Gt-r 40km/h Over. Need Your Help!

[Daleo]

Gosh, I'd love to be at a BBQ with you.

Yep,It'd be a ball having all your character flaws pointed out, right up to the point where someone smashed a bottle over his head and threw him in the fire .

The last few pages are a refreshing change from the usual "Just don't speed and you won't get caught" B.S. I can't believe actual car enthusiasts are starting to swallow the Government line on speed.

The OP wasn't denying anything, so the "waaahhh, waaahhh" is completely unnecessary.

Edited November 21, 2010 by Daleo

[wori]

OP, don't take this too harshly.

When you grab a drivers licence , on that day you are bound by a bunch of laws governing the use of the vehicle you drive with penalties for crossing the line.

Speeding is one everyone knows. 100kmh is the speed limit, you can go less than that but, not more than that.

If you know doing speeds over the speed limit are illegal and do them anyway. Then when you get caught you pay 'stupid tax'. Because by definition you are.

The ease at which a speed limit can be safely maintained is not even worth talking about.

Most of this "waaahhhh I was stuck behind a semi and HAD to go 40kmh over because it is safer.." equates to " waaahh I was stuck behind a semi doing the speed limit because I was speeding for the last 20km and caught up to it and it made me do the speed limit and that makes me cry more waaaahhhh!"

Pay the fine for being stupid. And get smart (well smarter because even a dumb ass can understand this part of the law)

finally someone else with a bit of common sense 

[rev210]

Yep,It'd be a ball having all your character flaws pointed out, right up to the point where someone smashed a bottle over his head and threw him in the fire .

The last few pages are a refreshing change from the usual "Just don't speed and you won't get caught" B.S. I can't believe actual car enthusiasts are starting to swallow the Government line on speed.

The OP wasn't denying anything, so the "waaahhh, waaahhh" is completely unnecessary.

Hey not attempting to point out anything for the sake of being nasty, my appologies if it came off that way. I am encouraging actions that avoid paying huge fines , losing the use of your car and potentially killing or injuring people.Not that it may matter but, you can use less fuel too.The down sides are being 2-5 mins later to destinations in metro and 30min later in country areas.

We have a limited number of choices in the situation.

The cheap and easy way is to follow the law (even if it doesn't 'seem' right to you) and action your freedom to lobby your representatives to change it and vote that way if given the chance.

Sounds like you have awesome BBQs.

[Mayuri Krab]

My principle is:

If some bloody snail was driving say 20km/h under the limit, & then I proceed to overtake but as I was overtaking he bloody speeds up in an attempt to stop me from overtaking & I ended up having to speed up more to over take the f**k-wit & then I get done for speeding, I will gladly take the fine provided they fine the other douche bag equally (or more) for their bloody act...

Had my fair share of these bloody road saint snails (ranges from Taxis, Hyundai Getzs) who will drive 10 to 20 under the limit when you are behind, but as soon as you start your over/under taking maneuver they bloody speed up to stop you from over/under taking them...

Just my 2c

Had some taxi who was snailing along at 50km/h on a 70km/h zone single lane road, when the road split into 2 lanes I changed to the right & speed up to 70, but when I was about side by side next to him, he bloody floors it & matches up to my speed, the lanes are coming back into 1 again soon & at that time I had enough of his BS so I floored it & got the overtake done with & as soon as I merged back & dropped my speed back down to ~75km/h I see he was back to his usual snail @ 50km/h pace again (from my rear view mirror), so there you go... he bloody only speed up temporarily in an (failed) attempt to stop me from overtaking.

Edited November 21, 2010 by Mayuri Krab

[Beer Baron]

I can't agree with you more Baron. Further, I think we should all be banding together and nominating you as the public voice of The Australian Motorist.

a-thank you.

I am not the man with all the answers but a great portion of the behaviour on our roads can be directly attributed to the conditioning motorists have received via their government using advertising, speed enforcement and other so called 'education' programs.

But even worse is the level of penalties for various offences. Can you believe if I park in a 2hr parking zone and pay my $6.60 per hour (yes it costs nearly the minimum hourly wage to park a car on the street in areas of Sydney) but for whatever reason I arrive back to my car 3 minutes late I get a fine for "overstay parking" of $86. Now in this case my worst crime is costing the government 0.33 cents in parking revenue and possibly caused another motorist to have to find another space or wait 3 minutes for mine to become vacant.

Conversely if I attack the parking attendant writing the ticket by repeatedly punching him in the head and damage his face and cause him no end of mental problems stemming from this assault my most likely punishment (providing this is my first time assault just like above example was a first time 'overstay parking offence') is a good behaviour bond (which basically says I must obey the law or I'll get punished! isn't that true for every citizen? That we must obey the law or get punished?) and be fined court costs of $78.

