Type R (rocket Or Bucket?)

[Marlin]

My eyes hurt.

[Marcus89]

lol the first 3 pages of this thread went to shit had to keep skipping stuff and trying to sort through the real information and girly whinging.

As people have said the Honda's are very good cars. Really if you do the basic power upgrades to a honda you will have plenty of useable power for the street (keyword being useable). Even for the track the power will be enough too keep up with the heavier but much more powerful cars. I looked at them for a while but was put off that they were slower (straight line) than a lot of other cars in the price range while still being stupidly expensive on insurance. After i sell my r34 i'll probably look at hot hatches but something more along the lines of xr5 turbo, Golf GTi ect..

[gotRICE?]

lol the first 3 pages of this thread went to shit had to keep skipping stuff and trying to sort through the real information and girly whinging.

As people have said the Honda's are very good cars. Really if you do the basic power upgrades to a honda you will have plenty of useable power for the street (keyword being useable). Even for the track the power will be enough too keep up with the heavier but much more powerful cars. I looked at them for a while but was put off that they were slower (straight line) than a lot of other cars in the price range while still being stupidly expensive on insurance. After i sell my r34 i'll probably look at hot hatches but something more along the lines of xr5 turbo, Golf GTi ect..

Depends on where/when your talking about for being slow in a straight line.

My current R33 GTS25t 13.7 @ 105mph (10psi, Turboback exhaust, stock intake)

my old Integra Type R 13.7 @ 100mph (I/H/E)

To be fair, the ITR was using some old RA1's. But id say that the 255 Adrenalins on the Skyline would be a close to fair match for a pair of old hard shot RA1's.

So the Skyline, although not as quick off the line took the entire 1/4 mile to gain any ground on the ITR. Bugger all in it really.

The argument could go around in circles forever to be honest. Its just a fact that most people hate Hondas with no real reason for it.

[StealthX]

as much as i hate hondas, god damn that makes a nice noise!

I highly doubt that's a 400whp turbo supra lol

and that's def not a near stock k20...

Impossible.

Must be a Pretty shit supra driver too, looks like he's trying to accellerate from 6th gear haha

and I don't see how people think these engines sound good, I thought it sounded like arse!!!

[tadrosone]

Ive been pretty much surrounded by hondas as ive just come of my Ps and bought a gtst s2.

In the group of mates theres a DC2R, FN2R, DC5R, s2000 and heaps of worked vti-rs and ive driven most of them over the past 2 years.

for what they are, they are awsome cars. Its understanding the philosophy they are built on.

they are designed to give you that adrenaline rush when you hit vtec and it feels like this endless climb of power considering its all there from 5400/6000-8500/9000rpm. its the feeling that you can go all the way there without worrying you are going to blow a turbo or a ringland seal. My gtst barely beat them in a straight line when i just had a catback and 10psi. Now i got the tbe, front mount and reflash it just reflects the gains a turbo has mod-for-mod compared to a b18 or k20. But, one of the guys has an eg with a type s motor - k20az, and that hauls. on street tyres runs a 12.8 with wheelspin in 3rd gear.

The handling is where they shine as well. of course they suffer from tourque steer, but you dont drive it like you drive a rwd/awd car. its carrying the speed through the corners and foot of the accelerator, in 2nd and basically by the time you are at the exit of the corner you are in vtec already and you can just pull through.

I cant stand people giving opinions based on the shit they heard on top gear or some article. They just offer feedback, go and drive the car yourself. The FN2R is by far the nicest to drive out of the lot, considering it is the newest, however it isnt as slow as everyone thinks it is, and im hearing this bs about the DC2R being the rawest. the dc2r is the rawest in the sense you feel every bump, handles good until the slightest bit of accelerator and 1.8 toruque lag, and in a straight line the others have it all over the dc2r. its the rawest in an interfering way. It was a great NA in '99 when australia was first exposed to type r vtec goodness but the dc5r is simply a better car. the fn2r is a great all round package. the s2000 however, remains one of the best cars ive driven. its that feeling i got when i drove my cousins c63 amg black series, theres all this power, but everything works together in harmony. the car feels balanced and can handle that power. in the s2000, sitting really low, the short shifter at the height of your chest and the steering wheel in your face, you feel like in a race car, and feels like one as well.

Hondas are great cars, because they perform according to what they were designed to do, handle crazy, give you that feeling when tec is on yet you can drive it around town as if it were a corolla. I dont own one or intend to buy one because its not what i look for in a car. I like my r33 because ialways wanted a rwd turbo coupe and it suits my driving style.

