E85 Fuel Setup

[ARTZ]

Lol...yeah i know, but no doubt having the best of everything contributed to the final power figure..

[XRATED]

Anyhow i made my decision, 1000's going in, retune on PULP in the short term with plans for E85 towards end of the year. Will post results.

Good choice on the injectors... Very controllable even at idle. Did you see the ID2000 vid in a stock honda?

You can run an external pump inline with your nismo pump... no need for a surge tank to run an external pump. A single 044 being feed by another pump will increase it's flow capacity too. I'd shorten the feed line and install an inline pump/filter under the car.

So you want to put 28psi through a standard bottem end, good luck with that..

I drag raced a stock bottom end for 2 years+ street driving with 400rwkw, 26psi (no vac lines) and nitrous...

No luck needed.

[R31Nismoid]

^ Well you had luck. Whether you needed it or not

Plenty of others have not been able to achieve such results unfortunately. Too many factors involved and certainly not the norm.

[rob82]

Good choice on the injectors... Very controllable even at idle. Did you see the ID2000 vid in a stock honda?

You can run an external pump inline with your nismo pump... no need for a surge tank to run an external pump. A single 044 being feed by another pump will increase it's flow capacity too. I'd shorten the feed line and install an inline pump/filter under the car.

I drag raced a stock bottom end for 2 years+ street driving with 400rwkw, 26psi (no vac lines) and nitrous...

No luck needed.

You can also run an 044 in parallel in stead of inline with the intank pump this way they share the pressure so your flow rate is equal to an 044 at half the rail pressure.

[ARTZ]

I drag raced a stock bottom end for 2 years+ street driving with 400rwkw, 26psi (no vac lines) and nitrous...

Thats a good effort, What happened to it?

You can also run an 044 in parallel in stead of inline with the intank pump this way they share the pressure so your flow rate is equal to an 044 at half the rail pressure.

But its the flow rate that needs to be incresed with E85..

1 intank pump would work ,but at times it would work hard. Running another pump inline would help flow more without stressing either pump out A surge tank may not be needed but you can buy them for less than 100$ so i dont see a reason not to install one..

If the car is getting used daily with the occasional full throttle then the I'd think the intank Nismo would cope fine ...But if you plan on regularly giving it a hard time you may need that little extra insurance..

[rob82]

Thats a good effort, What happened to it?

But its the flow rate that needs to be incresed with E85..

1 intank pump would work ,but at times it would work hard. Running another pump inline would help flow more without stressing either pump out A surge tank may not be needed but you can buy them for less than 100$ so i dont see a reason not to install one..

If the car is getting used daily with the occasional full throttle then the I'd think the intank Nismo would cope fine ...But if you plan on regularly giving it a hard time you may need that little extra insurance..

Pump flow rate goes up with less pressure - hence if you remove the pressure you get more flow rate. I have used this fuel system on XR6T's running E85 up 450rwkw.

[ARTZ]

OK i see what you mean now..Also found this article which confirms what you say,

INCREASING THE FUEL FLOW RATE

You can increase the fuel flow rate by installing a larger fuel pump or by installing a second fuel pump. Installing a second fuel pump is the best solution for a modified street car as it allows you to wire the second pump separately so that it is only in use when extra performance is required. More often than not you'd be using a street race car for cruising. Under these conditions you would not need a high fuel flow rate, in fact, it would be best not to have a high fuel flow rate under these conditions as it will just increase the amount of fuel that circulates to the fuel rail and back to the tank. This will expose the fuel to heat, which is not good. You can wire the second pump to only operate when it is required by installing a pressure sensitive switch on the intake manifold, or by installing a microswitch on the throttle body.

The two pumps can be installed in parallel with each pump having its own fuel pickup, or in series with one pump pumping into a second pump. When you install two pumps in parallel, you increase the fuel flow rate; but the two pumps must be of equal capability. Here the fuel flow rate will be the sum of the fuel flow rate of the two pumps. When you install tow pumps in series, you increase the fuel pressure rather than the fuel flow rate. This is because the second pump is being force fed by the first pump and fuel pressure is increased between the two pumps. Hence the second fuel pump does not need to increase the fuel pressure by much to meet the fuel pressure set by the fuel pressure regulator. However, the fuel flow rate does not increase by much and will only be approximately 120% of the fuel flow rate of the largest pump.

Could you clarify how you would set this up, if you have an intank picking up fuel how would you run another pump in parallel externally as it would require an extra pickup...?