So in short, overstay parking 3 minutes and cost government 0.33 cents = $86 fine

Cause another human being harm and untold mental pain with physical assault and get told you now must obey the law and get find $78.

Do not even start into the fitness of punishment we receive for speeding offences as the scales of justice are even further out of whack there.

If you don't believe me go along to your local court one day and watch proceedings. you will see plenty of lovely characters being charged with assault and drug offences and the majority of first time offenders get a section 10 (no conviction recorded), a good behaviour bond (aka being asked to obey the same rules as everyone else), and get charged court costs. You will even see it hapen to repeat offenders too who get bond on top of bond and probation on top of probation.

my issue is not so much that these people are being under-punished (though that is a problem for another discussion) but more so that the law is so out of whack when a person caught parking longer than he should gets more penalty and inconvenience that a man who assaults another human being. that is just mental.

[Beer Baron]

that's not even starting on the education aspect.

drivers have been told for years that "slow is safe" regardless of their attention level, or car maintenance schedule, or their re-tread tyres, they believe if they drive slowly they are driving safely. never mind they are blocking the road causing frustration for other motorists, never mind they are unaware of the motobike in the lane beside them. they are driving slowly so therefore are 'doing the right thing'. just look past the fact that they encroach into other lanes around corners, brake suddenly for no reason, fail to indicate wild lane changes. they are slow so nothing else matters about their driving. the government has told them so for years.

[wht510]

The nail has been hit squarely right dead set in the middle of the head.

+1 vote for Beer baron for coming to my BBQ. I'd shout the man a beer or two.

[Nee-san]

that's not even starting on the education aspect.

drivers have been told for years that "slow is safe" regardless of their attention level, or car maintenance schedule, or their re-tread tyres, they believe if they drive slowly they are driving safely. never mind they are blocking the road causing frustration for other motorists, never mind they are unaware of the motobike in the lane beside them. they are driving slowly so therefore are 'doing the right thing'. just look past the fact that they encroach into other lanes around corners, brake suddenly for no reason, fail to indicate wild lane changes. they are slow so nothing else matters about their driving. the government has told them so for years.

Short term thinking has aligned the attitude of the motoring public towards "covering your ass" such as in obeying and enforcing speed policy with a zeal not seen since Hitler established the SS rather then with concerning motorist with what really matters (safe and proper driving technique and standards).

[tatty000]

20km/h under the limit could be considered as bad driving... Might be worth throwing out there, maybe look up laws about unsafe driving at being too slow. People have been pulled over before for such circumstances (Friend did 10km/h in a 60 zone but not fined).

Otherwise, you could explain how unsafe it was to brake suddenly at the utes speed increase. Look up the stats for a ute like that, say a Holden SS, for example, and show how quickly he could jump from 60km/h to the claimed 122km/h, in what time bracket, use that for your advantage.

Then continue with how the amount of rainfall for that day, get the radius curvature for the right side of the road to show drainage, use the friction factor approximation of the road tar + potential dirt and/or small rock hazards, show approximate rainfall on the road, a linear presentation of braking distance to speed and conditions tyres are designed for and specs for tyre handling and show how it would be unsafe. Using mathematics, physics and material properties in the right context could be a winner... Maybe...

[Cowboy1600]

OP, don't take this too harshly.

When you grab a drivers licence , on that day you are bound by a bunch of laws governing the use of the vehicle you drive with penalties for crossing the line.

Speeding is one everyone knows. 100kmh is the speed limit, you can go less than that but, not more than that.

If you know doing speeds over the speed limit are illegal and do them anyway. Then when you get caught you pay 'stupid tax'. Because by definition you are.

The ease at which a speed limit can be safely maintained is not even worth talking about.

Most of this "waaahhhh I was stuck behind a semi and HAD to go 40kmh over because it is safer.." equates to " waaahh I was stuck behind a semi doing the speed limit because I was speeding for the last 20km and caught up to it and it made me do the speed limit and that makes me cry more waaaahhhh!"

Pay the fine for being stupid. And get smart (well smarter because even a dumb ass can understand this part of the law)

f**k off idiot. The law makes an ass of it's self every day.

Why should an otherwise good person (making an assumption there) have to do time walking for such a petty and potentially unlawful reason?

The day the law can be held in anything but compelte and utter comtempt is the day I will agree that if you don't want to do the time, don't do the crime.

[skyther]

Found this thread Googling for info on speeding fines.

