New Owner Of R33 Power Question

[toorock which]

Hey every one new owner of a sereis 1.5 r33.

Just had my car on the dyno the other day and my results were not what i expected. From what ive seen of the cars on this site and the type of mods my cars output is somewhat lacking. with 154rwkw @10psi. im thinking theres something other than the obvious wrong. Below is a list of the mods and what need attention.

PFC

Modified factory plenum to face forward

FMIC

exhaust and dump

pod filter

Now i know the coil packs need to replaced so that explains why it cannot boost over 10psi, ive just seen some other power outputs at this level of boost with roughly 180rwkw can the coil packs also effect the power outpout at lower boost levels as well. shouldnt there still be sufficient spark?

Was wondering other peoples thoughts on my situation.

Kind regards

Chris

[Super Drager]

I'd say its your tune mate.

[Pal]

would need to see a dyno sheet with afr's

[femno]

What do you expect afrs to tell you? They could be spot on but there could be a lack of timing...

How do you know it needs coilpacks?

Does it break down and splutter during the run?

If so how can you expect it to be making power.

Its amazing what healthy fuel and ignition systems can do.

[simpletool]

You'll notice coil packs breaking down by a sharp stutter in the power delivery - usually higher in the rev range ~4500-5000rpm. If this isn't occurring I would think the coilpacks are fine.

154rwkw for 10psi is pretty low , you should expect at least 175rwkw - but each dyno is different and depends on values put in. Is the torque & power curve fairly linear/expected shape?

Before getting a retune make sure everything is in good condition. Change fuel filter, spark plugs (typical copper ones) and check for boost leaks.

[toorock which]

Pretty sure its the coil packs, if you wind up the boost any more than 10psi it will cough and splutter.

Im thinking it might be timing also, it seems doughy and lifeless below 4500, above 5000rpm it really picks up in response. but that was after the tune. (Im hoping once i go back after the coil packs have been replaced, it will make difference

I knew the coil packs were possibley on there way out before the tune, but it was a new car and i wanted to get it checked over before is started driving it, The person who owned it before me wound the boost controller open all the way, and when i got it, the car was running 1.5bar, so im thinking the turbo may also be damaged being stock and all.

THanks for yourt reponsees so far

[toorock which]

Heres a pic of my dyno read out

[riggaP]

My S1 R33 made 155rwkw with chipped ECU, turbo back exhaust, K&N panel filter, and 12psi. I went to another dyno and made 190rwkw without changing a thing... Soooooo many variables that affect a dyno reading. Smoothness of curve is going to tell you more about how it's performing.

I had a 'cough and splutter' problem back with my stock ECU (search 'overboost protection'), but re-gapped the spark plugs to 0.8mm and the problem disappeared (@ 10psi). AM ECU should also solve this problem.

[Granthem]

I had a Cat back exhaust, and 12ish psi running through my R34 GTT (remember, its 206kw from factory, up abit on the R33's) and it pulled 161rwkw.

My answer, every dyno is different. Does it feel fast to you? Feel good to drive? If so, focus more on that then a piece of paper.

IMO the one real test for power is the 1/4 mile. Track it, get your trap speed, and then work out whether its down on power from where it should be.

[mad082]

My S1 R33 made 155rwkw with chipped ECU, turbo back exhaust, K&N panel filter, and 12psi. I went to another dyno and made 190rwkw without changing a thing... Soooooo many variables that affect a dyno reading. Smoothness of curve is going to tell you more about how it's performing.

I had a 'cough and splutter' problem back with my stock ECU (search 'overboost protection'), but re-gapped the spark plugs to 0.8mm and the problem disappeared (@ 10psi). AM ECU should also solve this problem.

he is running a PFC, so ecu isn't an issue

looks like you have some sort of issue going on there judging by the dyno graph (depending on a few things). are you running a boost controller or is the 10psi just what it is climbing to on it's own?

to be honest, i would put it down to being one of a few possible things.

1: tired engine

2: crap tune

3: the foward facing plenum (wouldn't be the whole cause, but certainly won't be helping the situation and may be part of the cause of the tired engine as you will get uneven airflow which can result in major leaning out in cylinders 5 and 6 and running rich in 1 and 2. the plenums are designed to have air come in from the side so having it come in from the front is going to give drastically different flow characteristics than what it was designed to have)

[Trozzle]

R34 GTT is 206kw at the flywheel from factory IIRC....you got your 161kw at the wheels. Although yes that is still a little low for 12psi

[mad082]

I had a Cat back exhaust, and 12ish psi running through my R34 GTT (remember, its 206kw from factory, up abit on the R33's) and it pulled 161rwkw.

