Type R (rocket Or Bucket?)

[ARTZ]

As far as registerable Go-karts go Honda makes the best IMO...

Yes they are better when tuned but unfortunately expensive and dont reap big rewards for money spent, but lightly modded they are just plain fun if you like to drive a car hard in traffic

Nissan make better/tougher cars that are far more tunable for sure, and are easier to brag about

but the Honda is better to nip down the shop for milk in..If you live in the city that is

Edited April 25, 2010 by faggywaggy

[Iron Chef]

That's not entirely fair. The DC5R is pretty weaksauce, and the Australian delivered one isn't the full fat version either. The EP3 (and FN2R Honda Australia is selling now) isn't much better - it's made by the Poms, not the Japanese. The Aussie delivered DC5R, EP3R and FN2R are about as close to real Type-Rs as this thing:

Since when was the EP3 Aussie delivered?? The JDM version IS the real thing! And all Civic Type Rs were made in the UK, even the EK9.

I owned an EP3 as a daily for about 18 months. Pic below:

Given that I hopped into it after selling an RX-7, I found it SLLOOOOWWW driving it around town, mostly because you tend to spend your time at the bottom of the rev range, and being non-turbo, a lack of torque just makes it feel like you're always changing gears to get anywhere.

But over time, I grew to love it. The EP3 has the gearstick coming out of the dash, and it is the best gearshift I've ever used, I even rate it higher than my old MX-5, and that's a huge call. I liked the fact that I could thrash the bejeezus out of it and still get less than 10l/100km. But most of all, I took it for regular hills runs and suddenly understood what it was all about. I comprehensively smashed a whole variety of very very quick cars through tight hills runs with a combination of using all my 9000rpm, braking REALLY late and throwing the car in, and getting back on the power nice and early. Seriously, they stick and stick and stick.

All the people on here who feel they have the right to comment on Hondas without actually having owned or even been in one, I can still borrow my old EP3 off the previous owner - feel free to come and meet me in the hills some time and see if you can keep up.

[StealthX]

Yeah I'm sure they are quick and handle well etc..

But its still a Honda.

-By owning one you join the club of 18 year old Asian fanboys (no offence) who think they are the best cars on the road just due to 'vee tak'

-They have no presence or prestige.

-They reek of try hard.

-They are P plate cars.

-Most people in said group own them because they cant get a 'real' performance car (Evo, GTR, STI, etc...) due to money or laws.

I think its the image of the car that spoils them for me unfortunately. If honda brought out a RWD turbo coupe, I still don't think it consider buying one, just on principle (yes, i would miss out...)

Also as I've said before I think the hype of them outweighs their true performance. Having said that they DO perform well, just not up to the hype they have preceding them...

Torque FTW!

[gotRICE?]

Yeah I'm sure they are quick and handle well etc..

But its still a Honda.

-By owning one you join the club of 18 year old Asian fanboys (no offence) who think they are the best cars on the road just due to 'vee tak'

-They have no presence or prestige.

-They reek of try hard.

-They are P plate cars.

-Most people in said group own them because they cant get a 'real' performance car (Evo, GTR, STI, etc...) due to money or laws.

I think its the image of the car that spoils them for me unfortunately. If honda brought out a RWD turbo coupe, I still don't think it consider buying one, just on principle (yes, i would miss out...)

Also as I've said before I think the hype of them outweighs their true performance. Having said that they DO perform well, just not up to the hype they have preceding them...

Torque FTW!

And you think Skylines have a good image?

[StealthX]

Think 32 GTR, all the history it has with Group A racing in Australia alone, then the decades of drift culture in J - then consider the hundreds of references in video games, movies, TV shows and the media.

Then think of an Integra/Civic/Prelude. What comes to mind in motorsport? Not much. What comes to mind in Movies? Not much. What comes to mind in japanese car culture, again, not much - not half as much as Skylines/Silvias/Supras/Soarers/WRXs/EVOs etc...

But yeah I agree with what you say. In terms of public image Skylines don't exactly spring to mind as being nice, good, sensible, fast cars - especially in the eyes of the boys in blue.

[RB25PWR]

Skylines have a different image, it's associated with driving like an idiot. (Like it or not it's a wanker associated car) Honda integras don't have this image, I know which image I'd rather have.

A close friend of mine used to own a '99 DCR2, he let me drive it once. This was back when we were like 17, it felt pretty fast... however I didn't really have anything to compare it too. I'd say it's the best P plater car, handles really well, makes an awesome sound and is good on fuel.

I personally wouldn't buy one, the insurance costs more than my 33 would, the lack of torque and fwd just don't do it for me. And overall the car costs more to just buy...

[Iron Chef]

Yeah I'm sure they are quick and handle well etc..

But its still a Honda.

-By owning one you join the club of 18 year old Asian fanboys (no offence) who think they are the best cars on the road just due to 'vee tak'

-They have no presence or prestige.

-They reek of try hard.

-They are P plate cars.