A couple of hours ago I got flashed by a fixed speed/red light camera on Roe Hwy and Kalamunda Rd (WA) doing 40k's above the limit. I've had my license for 5 years and have never gotten any traffic infringements apart from a parking ticket from the City of Perth.

Was just cruising along at 100kph, on the way to grab dinner with the missus and all of a sudden an idiot in a Camry from behind puts on his high beams. I waited for a little, then slowed down to 60kph to let him pass and gave him a courtesy flash. He dipped his headlights and slowed down, so I pass him and he once again turns on his high beams. I sped up to put a little distance between us, and got flashed by the camera doing 120kph. The speed limit of the stretch leading to the lights is 80kph instead of the usual 100kph, which puts me at 40ks over the limit. I didn't get the Camry's rego, but it was a light blue 5th Gen.

Is it worth appealing the fine (when it arrives) or taking the matter to court or am I pretty much SOL? Money is an issue and lawyers aren't cheap, but I don't really fancy being fined $1k either.

[eastes]

Found this thread Googling for info on speeding fines.

A couple of hours ago I got flashed by a fixed speed/red light camera on Roe Hwy and Kalamunda Rd (WA) doing 40k's above the limit. I've had my license for 5 years and have never gotten any traffic infringements apart from a parking ticket from the City of Perth.

Was just cruising along at 100kph, on the way to grab dinner with the missus and all of a sudden an idiot in a Camry from behind puts on his high beams. I waited for a little, then slowed down to 60kph to let him pass and gave him a courtesy flash. He dipped his headlights and slowed down, so I pass him and he once again turns on his high beams. I sped up to put a little distance between us, and got flashed by the camera doing 120kph. The speed limit of the stretch leading to the lights is 80kph instead of the usual 100kph, which puts me at 40ks over the limit. I didn't get the Camry's rego, but it was a light blue 5th Gen.

Is it worth appealing the fine (when it arrives) or taking the matter to court or am I pretty much SOL? Money is an issue and lawyers aren't cheap, but I don't really fancy being fined $1k either.

I don't know if it's worth appealing yet. You usually have payment options if you have financial difficulties. It's the 6 month suspension that sucks more than the $1000 fine for me. Do you have a similar suspension law in WA ?

[eastes]

I loved Beer Barons post about the story of the 3min parking too long VERSUS the beating up the inspector and which receives a worse fine.

To rev210... I haven't taken offence, although I think you might find people are more receptive if you review your technique of sharing your opinion. At the moment, it is hard for one to listen and appreciate your words fully. I do know what you were trying to say if I take out some parts. 99% of the time, I think most people on here agree with your points. If you read all my posts, you'll see I don't wish to choose the options of lying in court nor some others options like you were suggesting. I do want to be penalised, just not so harshly in this case.

I understand that there are people who have unfortunately been exposed to death or injury due to speeding in some way and I understand that it'd be very difficult to show any co-operation in this discussion. Rest assured, most car enthusiasts are on your side and do not support nor condone unsafe driving on the street. This is usually reserved to the hoons who make us look bad.

UPDATE: The court summons has arrived. January 14th is the date. I'm 10% sure I'm going to have any success. Plan now is to speak more to a solicitor and spend a day in court for preparation.

[skyther]

I don't know if it's worth appealing yet. You usually have payment options if you have financial difficulties. It's the 6 month suspension that sucks more than the $1000 fine for me. Do you have a similar suspension law in WA ?

No license suspension in WA but over 45km/h above the limit and your car gets impounded for 2 days. I'm dead certain I wasn't 45k's over when I got flashed, but 40 is plausible. 1k is a fair amount - car rego is due next week... also needs new tyres and the auto box is on it's last legs :S

In all honesty I didn't even notice the speed limit signs due to distraction from the glare. I should have taken the dickhead's rego down, but I doubt it will hold up in court anyway.

[eastes]

No license suspension in WA but over 45km/h above the limit and your car gets impounded for 2 days. I'm dead certain I wasn't 45k's over when I got flashed, but 40 is plausible. 1k is a fair amount - car rego is due next week... also needs new tyres and the auto box is on it's last legs :S

In all honesty I didn't even notice the speed limit signs due to distraction from the glare. I should have taken the dickhead's rego down, but I doubt it will hold up in court anyway.

If you want to delay the fine, you can appeal at first, wait for notice to appear in court, then just plead guilty before the court date and the fine process will then begin. I think that would work here. Not sure about WA though sorry.

Edited November 27, 2010 by eastes

[fib]

Sorry to hear about your situation eastes, hope things turn out well. I'm pretty sure some of us here will get into the same situation.

