34 with a td06-25g (not the SH) 10cm which was nearly the same as the 8cm T67 in power and response, which was quite interesting (peak @4000rpm). In cars ive seen here the TD06SH-25g 10cm has a lot more top end at least 30-40rwkw than the T67 8cm.

If budget and fab was'nt an issue i would say the K5-660 or k5-700r, we just finished tuning the race car with the K5-660R and it is quite something... we did back to backs with a GT35R and it was more responsivee than the GT35R (20 pound by 4200) and still makes 400rwkw @ 20psi.

Thanks for recommending the K5 turbo but I think I will save that money to make the gtr faster

I think I will look at the TD06SH -25G 10cm since I am pretty sure that my T67 is 25G 10cm.

[Cartman]

Hey trent, in your experiences... how do the T67 25g 8cm or 10cm behave on stock rb25's, what rpm range are they usually on song for and what not?

[9krpm]

Thanks for all of your kind helps guys.

Drag racing is over for this little pocket rocket, so I am not going to try shoot big top end number.

I will get the car retune in a month time with this the current and see what we can get in the low to mid rev.

If it's "too" responsive then I may try the TD06SH. I will definitely report back here for the difference between the 2 turbo if I do test the td06sh.

BTW this is what a GT37R does on a 2.2L on pump fuel + meth/water injection in the US

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I read that he has ~685whp (equivalent to around 450rwkw on the OZ dyno)

Thanks again

Edited October 16, 2009 by 9krpm

[juggernaut1]

BW S200 dyno vs T67....perhaps the Borg Warner may give you the mid range your chasing.

and source:

http://www.turbo-kits.com/s200_turbochargers.html

Edited October 17, 2009 by juggernaut1

[9krpm]

Sorry the imbedded link did not work;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1lCjOgoyEM&hl=en&fs=1&

Juggernat, I think the T67 they referred to is a Garrett T67, which I have no idea how it fair up to the Greddy T67.

I have not play with Borg Warner turbo but a turbo s2k in NSW has been using these Borg Warner turbos with some good success.

[juggernaut1]

Juggernat, I think the T67 they referred to is a Garrett T67, which I have no idea how it fair up to the Greddy T67.

Oh OK