-Most people in said group own them because they cant get a 'real' performance car (Evo, GTR, STI, etc...) due to money or laws.

I think its the image of the car that spoils them for me unfortunately. If honda brought out a RWD turbo coupe, I still don't think it consider buying one, just on principle (yes, i would miss out...)

Also as I've said before I think the hype of them outweighs their true performance. Having said that they DO perform well, just not up to the hype they have preceding them...

Torque FTW!

So what you're effectively saying is that they are half decent sports cars, but you're just biased against Hondas. Gotcha...

Edited April 25, 2010 by Iron Chef

[scathing]

As far as registerable Go-karts go Honda makes the best IMO...

You'd class Hondas as "the best registerable go karts" over Elises/Exiges, Caterhams, PRBs, Westfields and the like? Wow.

Since when was the EP3 Aussie delivered?? The JDM version IS the real thing! And all Civic Type Rs were made in the UK, even the EK9.

When did I saw the EP3 was Aussie delivered? The sentences you quoted have me saying that a DC5R and the FN2R were Australian delivered.

I could have sworn the EK9R and FD2R were both JDM only, with the EP3R and FN2R being British. I had a quick search on Google, and I haven't seen any info contrary to that.

All the people on here who feel they have the right to comment on Hondas without actually having owned or even been in one, I can still borrow my old EP3 off the previous owner - feel free to come and meet me in the hills some time and see if you can keep up.

You beating someone in an EP3R doesn't mean very much. You could just be a more experienced, or better, driver. A couple of months ago in the hills I ran into an SAU meet-up while I was driving my Swift GTI. That I managed to catch up to and stay with GTS-ts and GT-Rs doesn't mean the car I was driving is an omg tyte car bro that shits all over everything ever made.

I've got a mate who went from an NB MX-5 to a GC8 WRX and into an EP3R. He's looking at selling the thing. He says its a good car (like you he loves the economy, and for him he liked the storage capacity), but it's not that good as an actual sports car. It certainly fails to meet the hype. And, coming out of an NB, it's not like he's just never experienced a car with more chassis than torque.

For him, like me, its mostly the steering that kills it. We both hate the feel of torque steer, and much prefer the fingertip control that comes from RWD. He said that the car itself isn't bad, but its just not particularly good.

I personally would love an NSX-R. But I just can't see the attraction of the majority of the Type-R range. The DC2R is fun and a relatively good car compared to econobox hatchbacks, but it doesn't really meet the hype all the fanboys give it. The Aus-delivered DC5R (I've never read a review of the JDM DC5R), EP3R and FN2R are pretty underwhelming in the engine and chassis. They all lack the raw-edged feel of the DC2 and EK9 that gave the Type-R badge the reputation it had earned by then. The FD2R is meant to be an absolute weapon, and you can't argue with its speed, but its still the size and shape of a family sedan. It's like a HSV - quick, but nothing special.

[defari]

type r's handle like they are on rails.. but suffer badly with crap torque... decent track cars with the huge rpm and decent handling..

[scathing]

Yeah I'm sure they are quick and handle well etc..

But its still a Honda.

...and? Being biased against a vehicle out of blind bigotry rather than technical merit is why Porsche fans dismiss the GT-R despite the R35 setting faster laptimes under independent testing than their tarted-up Beetle.

While I agree with what you're saying, your justification for it does the cause few favours.

-By owning one you join the club of 18 year old Asian fanboys (no offence) who think they are the best cars on the road just due to 'vee tak'

As opposed to to the wankers that buy 2WD Skylines because of Gran Turismo and the fact that they look like the AWD ones people actually want?

-They reek of try hard.

See above.

-They have no presence or prestige.

The NSX has plenty of presence. And the GT-R doesn't have that much prestige either, especially when you ask Euro snobs or the average person on the street who just see a loud Datsun.

And you're in a soft roader made by the company that gave the world the 180B. Glass houses, dude.

-They are P plate cars.

So is a Lotus Elise/Exige/Evora. That Audi R8 TDI, had the prototypes not repeatedly caught fire, would have also been P plate legal. Non-turbo Skylines and Silvias are also still popular with P platers, to a point where the NA versions cost more than the FI ones due to demand.

[StealthX]

...and? Being biased against a vehicle out of blind bigotry rather than technical merit is why Porsche fans dismiss the GT-R despite the R35 setting faster laptimes under independent testing than their tarted-up Beetle.

While I agree with what you're saying, your justification for it does the cause few favours.

As opposed to to the wankers that buy 2WD Skylines because of Gran Turismo and the fact that they look like the AWD ones people actually want?

See above.

The NSX has plenty of presence. And the GT-R doesn't have that much prestige either, especially when you ask Euro snobs or the average person on the street who just see a loud Datsun.

And you're in a soft roader made by the company that gave the world the 180B. Glass houses, dude.

