Bnr32 Track Build

[Kaido_RR]

how do i go about checking the harmonic balance?

The plan is at the end of the year or beginning of next dec/jan time to install some hks cams and cam gears, do nismo belt, greddy light weight pully kit, replace oil and water pump. to help freshen the engine up and give it a better power range.

ATTESSA controller i was thinking of going the new hks one but not sure how it rates to Ruzik, as everything i have read (mainly the uk fourm) is that the unit one of the best out there.

Cheers for the info about the transfer case dj good to know about that stuff.

I think i will need afew track does to get sorted with the way the gtr drives, as i am uses to my rwd gts-t i think i will have to adjust my driving style as i was original using the r33 for drifting then slowly move into grip stuff.

Dj do you run in the speed events series? as that is what im looking at starting in for the moment.

Rowdyr32 cheers for the info about braking late etc as i think this is my number one problem watching in car videos from my last track car (were i got to know the wall ahaha) i was braking very late and also not very constant it was hard brake then ease off then hard again so very unstable, i think i still need to get use to the cc-rg endless pads and Stop my Grand turiousm style driving of extremely late and hard braking

[Marlin]

Rebuilding the transfer case is expensive. But it wont necessarilly need rebuilding.

The case has a series of clutch plates in it. Like all clutches (wet or dry) the are subject to wear. If you look at the manual you will see that Nissan offer a list of end plates/shims of different thicknesses. These make sure the clutch packs are in a range that allows the ATTESSA system to function as it should.

What happens is they get old, the gaps open up & then the system is slow to react. Hence you get oversteer.

So yeah, a new end plate may be all you need to make it work properly. Hell it may still be ok. So find that out first. The problem is that until you take the thing apart & measure it you don't know which shim size you need so the job takes a while.

The other thing to do is find a Ruzik ATTESSA controller. If they are still available. These are an important tuning aid for corner exit behaviour.

If the motor is ex an R33 then the oil pump should be ok as it is of the better type. Check you harmonic balancer to make sure it is still in good order though.

Its also worth remembering the paper filter that sits in the bottom of the ATTESSA canister in the boot falls to bits, is pumped up to the end of the pressure line, and is compressed into virtually a "clog".

The filter was an item that was meant to be replaced at service intervals, but most never were, out of site, out of mind.

The ATTESSA still works, but is slower due to this very dense restriction.

Everyone spends bucks and goes chasing worn clutches, or uses controllers, to get around what is, nine times from ten, a blockage.

The poor old 32 system gets a bad wrap for being slow, but it really wasn't when they were new. Most just need a good clean out.

[bigmikespec]

Its also worth remembering the paper filter that sits in the bottom of the ATTESSA canister in the boot falls to bits, is pumped up to the end of the pressure line, and is compressed into virtually a "clog".

The filter was an item that was meant to be replaced at service intervals, but most never were, out of site, out of mind.

The ATTESSA still works, but is slower due to this very dense restriction.

Everyone spends bucks and goes chasing worn clutches, or uses controllers, to get around what is, nine times from ten, a blockage.

The poor old 32 system gets a bad wrap for being slow, but it really wasn't when they were new. Most just need a good clean out.

Can those filters be replaced with new ones from Nissan... great info!

[Nee-san]

Its also worth remembering the paper filter that sits in the bottom of the ATTESSA canister in the boot falls to bits, is pumped up to the end of the pressure line, and is compressed into virtually a "clog".

The filter was an item that was meant to be replaced at service intervals, but most never were, out of site, out of mind.

The ATTESSA still works, but is slower due to this very dense restriction.

Everyone spends bucks and goes chasing worn clutches, or uses controllers, to get around what is, nine times from ten, a blockage.

The poor old 32 system gets a bad wrap for being slow, but it really wasn't when they were new. Most just need a good clean out.

whats the most effective way about flushing the system marlin ?

[Marlin]

Well, the system needs to be cleaned, so the best method is to remove the pipework post high pressure pump and find the remains of the filter, typically at a restriction point between the pump and transfer. Compressed air blown in the reverse direction will dislodge it but you must NOT just blow the blockage backwards up the system (yes, this is obvious I know )

The filters can be purchased new, but we just leave them out, not as if you're going to put dirty oil in there

Edited August 19, 2010 by Marlin

[Marlin]

Also, the Torque gauge on the dash is nothing to do with the actual pressure being delivered to transfer clutch plates.