I hate all this shit about paying out the other car when they have no idea what is going on. Each car has its good and bad points, however it does not mean you can straight away place it in the catagory of being a POS. You dont like it, good for you, get back on your bike but dont rule it as a piece of shit because everyone is entitled THEIR choice of car.

[JoelyMoley]

I highly doubt that's a 400whp turbo supra lol

and that's def not a near stock k20...

Impossible.

Must be a Pretty shit supra driver too, looks like he's trying to accellerate from 6th gear haha

and I don't see how people think these engines sound good, I thought it sounded like arse!!!

yea in some videos it looks like the supra is running on reds and not shifting, but i was refering more to the sound, it just sounds f**king mean

[Iron Chef]

Ive been pretty much surrounded by hondas as ive just come of my Ps and bought a gtst s2.

In the group of mates theres a DC2R, FN2R, DC5R, s2000 and heaps of worked vti-rs and ive driven most of them over the past 2 years.

for what they are, they are awsome cars. Its understanding the philosophy they are built on.

they are designed to give you that adrenaline rush when you hit vtec and it feels like this endless climb of power considering its all there from 5400/6000-8500/9000rpm. its the feeling that you can go all the way there without worrying you are going to blow a turbo or a ringland seal. My gtst barely beat them in a straight line when i just had a catback and 10psi. Now i got the tbe, front mount and reflash it just reflects the gains a turbo has mod-for-mod compared to a b18 or k20. But, one of the guys has an eg with a type s motor - k20az, and that hauls. on street tyres runs a 12.8 with wheelspin in 3rd gear.

The handling is where they shine as well. of course they suffer from tourque steer, but you dont drive it like you drive a rwd/awd car. its carrying the speed through the corners and foot of the accelerator, in 2nd and basically by the time you are at the exit of the corner you are in vtec already and you can just pull through.

I cant stand people giving opinions based on the shit they heard on top gear or some article. They just offer feedback, go and drive the car yourself. The FN2R is by far the nicest to drive out of the lot, considering it is the newest, however it isnt as slow as everyone thinks it is, and im hearing this bs about the DC2R being the rawest. the dc2r is the rawest in the sense you feel every bump, handles good until the slightest bit of accelerator and 1.8 toruque lag, and in a straight line the others have it all over the dc2r. its the rawest in an interfering way. It was a great NA in '99 when australia was first exposed to type r vtec goodness but the dc5r is simply a better car. the fn2r is a great all round package. the s2000 however, remains one of the best cars ive driven. its that feeling i got when i drove my cousins c63 amg black series, theres all this power, but everything works together in harmony. the car feels balanced and can handle that power. in the s2000, sitting really low, the short shifter at the height of your chest and the steering wheel in your face, you feel like in a race car, and feels like one as well.

Hondas are great cars, because they perform according to what they were designed to do, handle crazy, give you that feeling when tec is on yet you can drive it around town as if it were a corolla. I dont own one or intend to buy one because its not what i look for in a car. I like my r33 because ialways wanted a rwd turbo coupe and it suits my driving style.

I hate all this shit about paying out the other car when they have no idea what is going on. Each car has its good and bad points, however it does not mean you can straight away place it in the catagory of being a POS. You dont like it, good for you, get back on your bike but dont rule it as a piece of shit because everyone is entitled THEIR choice of car.

Well said!

[defari]

Type R are great,

One of the BEST Japenese production car around.

For some reason there is a miss conseption that they are slow, they are far from slow. I have 1st hand experience of seeing a type r beat many lighty mod s1x and r3x cars.

its amzazing seeing a DC2 Type R with just full exhaust and intake eat up an s15 with up boost, exhaust and airfilter.

lol were the other cars parked? If your talking about straight line speed, Ill give you all my money / car / belongings if you can get a type r beating my mildly modded r33

and for what its worth, i do like type r's, i think they handle brilliantly, they look decent, interior is quite nice, fuel consumption was pretty good... i just couldnt stand the lack of torque.

Edited April 26, 2010 by defari

[eightsixboy]

Lol that vid was mad, damn americans and thre v8's haha. But yea i doubt thats a standard motor, the way that thing revs up almost sounds like a race built engine.

[defari]

i know its offtopic but its still a honda

[oh-so-swift]

Cost big bucks to get an integra/civic to run with the big boys (skyline, F6, sti, evo, 200sx, S4, R36 passat ect) They are fun to drive, but it would be annoying to have to completly hammer/reline your car to have to get anywhere. . . . it would feel like constant turbo lag with out the big surger of power at the end.. most civic/integra's get K20, H22 transplant doesnt come cheap and not that big a difference in performance. You need a turbo to really get anywhere .. heheh (for honda)

Accord Euro would have been nice in Type R, now that i would consider!