So is a Lotus Elise/Exige/Evora. That Audi R8 TDI, had the prototypes not repeatedly caught fire, would have also been P plate legal. Non-turbo Skylines and Silvias are also still popular with P platers, to a point where the NA versions cost more than the FI ones due to demand.

yeah I guess i'm pretty biased. My dislike for hondas is pretty unfair too, just plain don't like them. No technical reasoning behind it at all... Didn't mean to offend anyone!!! Haha

[Iron Chef]

When did I saw the EP3 was Aussie delivered? The sentences you quoted have me saying that a DC5R and the FN2R were Australian delivered.

I could have sworn the EK9R and FD2R were both JDM only, with the EP3R and FN2R being British. I had a quick search on Google, and I haven't seen any info contrary to that.

Sorry, your original quote was ambiguous in the last sentence, so I misinterpreted it.

I don't think the EP3 is God's gift to the automotive world, hell if I did I'd still be driving it instead of the Evo 8 I bought to replace it.

But by the same token, it's stupid of people to hang shit on a car or a brand just because they don't understand the appeal.

On a side note, I had the opportunity to buy an NSX-R personally imported from Japan last year, but it came at precisely the wrong time for me to stretch my finances and grab it. It ended up up being sold back to Japan, what a crime.

Edited April 25, 2010 by Iron Chef

[Kaido_RR]

Type R are great,

One of the BEST Japenese production car around.

For some reason there is a miss conseption that they are slow, they are far from slow. I have 1st hand experience of seeing a type r beat many lighty mod s1x and r3x cars.

its amzazing seeing a DC2 Type R with just full exhaust and intake eat up an s15 with up boost, exhaust and airfilter.

people who have no idea shit on honda due to the image they have but they are great cars

[ARTZ]

You'd class Hondas as "the best registerable go karts" over Elises/Exiges, Caterhams, PRBs, Westfields and the like? Wow.

The average joe can afford a Honda!!!

I was thinking of budget everyday cars such as integras civics and even the old crxs..which is what this thread was was about, I would hardly put these cars is in the same class...

But while your here the s2000 and Aerial Atom can put up a good fight with the cars you listed

Most people that have a let a Honda into there life for a period of time will have a soft spot for them, those that have driven one around the block will say its not as good as skyline or wrx, and in some ways there right. In others there all wrong...

Edited April 26, 2010 by faggywaggy

[benkoau]

My first Japanese car was a Honda CRX it didn't have a body kit or subs the only thing it had was 17 inch rims and very sticky tires and yes a skyline or a Holden or ford would smash it in a straight line but that wasn't where the fun lay with that particular car.

Yes in everyday traffic it lacks low down torque as you have been complaining but that's not the point of the car it really comes into own when you're in the twisties and you're working the sweetly gated gear box and keeping the engine in the sweet zone where it generates its power you wont be the fastest on the track/hills but you will be having a lot of fun.

The thing that concerns me about this conversation is you are so quick to judge please understand there are horses for courses straight line speed is awesome but what is better is all round balance.

It wasn't a type r but i do understand where and why honda has so many type r fans.

[willL]

I remember beating a tricked out DC5 type R in my old ratty aussie 31

I was actually quite shocked, thought it would have had alot more omph, it was screaming its ass off. Although I gather it was a shitty ADM model

How big is there difference between JDM and ADM DC5's etc

[eightsixboy]

FWD = fail for handling, know matter how much someone might try to convince you it has being proven time and time again that rwd and or awd is alot better. I always look at the integra's as a cheap sports car. Honda's real sports cars are the s2000 and the nsx.

And yes i have driven a type r and type s before, both very boring to drive, no torque at all and fail turn in. Saying that a friends prelude (jdm version) was fairly quick in a straight line, but that was the 2.2 vtec not the 1.6 or 1.8.

[ARTZ]

I agree,no real sports car should be FWD...so they fail as a sports car, but as hot hatches they are great

Integras tend to be heavier than the hatches and i believe the engines are the same, so better of with a hatch

I've heard of preludes running mid 12s with some mild mods but there not good for much else..

[JoelyMoley]

as much as i hate hondas, god damn that makes a nice noise!

[Iron Chef]

FWD = fail for handling, know matter how much someone might try to convince you it has being proven time and time again that rwd and or awd is alot better. I always look at the integra's as a cheap sports car. Honda's real sports cars are the s2000 and the nsx.

And yes i have driven a type r and type s before, both very boring to drive, no torque at all and fail turn in. Saying that a friends prelude (jdm version) was fairly quick in a straight line, but that was the 2.2 vtec not the 1.6 or 1.8.

Again, it depends on your definition of sports.

I prefer the feel of a RWD car to FWD car like most people on here probably, but put a FWD on a dirt track and it will smash an equivalent RWD car. I do the odd dirt motorkhana event with my brother-in-law and there are all sorts of RWD cars there with reasonable horsepower (my brother drives an R30 that slides beautifully - no good for times but lots of fun), the current championship leader drives a 1985 Laser....

And there are plenty of good-handling FWD cars out there - go take a Renault Megane or Clio RS for a hills run and see what you think then.