One thing you might consider is to plead guilty and ask for leniency, with at least two character references. You can reduce the 6 month suspension down to 2 months. My wife had lost her licence for consistently racking up speeding tickets and this was what we did. Not the same situation as yours though.

[Iron Chef]

Hey not attempting to point out anything for the sake of being nasty, my appologies if it came off that way. I am encouraging actions that avoid paying huge fines , losing the use of your car and potentially killing or injuring people.Not that it may matter but, you can use less fuel too.The down sides are being 2-5 mins later to destinations in metro and 30min later in country areas.

We have a limited number of choices in the situation.

The cheap and easy way is to follow the law (even if it doesn't 'seem' right to you) and action your freedom to lobby your representatives to change it and vote that way if given the chance.

Sounds like you have awesome BBQs.

*facepalm*

Admit it, you eat vegie burgers and drink low-fat soy lattes at your BBQs....

[Beer Baron]

I have a good example for you of our great system in action.

I own a number of cars (5 at the moment but the number fluctuates a bit) and 2 motorbikes. I have one etag. Simply because I can only drive one vehicle at a time.

For whatever reasons the etags rarely work on the bikes. I have tried affixing them to the bike, no good. my only option is to keep it in my pocket and as I approach ride 1 handed while I fish it out with the other hand (got to be more dangerous than riding 60 in a 50 zone surely) then ride through the toll plaza holding it up in front of me. It works about 50% of the time or less. To me that says these tags are faulty. Anyway as a result I get a LOT of toll notices. I go online, put in my tag details and pay them. however as the tag is on auto top up and I have no way of checking it's balance there is no guarantee when I put through a bunch of notices that they will all be paid despite completing the process successfully. To further compound it on one providers website if I owe them five trips when I enter in the first toll notice it then lists the other 5 as one line item so I cannot see which 5 I'm actually paying and just have to guess which notices they correspond to. I have had over a hundred of these in the last year or two. Of them 1 somehow slipped through the cracks and did not get paid.

That notice was refereed to the State Debt Recovery Office where they imposed an additional $150!! for a debt of $4.50. What other organisation could charge such an exorbitant interest rate on a $4.50 debt. It would be illegal. Also bear in mind that I had a tag, used the tag and attempted to do the right thing. Why should one small journey cost me $150?

When I received the letter it states 2 options. Either pay the notice (don't want to) or go to court (also don't want to). Surely a local court is not the right venue to resolve a debt of $4.50?

So instead I wrote a letter, explaining what had happened. I explained that I was and still am happy to pay the toll owing of $4.50 but feel that $150 extra is not reasonable. I also stated I did not want to go to court but since they had only given 2 boxes on the form I ticked the court election box but hoped with my letter sense would prevail and they'd waive the fine.

I was wrong. I get a letter back stating that they could have 'reviewed' my fine (never mentioned in the correspondence they sent me) but that since I had ticked the court election box (despite my letter clearly stating I did not wish to go to court to waste tax payers money and lose a days pay of my own) they were obliged to send me to court anyway?!?! unbelievable.

So I decided I would enter an early guilty plea but write a letter explaining the mitigating circumstances and quite sure the magistrate would see reason and rule that the $4.50 be paid and the additional $150 and any court costs be waived. How naive am I?

I received a simple letter back with NO explanation of the ruling stating that the court ruled I owe $150 fine + $79 court costs a new total of $229 for a $4.50 toll that I tried to pay multiple times?!? I wish I had wasted that days pay and at least got my $79 worth of court time so I could hear what the magistrate had to say. it must have been good because they didn't include it in any documentation they sent to me.

Great system we have. needless to say out of fear I happily paid the $229...

[R31Nismoid]

The nail has been hit squarely right dead set in the middle of the head.

+1 vote for Beer baron for coming to my BBQ. I'd shout the man a beer or two.

lol you'll wanna be careful with that, he's a bit suspect...

[ras1983]

Beer Baron, you've made many, many good points. I'm personally sick and tired of the governments demonising motorists and misinforming people about 'safe driving'. In fact there was a great article on Autospeed about safe driving and median speeds.

http://autospeed.com/cms/A_1234/printArticle.html

And for those people saying that this is the law and we should be punished if we don't abide by the law, THE SYSTEM ALLOWS US TO DEFEND OURSELVES AGAINST LEGAL ACCUSATIONS! So think twice before saying something to the effect of "don't whine like a b*tch and just pay the fine/lose your licence".

OP, good luck mate, I'm interested to see how this whole thing pans out.