[Gunnar_11]

Type R Honda's are not straight line quick and to make them quick it's expensive. In saying that wringing their necks out through corners is to die for; just to agile and neutral. They're a fun drive.

[scathing]

I don't think the EP3 is God's gift to the automotive world, hell if I did I'd still be driving it instead of the Evo 8 I bought to replace it.

Some people think that Hondas are, though. Honda's low end vehicles makes fun econoboxes - the problem is that the fanboys think that because they're faster than a Tiida or a Lancer VRX that they should be considered as sports cars. They're not.

But by the same token, it's stupid of people to hang shit on a car or a brand just because they don't understand the appeal.

What if there isn't an appeal within the context we're talking about, and the fans are just mentally handicapped? Some people actually like the Tiburon as sports cars, despite them not being particularly fast or good to drive. And don't get me started on douches in S-Pack Falcodores who think they should be starting on the front row at Mt Panorama.

Lets face it, a 6 cylinder Falcodore is a cheap KISS-engineered car for carrying a bunch of people long distances while towing a load. But its not a real sports car by any stretch of the imagination, and the street-racing bogans that do are a few drops short of a piss.

I would personally love an EP3R as a daily. I am a big fan of the K20A, and the chassis is "fun enough" while allowing me to carry rear passengers or a whole bunch of gear with the rear seats folded down. But then if I was forced into the ranks of bum dragging hot hatchery, I'd much rather save a few grand extra and buy a Mk V Golf GTI instead.

How big is there difference between JDM and ADM DC5's etc

About 15kW at the flywheel, and if I remember correctly the chassis in the JDM cars received a bit more lightening and strengthening.

im hearing this bs about the DC2R being the rawest. the dc2r is the rawest in the sense you feel every bump

Erm, when it comes to cars that would be the definition of "raw". How is that BS then? Hop out of a DC2R and into an FN2R or a DC5R and they are a lot more cosseted and remote. It doesn't mean that they're slower or worse, but they're just not as direct. My mate's old 1969 VW Beetle is even more raw than a DC2R, but that doesn't mean that it's a better car. It just doesn't feel the same.

I only used "raw" as a positive when describing the DC2R in the context of the Type-R philosophy. The EK9R and DC2R were built on the principle of being stripped out lightweight specials, and a lot more communicative in all the control surfaces than their base-model brethren. A part of the "track day special" tag is how the car responds to driver input. And its that "rawness" that got a lot of people into the Type-R brand, which gave it the reputation it earned.

The DC5R and FN2R lack that same feeling. It trades on the Type-R name, but it doesn't deliver a TYpe-R experience. They're faster versions than their base model brethren, but they don't give the same increase in sensations while they do it. I've driven a DC5S as well as a couple of DC5Rs, and behind the wheel there's not much in it unless you really press on. However, hopping out of a DC2 VTiR into a DC2 Type-R is a much more noticable change as soon as you start driving.

You dont like it, good for you, get back on your bike but dont rule it as a piece of shit because everyone is entitled THEIR choice of car.

How is one related to the other? Just because someone is entitled to their choice of car doesn't mean that they can't choose something shit. People choose shit cars all the time.

Secondly, if someone doesn't like something then logically it would be "shit" to that person. Everyone is as entitled to come to a conclusion about a car just as much as they're entitled to their choice of car.

The average joe can afford a Honda!!!

If you meant "affordable", then say "affordable". Most of us aren't mind readers.

For what its worth, you can build a Mazda MZR-powered widebody PRB for around $30K on the road. You can pick up used ones ones for the low to mid $20K, most of which rock 4AGEs but some have SR20DETs. That's DC2R/DC5R pricerange.

Used Elises have dropped into the mid-$30K to $40Kish range, which puts it in FN2R territory.

I was thinking of budget everyday cars[...]I would hardly put these cars is in the same class...

I wouldn't put any "go kart" in the same class as an "everyday car" either. But that's what you were (apparently) talking about, so that's what I responded to.

And an Elise is quite dailyable for a 2 seater (like a S2K) - I've got quite a few mates that do. The only compromise is that you have to leave the roof on, since fitting it is a pain in the arse.

