[Closed] Borg Warner Efr Series Turbos

[VFRegal]

5 hours ago, HarrisRacing said:

 

Yep. No way to keep boost high enough on top end without changing duty cycle throughout rpm. Mine is almost linear on duty cycle for rpms after it onsets.

You mean it increases linearly, not you have a flat duty cycle ?

Is yours IWG ?

[HarrisRacing]

Yes IWG. And yes increases pretty much linearly.

I posted a log on here not far back. If you download the haltech datalog viewer you can see my output duty cycle on the logs under "boost control output" (which is controlled by open loop) and also my "base duty cycle" (which is my start point before controls - basically my duty cycle map). Just double click those to populate the charts and add the RPM THE same way to see what mine is doing on the high boost IWG BW actuator set at 6 turns from base.

[HarrisRacing]

Found it. White line is boost control output. Notice it's 100% while it spools until it hits my commanded boost number to start open loop control. You can see its pretty linear with RPM to maintain my 18 or so psi boost.

[Full-Race Geoff]

On 8/15/2016 at 8:51 AM, VFRegal said:

got a turbosmart dual port locally. It wouldn't hold boost. So changed EBC to one which can have different duties at different rpm but apparently made no difference on the dyno. Pretty much I don't think tuner likes the turbo .

VFregal - which turbosmart IWG spring and how much preload are you using?  More than likely you need more springs in the IWG actuator..

[Piggaz]

Here is Nicks sheet. 8.9:1, RB 30, 8374 1.05, 260 poncams. Timing on the gears is +1 intake, 0 exhaust. Boost is 25 through the middle and purposely pulled back to 23 psi up top. It's also been held back a tad through the middle. There is definitely more left in this but a few kms needs to be put on it, see what Nick wants and a few touch ups/"customisation" made.

EASILY on 500 RPM earlier on than -5's as a comparison. I won't repeat myself with how it drives, I'll sound like a broken record.

the tuner tried advancing the intake cam to +6 degrees on the intake and all it did was come on SO early it introduced surge. It's not very often of the cam timing having to be relaxed because the turbo is on TOO early! He said this combo on the street would be VERY hard to find. It is the most responsive and torquey GTR he has ever tuned. Maybe he hasn't tuned a stroker/-5 combo ;). He also said if the owner wanted he would like to see a 9180 on it and advance the cam a bit and it wouldn't give away too much.

The Dyno sheet doesn't give any real world indication of how well this thing drives!

So more power down low, extra 40 up high, better transient, and smoother delivery with more left in it. Standard position low mount twins in the bin, EFR for the win!

[HarrisRacing]

^^^^ Please tell me you have some 17-18 psi data!?

I'm assuming E85? I'm glad to start seeing other "real" numbers. I mean this is 620 whp on 25 or so PSI. I am hoping to see 550 whp on my car at the same boost on the 2.75L. I'd love to compare logs to this thing on the street to see how far I have to go.

Also I'm on the Poncam A's (260 and 256 ex) and found that closest to 0-0 made the best results for me too. I tried getting them closer together and it felt "stumpy" in the mid range.

Excellent results!

[Piggaz]

The springs that are in the gates are 16 psi. Minimum boost is 19 or so. The Spring chart that Tial give seems a bit off.

[minesskyline]

1 hour ago, Piggaz said:

Here is Nicks sheet. 8.9:1, RB 30, 8374 1.05, 260 poncams. Timing on the gears is +1 intake, 0 exhaust. Boost is 25 through the middle and purposely pulled back to 23 psi up top. It's also been held back a tad through the middle. There is definitely more left in this but a few kms needs to be put on it, see what Nick wants and a few touch ups/"customisation" made.

EASILY on 500 RPM earlier on than -5's as a comparison. I won't repeat myself with how it drives, I'll sound like a broken record.

the tuner tried advancing the intake cam to +6 degrees on the intake and all it did was come on SO early it introduced surge. It's not very often of the cam timing having to be relaxed because the turbo is on TOO early! He said this combo on the street would be VERY hard to find. It is the most responsive and torquey GTR he has ever tuned. Maybe he hasn't tuned a stroker/-5 combo ;). He also said if the owner wanted he would like to see a 9180 on it and advance the cam a bit and it wouldn't give away too much.

The Dyno sheet doesn't give any real world indication of how well this thing drives!

So more power down low, extra 40 up high, better transient, and smoother delivery with more left in it. Standard position low mount twins in the bin, EFR for the win!

Looks really good. Awesome results. I don't know much about RB30's. How do you think this would compare to a 26/7/8 RB motor instead?

[Mick_o]

59 minutes ago, minesskyline said:

Looks really good. Awesome results. I don't know much about RB30's. How do you think this would compare to a 26/7/8 RB motor instead?

Obviously things like engine compression, cam choice/settings, exhaust size etc would play a part in the response. But lets say a 2.8L (because building a 2.7L is silly lol) would probably be around 2-300rpm laggier worst case scenario i would think ?