Would this also require running a bigger fuel line?

[discopotato03]

Just ignoring the numbers for a sec are you happy with the way it drives ATM . I would have thought that 290 at the wheels of a GTR should feel pretty good . I know many won't agree but if it impresses you as it is do you think the money needed to chase another 30 odd is worth it ?

A .

[JimmyRickard]

Semi related question. I am running a very similar setup to the OP and wanting to switch to E85. At what point do the fuel lines need to be replaced though? Upwards of 400kw?

Cheers!

[GDZ-14R]

Ok, update time.

The boost problem has been well truly resolved, it no longer hesitates to build boost after throttle shutting (ie. on/off). It is at full boost by 4.2k, slight spike and then steady to 20psi. Cams were dialed in with a bias towards midrange power and it put out 320rwkw. The best part is that it makes 250 by 4.5k and makes power all the way to redline. It had track semis at the time that were quite rough, made a lot of noise and vibrations on the dyno, so with street tyres and a power run next week should show an even better figure.

Previously felt dull down low and up high, with power tapering off after 6.5k. The previous tuner told me i had probs with potential valve float - glad i got a second opinion. Can't thank Yavuz and the boys from Unigroup enough for the end result!

Tip for anyone running genuine GTSS's and wanting to run more then 18psi, upgrade the actuators first.

[XRATED]

Thats a good effort, What happened to it?

200m into a eeeerm 'skid' with bad fuel and toooo much nitrous.... she just slowed down and started breaking down.

... I left the country the next day.

Semi related question. I am running a very similar setup to the OP and wanting to switch to E85. At what point do the fuel lines need to be replaced though? Upwards of 400kw?

Cheers!

wouldn't bother going bigger...

[R.3.2.G.T.R]

yeah get my tuning done by unigroup and very happy with them

what actuators did u upgrade to and how much?

[BB81DO]

Your lucky man, i gotta drive 1.5hours into the city to get E85. But im pritty sure holden realised some Eco crap last week that runs on E85 so hopefully it comes more avaible.

hey man , the 7 eleven at wyong is ment to be getting e85 soon , i am looking at doing the same thing in my gtst

[N1GTR]

Ok, update time.

The boost problem has been well truly resolved, it no longer hesitates to build boost after throttle shutting (ie. on/off). It is at full boost by 4.2k, slight spike and then steady to 20psi. Cams were dialed in with a bias towards midrange power and it put out 320rwkw. The best part is that it makes 250 by 4.5k and makes power all the way to redline. It had track semis at the time that were quite rough, made a lot of noise and vibrations on the dyno, so with street tyres and a power run next week should show an even better figure.

Previously felt dull down low and up high, with power tapering off after 6.5k. The previous tuner told me i had probs with potential valve float - glad i got a second opinion. Can't thank Yavuz and the boys from Unigroup enough for the end result!

Tip for anyone running genuine GTSS's and wanting to run more then 18psi, upgrade the actuators first.

Yavuz does great work. I might start calling him Yoda

Keep us updated with next weeks result?

[GDZ-14R]

No worries will pass on the udpate.

No upgraded actuators here, just the crappy HKS ones adjusted to start cracking at 12 psi by "Yoda". I can live with the tiny spike for now.

[N1GTR]

Semi related question. I am running a very similar setup to the OP and wanting to switch to E85. At what point do the fuel lines need to be replaced though? Upwards of 400kw?

Cheers!

You're welcome to come check out my setup if you like

I used the stock lines for feed lines and put an extra line in for the return to the surge tank. Works well and cost effective

[rad100]

no need to start a new thread..

my setup,

forged bottom end, tomei cams, plazmaman, gt3076 .82 ext gate, 740cc, z32.

gtr lift, surge tank, 044.

what power can i expect on e85 before my injectors come close to max?

cheers

[SimonR32]

550cc have been good for 350rwkw at their limit...

so 740cc should be good for around 470rwkw at their limit

So a lot more that the turbo is going to flow

[rad100]

on e85?

[(OO)Firty Free(OO)]

no need to start a new thread..

my setup,

forged bottom end, tomei cams, plazmaman, gt3076 .82 ext gate, 740cc, z32.

gtr lift, surge tank, 044.

what power can i expect on e85 before my injectors come close to max?

cheers

My 850 sards are seeing 100% at times with an intank 044(normally around low 90's)with 45psi base pressure at 350 ish rwkw, so somewhere around there i would think. Turbo will be near its max also from my experience.