But while your here the s2000 and Aerial Atom can put up a good fight with the cars you listed

The S2K will not put up that good a fight against cars with about 80% the power but only 60% of the weight (and, in the case of the PRB, they're less than half the weight and you can option them with the F20C). The Ariel Atom isn't a Honda. It uses a Honda powerplant, but that's pretty much irrelevant. An Elfin MS8 uses a LS1, but that doesn't mean a Commodore is fast.

Most people that have a let a Honda into there life for a period of time will have a soft spot for them

Most car enthusiasts always have a soft spot for their first cars, no matter how rubbish they are. The amount of people I know who fondly reminisce about their Geminis, Volvos, Camiras, etc is quite high since it was their first taste of "freedom" without all the responsibility that comes with adulthood. Most of those people aren't stupid enough to delude themselves into thinking that the cars weren't shitboxes, though.

That lack of self-delusion is what separates the rest of the world from Honda fanboys.

[Kaido_RR]

lol were the other cars parked? If your talking about straight line speed, Ill give you all my money / car / belongings if you can get a type r beating my mildly modded r33

and for what its worth, i do like type r's, i think they handle brilliantly, they look decent, interior is quite nice, fuel consumption was pretty good... i just couldnt stand the lack of torque.

what do you class as mildly modded?

exhaust, fmic and some boost? if so. i will be more than happy to bring a camera along with me next time to prove to you.

DC2 Type R has what 200hp stock and weights around the 1200kg region

R33 normally have anywhere between 200-300hp mildly modded and weight 1450kg?

Type r runs a close ratio gear box too so they have better acceleration.

what this video skip to 7min

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=llwHXbjtp6g

the DC2 R v's s14a (both stock).

guess who wins?

I'm not saying they are super quick but can hold their own, with the right bolt on mods

Edited April 26, 2010 by Kaido_RR

[ARTZ]

Some people think that Hondas are, though. Honda's low end vehicles makes fun econoboxes - the problem is that the fanboys think that because they're faster than a Tiida or a Lancer VRX that they should be considered as sports cars. They're not.

What if there isn't an appeal within the context we're talking about, and the fans are just mentally handicapped? Some people actually like the Tiburon as sports cars, despite them not being particularly fast or good to drive. And don't get me started on douches in S-Pack Falcodores who think they should be starting on the front row at Mt Panorama.

Lets face it, a 6 cylinder Falcodore is a cheap KISS-engineered car for carrying a bunch of people long distances while towing a load. But its not a real sports car by any stretch of the imagination, and the street-racing bogans that do are a few drops short of a piss.

I would personally love an EP3R as a daily. I am a big fan of the K20A, and the chassis is "fun enough" while allowing me to carry rear passengers or a whole bunch of gear with the rear seats folded down. But then if I was forced into the ranks of bum dragging hot hatchery, I'd much rather save a few grand extra and buy a Mk V Golf GTI instead.

About 15kW at the flywheel, and if I remember correctly the chassis in the JDM cars received a bit more lightening and strengthening.

Erm, when it comes to cars that would be the definition of "raw". How is that BS then? Hop out of a DC2R and into an FN2R or a DC5R and they are a lot more cosseted and remote. It doesn't mean that they're slower or worse, but they're just not as direct. My mate's old 1969 VW Beetle is even more raw than a DC2R, but that doesn't mean that it's a better car. It just doesn't feel the same.

I only used "raw" as a positive when describing the DC2R in the context of the Type-R philosophy. The EK9R and DC2R were built on the principle of being stripped out lightweight specials, and a lot more communicative in all the control surfaces than their base-model brethren. A part of the "track day special" tag is how the car responds to driver input. And its that "rawness" that got a lot of people into the Type-R brand, which gave it the reputation it earned.

The DC5R and FN2R lack that same feeling. It trades on the Type-R name, but it doesn't deliver a TYpe-R experience. They're faster versions than their base model brethren, but they don't give the same increase in sensations while they do it. I've driven a DC5S as well as a couple of DC5Rs, and behind the wheel there's not much in it unless you really press on. However, hopping out of a DC2 VTiR into a DC2 Type-R is a much more noticable change as soon as you start driving.

How is one related to the other? Just because someone is entitled to their choice of car doesn't mean that they can't choose something shit. People choose shit cars all the time.

Secondly, if someone doesn't like something then logically it would be "shit" to that person. Everyone is as entitled to come to a conclusion about a car just as much as they're entitled to their choice of car.

If you meant "affordable", then say "affordable". Most of us aren't mind readers.

For what its worth, you can build a Mazda MZR-powered widebody PRB for around $30K on the road. You can pick up used ones ones for the low to mid $20K, most of which rock 4AGEs but some have SR20DETs. That's DC2R/DC5R pricerange.