The gauge runs off the ATTESSA computer input, and is what the computer would LIKE to have sent to the front, but if there's a blockage, it will only get a fraction of the required pressure, and/or be much slower to react.

[Nee-san]

Also, the Torque gauge on the dash is nothing to do with the actual pressure being delivered to transfer clutch plates.

The gauge runs off the ATTESSA computer input, and is what the computer would LIKE to have sent to the front, but if there's a blockage, it will only get a fraction of the required pressure, and/or be much slower to react.

Cheers, I should probably bleed it anyway as the engines just been out.

[djr81]

Everyone spends bucks and goes chasing worn clutches, or uses controllers, to get around what is, nine times from ten, a blockage.

Well said. To be honest even with a rebuilt ATTESSA system I still find that making changes to the way the ATTESSA functions via the Ruzik controller is a worthwhile exercise. Some circuits like more front bias to the torque distribution, some less.

The poor old 32 system gets a bad wrap for being slow, but it really wasn't when they were new. Most just need a good clean out.

Alot of GT-R's doing good lap times are heavilly reliant on their 4WD system & mega horsepower. Not everyone can have or even wants the latter but to get the old dears to punch out of the corners you have to have the former working well.

[Marlin]

All true mate.

I was just highlighting an overlooked fact that sometimes the basics of the system need to be working properly before a controller is usefull.

The Ruzic controllers work wonders on powered up cars, no doubt.

[djr81]

All true mate.

I was just highlighting an overlooked fact that sometimes the basics of the system need to be working properly before a controller is usefull.

The Ruzic controllers work wonders on powered up cars, no doubt.

The problem in all our advice is, well, really, where do you start?

You can't go near a track without the brakes being sorted.

You can't go round a corner without the tyres/suspension being sorted.

You can leave the corner without the Attessa & diffs being sorted.

You can't do anything much without the motor being sorted (for reliability anyway).

All that & the bloke still wants to drive it on the road.

It s a problem given the GT-R's that work on the track are laughable on the road. How does four or five degrees neg camber on the front end go over when plod pulls you up for a 'random' breath test?

[LotusGTR]

None of this stuff is any good if you have a blown motor. I know through bitter experience. I'd be spending my cash on reliability / oil control mods first, doing the best I could with all the other things and feeling my way into it and upgrading as time and money allow. The upgrade journey is fun. Worst than can happen (outside of your engine blowing) is you're not 'fast'. The improvement of which is something to look forward to with each mod and increased experience. My car does 1.25 (fast enough considering 400rwkw dedicated track cars in very good hands do 1.16) at Sandown in my hands which means it's got at least 5 seconds in it in the right hands, and it's an easy street car (bit loud, but then again I'm old), if not a daily.

So, if I was to pick from DJRs list I'd start with the motor.

The problem in all our advice is, well, really, where do you start?

You can't go near a track without the brakes being sorted.

You can't go round a corner without the tyres/suspension being sorted.

You can leave the corner without the Attessa & diffs being sorted.

You can't do anything much without the motor being sorted (for reliability anyway).

All that & the bloke still wants to drive it on the road.

It s a problem given the GT-R's that work on the track are laughable on the road. How does four or five degrees neg camber on the front end go over when plod pulls you up for a 'random' breath test?

[djr81]

None of this stuff is any good if you have a blown motor. I know through bitter experience. I'd be spending my cash on reliability / oil control mods first, doing the best I could with all the other things and feeling my way into it and upgrading as time and money allow. The upgrade journey is fun. Worst than can happen (outside of your engine blowing) is you're not 'fast'. The improvement of which is something to look forward to with each mod and increased experience. My car does 1.25 (fast enough considering 400rwkw dedicated track cars in very good hands do 1.16) at Sandown in my hands which means it's got at least 5 seconds in it in the right hands, and it's an easy street car (bit loud, but then again I'm old), if not a daily.

So, if I was to pick from DJRs list I'd start with the motor.

Well yeah. I guess not tearing up money by wrecking stuff would be the start point? So you look at the motor, the brakes, the tyres.

The motor is pretty obvious.

The brakes are harder. Brake fade, cracked/worn rotors & stuffed pads will be your lot until you upgrade them.