 

[Mick_o]

1 hour ago, HarrisRacing said:

^^^^ Please tell me you have some 17-18 psi data!?

I'm assuming E85? I'm glad to start seeing other "real" numbers. I mean this is 620 whp on 25 or so PSI. I am hoping to see 550 whp on my car at the same boost on the 2.75L. I'd love to compare logs to this thing on the street to see how far I have to go.

Also I'm on the Poncam A's (260 and 256 ex) and found that closest to 0-0 made the best results for me too. I tried getting them closer together and it felt "stumpy" in the mid range.

Excellent results!

Yeah thats E85. No logs as the car is still in the shop man lol. 

Your car runs a 3" exhaust doesn't it? If so i honestly think that would be hurting your response a bit and will probably become alot more of an issue when u really start looking to put some more boost into it ?

3.5" minimum would probably help things quite a bit. 

We will try getting some vids up on the weekend when we go for a blast ?

 

[VFRegal]

9 hours ago, Full-Race Geoff said:

VFregal - which turbosmart IWG spring and how much preload are you using?  More than likely you need more springs in the IWG actuator..

Hi Geoff,

19 psi spring combination and about 4 or 5 turns preload. I'd like to try out my more preload but tuner was against it saying it wont make any difference.
I am going to take the car elsewhere it's just waiting on a new gearbox at the moment. Interested on your thoughts on spring size for target boost pressure.

Cheers

Edited August 16, 2016 by VFRegal

[burn4005]

why isn't everyone that runs external gates or a dual port actuator for IWG using a 4 port boost solenoid?

seems like the obvious choice to me. at 100% duty you KNOW the gate is clamped shut.

Edited August 17, 2016 by burn4005

[usmair]

9 hours ago, Piggaz said:

Here is Nicks sheet. 8.9:1, RB 30, 8374 1.05, 260 poncams. Timing on the gears is +1 intake, 0 exhaust. Boost is 25 through the middle and purposely pulled back to 23 psi up top. It's also been held back a tad through the middle. There is definitely more left in this but a few kms needs to be put on it, see what Nick wants and a few touch ups/"customisation" made.

so boost held at 23-25 psi at the moment due to wanting to run the engine in more?

I just dropped mine off to the tuner this morning. Told him to whack 30psi in to the stock motor haha

[Mick_o]

2 minutes ago, usmair said:

so boost held at 23-25 psi at the moment due to wanting to run the engine in more?

I just dropped mine off to the tuner this morning. Told him to whack 30psi in to the stock motor haha

Engine is run in. Boost is currently held back as the speed sensor isn't operating currently so he's kinda capping it there for safety currently. He believes its pretty close to being all in as the most he has seen a 8374 make on his dyno is 480kw i believe he said. 

[usmair]

 

5 minutes ago, Mick_o said:

Engine is run in. Boost is currently held back as the speed sensor isn't operating currently so he's kinda capping it there for safety currently. He believes its pretty close to being all in as the most he has seen a 8374 make on his dyno is 480kw i believe he said. 

interesting. fairly big difference in power on different dynos. ive seen them make 550kw on a dyno.

I'm not sure they would max out on 25psi though. I know of a setup running 32-34 and it made more n more power with every psi up to around 34 psi.

 

[acsplit]

1 minute ago, usmair said:

 

interesting. fairly big difference in power on different dynos. ive seen them make 550kw on a dyno.

I'm not sure they would max out on 25psi though. I know of a setup running 32-34 and it made more n more power with every psi up to around 34 psi.

 

Yeah but it all comes down to engine efficiency.

It's good to see Nick's car with some decent compression rather than the low compression rb's designed for 50 pounds of boost we normally see from Sydney).

[usmair]

1 minute ago, acsplit said:

Yeah but it all comes down to engine efficiency.

It's good to see Nick's car with some decent compression rather than the low compression rb's designed for 50 pounds of boost we normally see from Sydney).

yes i do recall this particular engine was very low comp.

[sneakey pete]

4 hours ago, burn4005 said:

why isn't everyone that runs external gates or a dual port actuator for IWG using a 4 port boost solenoid?

seems like the obvious choice to me. at 100% duty you KNOW the gate is clamped shut.

On that angle, anyone know a supplier of those in Australia?

[burn4005]

45 minutes ago, sneakey pete said:

On that angle, anyone know a supplier of those in Australia?

what do you mean? it's just a 4 port MAC valve. (46A-AA1-JDBA-1BAA)

[/img]

they're 100ish bucks delivered on ebay.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/HI-TEMP-MAC-Boost-Solenoid-Valve-BCS-4-port-AEM-MAC-46A-AA1-JDBA-1BA-NICKEL-/232031631192?hash=item360629b758:g:WrMAAOSw3ydVzVlf

Edited August 17, 2016 by burn4005

[sneakey pete]

Yeah that's the stuff. Trying to see if I can't find one locally before I order that one, lead time is rather large... wiring is supposed to be done before then.