My answer, every dyno is different. Does it feel fast to you? Feel good to drive? If so, focus more on that then a piece of paper.

IMO the one real test for power is the 1/4 mile. Track it, get your trap speed, and then work out whether its down on power from where it should be.

you also have to remember that all stock power outputs are measured at the flywheel, so you will never have a stock car make on a dyno what the power is quoted to be. also you were running 12psi through the stock dump/front pipe and cat, which is an area of substantial restriction so you wouldn't be making as much power as a 33 with a turbo back exhaust, and probably not much more power than if you dropped the boost back down to 10psi. also the stock side mount cooler suffers from heat soak pretty quickly. even though it is bigger than a 33 one it is still small.

a basic rule you can use is, the power in kw at the flywheel (so power quoted by the manufacturer) will equal the power in HP at the wheels. so if a car has 200kw at the flywheel, it will have around 200hp at the wheels, or about 150kw at the wheels. it isn't exact but it is pretty close to.

[paulr33]

as the others have said, check the state of the tune, check afr's, check complete tune and basic mecahnics etc

with 12psi and those mods you should make 200rwkw a walk in the park

[Granthem]

you also have to remember that all stock power outputs are measured at the flywheel, so you will never have a stock car make on a dyno what the power is quoted to be. also you were running 12psi through the stock dump/front pipe and cat, which is an area of substantial restriction so you wouldn't be making as much power as a 33 with a turbo back exhaust, and probably not much more power than if you dropped the boost back down to 10psi. also the stock side mount cooler suffers from heat soak pretty quickly. even though it is bigger than a 33 one it is still small.

a basic rule you can use is, the power in kw at the flywheel (so power quoted by the manufacturer) will equal the power in HP at the wheels. so if a car has 200kw at the flywheel, it will have around 200hp at the wheels, or about 150kw at the wheels. it isn't exact but it is pretty close to.

Oh yeh sorry didnt mean to confuse you. I know stock power outputs are at the flywheel, I more meant it as in the 20odd kw flywheel advantage will of course equate to a generally slightly higher figure at the wheels then an R33.

Yeh my car had 215rwhp, so 215 engine Kw is possibly close to what it really had. Either way at the track it ran 160km traps which was ok imo

[MiZ_SXy_180]

our R33 made 253hp or 188RWKW on 9psi with exhaust and pod filter everything else is stock

[toorock which]

he is running a PFC, so ecu isn't an issue

looks like you have some sort of issue going on there judging by the dyno graph (depending on a few things). are you running a boost controller or is the 10psi just what it is climbing to on it's own?

to be honest, i would put it down to being one of a few possible things.

1: tired engine

2: crap tune

3: the foward facing plenum (wouldn't be the whole cause, but certainly won't be helping the situation and may be part of the cause of the tired engine as you will get uneven airflow which can result in major leaning out in cylinders 5 and 6 and running rich in 1 and 2. the plenums are designed to have air come in from the side so having it come in from the front is going to give drastically different flow characteristics than what it was designed to have)

Yeah i thought as much, ill have to do a comp check next time i have a day off, im also looking at replacing the plenum with one from plasmaman

As far as the tune goes, im not fussed about out right power, i just want a nice responsive engine. hopefully when i get a new set of coil packs in it he can run out the sluggishness.

Thanks for all your help so far will update once i get the coil packs in.

Chris

Edited March 10, 2010 by toorock which

[RB25PWR]

I made 162rwkw @ 8 psi with just a 3.5" cat-back. Everything else standard, even the air-box. IMO get it re-tuned.

[ssxRicho]

isnt the boost climbing a little to slow? its the standard turbo? i remember you

would sneeze on the throttle and mine would be at 10psi.

[mad082]

isnt the boost climbing a little to slow? its the standard turbo? i remember you

would sneeze on the throttle and mine would be at 10psi.

that depends on whether he has the boost set at 10psi, or whether he is using the stock actuaotr setup and it is simply creeping up to 10psi. if he is using the stock setup then that is fine. if he is using a boost controller to set it to 10psi then there is something wrong

[Harey]

isnt the boost climbing a little to slow? its the standard turbo? i remember you

would sneeze on the throttle and mine would be at 10psi.

still doesnt explain the low peak power.