If your suspension isn't half way decent you will continually butcher tyres. At $500 a corner you don't want to do too much of that.

But you also need to learn to drive a car on a track. Which isn't easy.

Then you have to ask the question is the journey the fun bit or the destination. Take the front suspension as an example. I have been through more iterations that I've had hot dinners lately. So what advice do you give? Go to a set up that can provide all the caster/camber & grip you will eventually want. Or a lesser option that won't scare the pants off people on cold tyres but that works on the road?

[Marlin]

Yep! And all of these above points is why I steer clear of racing GTR's.

While they're a great road car (Had/have a couple), they need too much modification to be reliable on the track, and if they are made track reliable, the road driving suffers.

Its a viscous circle. Therefore I go back to my siuation for a mere financial mortal, learned from experience.

Nice GTR for the road, nice GTS-t for the track that smacks most GTR's. And the all up spend I venture to say would be less than the outlay for just a track prepped GTR.

[bri73y]

I'm with Marlin and I own a R32 GTR! If you want my 2 bob's worth start by not starting at all....

In the last 2 years I've not finished an event. I love my GTR but at some point you've gotta wonder if the $100+k invested is actually worth it.

My last two events were 6 timed laps at SprintBathurst in November, then 1.5 laps at Superlap in May. The car went from SprintBathurst to my mechanic and then from Superlap back to my mechanic. Guess what, it's still there..!! Why, Why, Why!!!

[Marlin]

And Brighty, your car is beautifully prepared and pretty much no expence spared. It's gorgeous!

I might sound sour, but I have just so much GTR heartbreak in my past. I honestly used to go to every track meeting expecting to break a $10k engine. Since going GTS-t, I'm a much more relaxed man. 2.5 years and 12,000 race kilometres on a factory sealed bottom end without so much as an oil cooler, my GTS-t finally needs a new set of big ends. Took me an hour to pull the donk and box last night, drunk.

Edited August 20, 2010 by Marlin

[LotusGTR]

DJR, I'm not sure what advice to offer? Yes, it's a heart ache and yes it's a beautiful thing (GTR fiddling). I guess my point is that it doesn't have to be that hard. Preserve the engine and drive around weaknesses in suspension, driveline, and brakes until they're sorted. Yes, you may break things and yes you won't be fast, but that's kinda tough. I agree with other comments here in that unless you have a lot to spend then you're going to be wanting getting a well turned out GTR to go reliably fast. Perhaps the GTST route is better......but I've not gone that way myself. And it's cost me....

Well yeah. I guess not tearing up money by wrecking stuff would be the start point? So you look at the motor, the brakes, the tyres.

The motor is pretty obvious.

The brakes are harder. Brake fade, cracked/worn rotors & stuffed pads will be your lot until you upgrade them.

If your suspension isn't half way decent you will continually butcher tyres. At $500 a corner you don't want to do too much of that.

But you also need to learn to drive a car on a track. Which isn't easy.

Then you have to ask the question is the journey the fun bit or the destination. Take the front suspension as an example. I have been through more iterations that I've had hot dinners lately. So what advice do you give? Go to a set up that can provide all the caster/camber & grip you will eventually want. Or a lesser option that won't scare the pants off people on cold tyres but that works on the road?

[Risking]

I do tend to agree.

Unless you have the budget to dry sump, atleast get a dog box, spend some good money on suspension and keep on spending then a GTR is not the best choice.

That said they can be a fun weekend warrior if your happy to leave things basic and just drive.

I raced my old car door to door for a few years and it cost me a massive amount over that time period. Spent more time fixing it than racing it actually.

It finished and won several meetings but the expense of keeping an engine fresh and turbos healthy etc etc was daunting. Mine was dry sumped with the best of everything as well.

[Roy]

So, for the OP...the advice is rob a servo, or do some tow aways with ATMs!

[LotusGTR]

I guess the OP has a GTR, so if it were me I'd get the engine out, get an extended and baffled sump, get the front subframe out and widen the front track, remove the 4ws, replace hoses, get an ally rad, an oil cooler, some good oil water temp gauges, oil pressure too. I'd put in a very safe tune and limit power. Not sure about brakes. Perhaps fronts only? Suspension, just go Tein SS from Yahoo and whiteline roll bars. Get it aligned by some who knows. Then go do.

[LotusGTR]

And cross fingers lol