Used Elises have dropped into the mid-$30K to $40Kish range, which puts it in FN2R territory.

I wouldn't put any "go kart" in the same class as an "everyday car" either. But that's what you were (apparently) talking about, so that's what I responded to.

And an Elise is quite dailyable for a 2 seater (like a S2K) - I've got quite a few mates that do. The only compromise is that you have to leave the roof on, since fitting it is a pain in the arse.

The S2K will not put up that good a fight against cars with about 80% the power but only 60% of the weight (and, in the case of the PRB, they're less than half the weight and you can option them with the F20C). The Ariel Atom isn't a Honda. It uses a Honda powerplant, but that's pretty much irrelevant. An Elfin MS8 uses a LS1, but that doesn't mean a Commodore is fast.

Most car enthusiasts always have a soft spot for their first cars, no matter how rubbish they are. The amount of people I know who fondly reminisce about their Geminis, Volvos, Camiras, etc is quite high since it was their first taste of "freedom" without all the responsibility that comes with adulthood. Most of those people aren't stupid enough to delude themselves into thinking that the cars weren't shitboxes, though.

That lack of self-delusion is what separates the rest of the world from Honda fanboys.

Look not all of us are on the same page or from the same lot ,So not all of us are talking about prestige or custom built sports cars,,

Fact is alot of us just deal with everyday cars mate, something you may have forgotten since your friends all bought lotus's

So theres no need to get your panties in a twist. Its a thread about Integras remember

Im sure if i cared i could point out every error made about every comment you made to, but i have better things to do..

FTR

I owned 3 geminis and they were all rubbish and i know that....also owned a leone and a cortina, also rubbish ,no soft spot just regrets

But Ill never forget my mates crx...that was fun

[oh-so-swift]

Yeh, they are the type of car you step out of saying "that was fun"

It felt quicker than it was. I remember i could hear the engine roar and being thrown back in my seat and jerked around. It felt very fast It sounded as though it was ready to launch into space LOL. But when matched up against my 1.3L-T(TD04L) it was kinda no match. And my car runs smooth as a bee, comfortable to drive, no massive force pulling you back, not rattling chassis or screaming engine, If you were to drive both cars, you would think mine was much slower because its smoother.

I guess thats the thrill of a type R then? People like the agressive ride, rough and tumble jerking around even though it feels faster then it is?

I LOVE inconspicuous cars, however i think Type R's are quite the opposite.

[Carbon 34]

Type R = Rocket

plus the tuners in USA have a huge list of go fast parts, there as common as a ford /holden over there

don't like front wheel peel but some of those drag Honda's can cane everything else

[Briggs]

I think people are getting a little preoccupied with straight line speed. The type-r was never really a power demon. What it does do well is make a huge amount of power for a 1.8 given it’s n/a, but more importantly it handles like it’s on rails. A good mate of mine has a 97 model integra type-r from japan that he lets me drive occasionally and although it’s not exactly inspiring in a straight line, when i take throught the twisties i can’t help but get out with a huge grin on my face. In an aside, he uses it at the track and last time we were at winton (short), he destroyed a guy in a 450hp supra simply by outbraking and having much more corner speed and the ability to get on the throttle earlier. Another bloke in an evo 9 was behind him and couldn’t get past, said Alex was lifting the inside wheel about 6 inches of the track through some corners.

At the end of the day the most fun vehicle i have has only 32kw, my go kart. A car doesn’t have to be fast in a line to be a good car to drive, people should really try one before commenting, they wont be disappointed if they find a nice bit of road.

Edited April 27, 2010 by Briggs

[mad082]

threads like this are why i spend most of my time, and ask any serious questions, in the wasteland. generally get more informative responses, LOL

[defari]

what do you class as mildly modded?

exhaust, fmic and some boost? if so. i will be more than happy to bring a camera along with me next time to prove to you.

DC2 Type R has what 200hp stock and weights around the 1200kg region

R33 normally have anywhere between 200-300hp mildly modded and weight 1450kg?

?

stock series 2 rb25det - twin-cam turbo 245 to 250 hp and 319 N·m

+ add the gains from full exhaust, intercooler, 10psi.. conservatively i think my barge would have close 280hp / 340-350 N.m

dc2 type R - 200hp, cant find a torque figure but 1.8L at a guess about 190-200 N.m all at a billion rpm

even my old 4age 20v with work done to it (1.6 vvt) i was sorta keeping up with type r's.. (0-100 a stock type r was only pulling 3-4 car lengths)